Revelations From a Visible Brake Light

Quick(ish) question.

I am currently driving my son's former car, a 2014 JCW Paceman All4. (I'll be trading it for the SE. My son traded me for my 2018 Subaru BRZ. Just doing my part to keep the fleet fresh.)

As a manual, his All4 has an automatic hold on inclines that prevents the car from rolling for about two seconds, so that the driver can move his foot from the brake to the clutch without the car sliding before clutch release.

Do current manuals have this, and does the SE?

For the record, I lament the skill my son never acquired by learning to drive a manual in this car. There is something very satisfying using both hands and both feet to make a machine work, and manipulating throttle, clutch, brake, stick, wheel, and maybe parking brake to launch up a hill with a tailgater 18" from the back bumper is a great feeling.
 
F14Scott said:
As a manual, his All4 has an automatic hold on inclines that prevents the car from rolling for about two seconds, so that the driver can move his foot from the brake to the clutch without the car sliding before clutch release.

Do current manuals have this, and does the SE?
Click to expand...
The SE will not roll backwards on an incline when it's in Drive and it will not roll forwards on an incline when it's in Reverse. The SE doesn't creep like a car with an automatic transmission does, so on level ground, it stays put (with the brake lights off).

Interestingly, even though the SE doesn't light the brake lights when you're stopped to warn the cars behind you, it does continue making the pedestrian warning sound. Perhaps that's to prevent people focused on their cellphones from walking into your MINI Cooper SE while you're stopped at a crosswalk. I like how Harry Metcalfe demonstrates the pedestrian warning sound's variable frequency at the beginning of his MINI Cooper SE review.
 
Back to the thread.

Did you ever consider a U shaped piece of fiber optic, with one end pointed at the stop light LED and the other facing forward toward the rear view mirror?

I had a '76 Eldorado that had FO repeaters above the front fenders, allowing the driver to see which headlights were energized.

Seems cheap and easy, i.e. exactly my speed...
 
F14Scott said:
Back to the thread.

Did you ever consider a U shaped piece of fiber optic, with one end pointed at the stop light LED and the other facing forward toward the rear view mirror?

I had a '76 Eldorado that had FO repeaters above the front fenders, allowing the driver to see which headlights were energized.

Seems cheap and easy, i.e. exactly my speed...
Click to expand...
Yes, I did consider cutting a clear piece of plastic cut from a Venetian blinds rod I have and heating/bending it into a U-shape (like a piece of macaroni), but I didn't think the duct tape I'd use to hold it in place would give my MINI a good look.

However, I think someone should come up with a "cheap and easy" device like you suggest for testers of EV vehicles to use so they could report on an EV's brake-light behavior.

Harry Metcalfe reported that he followed his son driving the MINI Cooper SE and decided the brake lights flashed on too often. After that, I had to know how sensitive the brake lights really were when regen braking was taking place, so I did my mod that should have taken just a couple of hours but required more than six.

It's difficult to watch the rear-view mirror and the "Performance Display" on the instrument cluster at the same time, but I'm starting to believe that the instant the needle dips down to touch the first yellow CHARGE bar, the brake lights come on.

When my friend with an e-Golf complained he didn't want to go through the process I did, I told him to tape an aluminum-foil pie plate over his third brake light so it reflects the signal into his car's hatch.

Be careful what you wish for:
I wanted to know when my MINI Cooper SE was autonomously (in contrast with brake-pedal activation) illuminating its brake lights, but now I'm becoming too fixated on the situation. When I'm cruising along at a "constant" speed, I find myself often checking the rear-view mirror whenever I let off the accelerator pedal even slightly to see if I let off too much. I try to anticipate when I will have to slow down if the car in front of me looks like it will be slowing down so I can group my brake-light display events. This is not what I thought driving my MINI Cooper SE would be like. However, during spirited driving, I get exactly what I thought driving my MINI would be like--the brake-light activation is entirely appropriate when I'm "pushing" the regen-braking for all it's worth.
 
F14Scott said:
Quick(ish) question.

I am currently driving my son's former car, a 2014 JCW Paceman All4. (I'll be trading it for the SE. My son traded me for my 2018 Subaru BRZ. Just doing my part to keep the fleet fresh.)

