I believe that it did kick on at 2 bars, but I was going 75 or 80 with the ac on up a very steep hill. I think that it kicked on at 2 bars, quickly went down to 1 bar, then screamed like crazy, I cut off the ac, slowed down, put on the hazards; and hit ev charge. The hill continued to be in front of me, and I went through the last bar quickly.
My terrible morning with the Clarity
- Thread starter Geor99
- Start date
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It’s going to have to throw a code for any warranty work to begin.
I also was using the cruise control. It slams the gas when going uphill, if you are not at the cruise speed. This is probably why it killed the last bars. I had the LCC on 80 or so and it slammed the gas to get there going up the hill.
I commute daily 50 miles and completely deplete and charge the Traction battery twice a day every day.
I drive all EV miles until I'm left with about 5-10 miles on the GOM.
When you switch to HV mode, whatever the EV range is at the time of HV mode is engaged, that's what the computer will try to maintain.
So, if you engage at 15miles on the GOM, the computer will do everything it can to maintain that.
Anything over 70mph, it will really struggle to maintain that. the Traction motor is really out of its efficacy range when your above 65mph.
If this happens again, follow these steps to be safe:
1. Slow down to about 60-65mph and set cruise control
2. Enable HV Charge
3. Enable eco mode
4. Once you have 5+ miles on the GOM, disable charge mode and run HV
Worked every time (3-4 times) when I intentionally depleted the battery to find ways of overcoming the ANGRY BEE'S!
I drive all EV miles until I'm left with about 5-10 miles on the GOM.
When you switch to HV mode, whatever the EV range is at the time of HV mode is engaged, that's what the computer will try to maintain.
So, if you engage at 15miles on the GOM, the computer will do everything it can to maintain that.
Anything over 70mph, it will really struggle to maintain that. the Traction motor is really out of its efficacy range when your above 65mph.
If this happens again, follow these steps to be safe:
1. Slow down to about 60-65mph and set cruise control
2. Enable HV Charge
3. Enable eco mode
4. Once you have 5+ miles on the GOM, disable charge mode and run HV
Worked every time (3-4 times) when I intentionally depleted the battery to find ways of overcoming the ANGRY BEE'S!
It's remembering, which stung me
. I've remembered 99.99% of the time
Like another poster said, I would never loan my car to anyone; for anything over over 30 miles , unless I could beat this entire button push time/when/how long/etc into their heat exhaustively