As a manual, his All4 has an automatic hold on inclines that prevents the car from rolling for about two seconds, so that the driver can move his foot from the brake to the clutch without the car sliding before clutch release.

Do current manuals have this, and does the SE?

For the record, I lament the skill my son never acquired by learning to drive a manual in this car. There is something very satisfying using both hands and both feet to make a machine work, and manipulating throttle, clutch, brake, stick, wheel, and maybe parking brake to launch up a hill with a tailgater 18" from the back bumper is a great feeling.
Click to expand...

Most modern manuals made in the last 10-15 years have an anti-rollback in 1st gear (sprague clutch) - my Fiesta would have had one had I the foresight to opt for that instead of the abysmal 'power-shift' DSG box that it did come with... (sigh)
 
MichaelC said:
I wonder if the brake light status can be "sniffed" from the OBDII port?

That way, you could use a Bluetooth adapter and mobile app to monitor, rather than checking your rearview.
Click to expand...

...or 15-feet of concealed two-conductor wire run to a dash light with a switch in-line to turn it off when it gets annoying :D
 
insightman said:
The SE will not roll backwards on an incline when it's in Drive and it will not roll forwards on an incline when it's in Reverse. The SE doesn't creep like a car with an automatic transmission does, so on level ground, it stays put (with the brake lights off).
Click to expand...

I know I am a little late in responding to your post, but I am hoping you will be able to assist me anyway.

I have a 2021 MINI SE and normally drive it with the regeneration set to "high" to allow for single-pedal driving in most circumstances. However, often when I get the vehicle stopped at a red light, etc., the car continues to creep forward. This seems to be true even if the stopping point is apparently on level ground (i.e., no apparent reason the car should continue to move). Is there some adjustment (DIY or in the MINI shop) so that this slow creep stops so I can rely more on single-pedal driving? Thanks in advance for your comments.
 
I have the same issue. I have been paying attention to how the cars rolls or not when I come to a stop to try and figure it out. What I find is that if I approach a stop at a slow speed and "creep to a stop", then the brakes might not engage to prevent further rolling. If I instead wait until closer to the stop point and let the car stop "more aggressively", then the auto brakes do engage. Kind of hard to describe. But I'm having more success when coming to a stop more quickly, if that makes any sense.
 
GvilleGuy said:
I have the same issue. I have been paying attention to how the cars rolls or not when I come to a stop to try and figure it out. What I find is that if I approach a stop at a slow speed and "creep to a stop", then the brakes might not engage to prevent further rolling. If I instead wait until closer to the stop point and let the car stop "more aggressively", then the auto brakes do engage. Kind of hard to describe. But I'm having more success when coming to a stop more quickly, if that makes any sense.
Click to expand...

Thanks -- I'll try that too.

I haven't been doing that more "aggressive" approach to single pedal driving since I wonder about a lower range because of the "anticipation" category of the MINI Connect app (where it states, "To decelerate as efficiently as possible, partially release the accelerator pedal first, until the needle on the power display reaches the middle.). I am guessing that using the regeneration "aggressively" for single-pedal driving may exceed some limit of the car in effective regeneration use? Or maybe it is so small, or even zero, that I just shouldn't even think about it anyway.
 
Through my own experimentation, I only find that my mini 'engages' the brakes if I am on a slight incline... on flat it seems to rely on inertia to not move but does not feel like it is using the brakes, and on declines, it certainly hasn't been. Perhaps I too am slowing too gradually if I use regenerative braking. I have gotten in the habit of letting off the pedal and 'covering' the brake to try and catch it with out jerking at a stop... :shrug:
 
Texas22Step said:
I know I am a little late in responding to your post, but I am hoping you will be able to assist me anyway.

I have a 2021 MINI SE and normally drive it with the regeneration set to "high" to allow for single-pedal driving in most circumstances. However, often when I get the vehicle stopped at a red light, etc., the car continues to creep forward. This seems to be true even if the stopping point is apparently on level ground (i.e., no apparent reason the car should continue to move). Is there some adjustment (DIY or in the MINI shop) so that this slow creep stops so I can rely more on single-pedal driving? Thanks in advance for your comments.
Click to expand...

First, there is no "late" in any thread.

The Owners Manual says of the Hold Function:

The system holds the vehicle automatically
when gear is engaged. This prevents rolling
against the direction of travel.

In selector lever position D, the vehicle cannot
roll backwards. In selector lever position
R, it cannot roll forward. The brake
pedal does not have to be pressed.

So the car does nothing to stop you from rolling forward after you come to a stop using regen braking.

In my experience, my SE rolls forward after regenning to a stop only if I'm facing downhill. Thanks to the low friction of the wheel bearings, it doesn't take much of a gradient to cause forward rolling. I'm certain there is no motivation from my SE's motor causing the car to creep forward.

The presence of a slight downhill gradient can be verified while riding a bicycle. Perhaps the OBD wizards can find the code that indicates when power is being sent to the motor. That could be another way to verify there no programmed creeping.

I want to know what is keeping my SE from rolling backwards on a hill. If it was the brakes, wouldn't the brake light be illuminated? We now know that the brake system is just an old-fashioned vacuum system that replaces the manifold-pressure vacuum with an electric vacuum pump. So wouldn't the brake lights be activated if the brakes were used to prevent rolling backwards? I believe it's the motor resisting rolling against the direction of travel.

When stopped at a stoplight. one of my favorite things to do is see how slowly I can creep forward using the slightest possible pressure on the accelerator pedal. I try to advance so slowly that the car behind that stopped just inches away won't notice I'm moving and pull closer again.
 
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Just a comment here, I wouldn't be at a stop without my foot on the break anyway. I was told this for all EVs just in case there is an accident you don't want the car accidentally rolling forward more than needed.

For most driving my regen is enough to get me to a stop. I do use the break for a proper stop as stated already. No issues with creeping when I do a more of a barely stop though.
 
Whatever it is keeping the Mini (and other EVs) from rolling, I cannot begin to express my gratitude to the engineers for providing those systems after living with an Audi e-tron. That 6000 lb SUV rolls freely (no creep mode) at maximum speed on inclines in either direction regardless of the selected gear. It's a major oversight and dangerous design flaw that has scared the ever living crap out of me on several occasions.

The Mini SE drive behavior is an absolute dream in comparison.
 
polyphonic said:
Whatever it is keeping the Mini (and other EVs) from rolling, I cannot begin to express my gratitude to the engineers for providing those systems after living with an Audi e-tron. That 6000 lb SUV rolls freely (no creep mode) at maximum speed on inclines in either direction regardless of the selected gear. It's a major oversight and dangerous design flaw that has scared the ever living crap out of me on several occasions.

The Mini SE drive behavior is an absolute dream in comparison.
Click to expand...
Screen Shot 2021-05-18 at 13.46.13.webp
 
Lainey said:
Just a comment here, I wouldn't be at a stop without my foot on the break anyway. I was told this for all EVs just in case there is an accident you don't want the car accidentally rolling forward more than needed.

For most driving my regen is enough to get me to a stop. I do use the break for a proper stop as stated already. No issues with creeping when I do a more of a barely stop though.
Click to expand...
Also, you have to keep the brake pedal depressed because that's the only way to illuminate the brake lights to alert drivers coming up behind you (just looking up from their phones) that you are stopped.
 
insightman said:
Also, you have to keep the brake pedal depressed because that's the only way to illuminate the brake lights to alert drivers coming up behind you (just looking up from their phones) that you are stopped.
Click to expand...

That's a little unconcerning as I hardly use the brakes when stopped. Comes my previous car which has Brake Hold which hold the brakes for you at lights but does keep the brake lights on. I wish this was a toggle to keep the brake lights on when not in park and fully stopped.
 
LJKelley said:
That's a little unconcerning as I hardly use the brakes when stopped. Comes my previous car which has Brake Hold which hold the brakes for you at lights but does keep the brake lights on. I wish this was a toggle to keep the brake lights on when not in park and fully stopped.
Click to expand...
At least now you know you're not visually broadcasting your stationary status to those drivers who are actually looking through their windshields. It was a surprise to me, too.
 
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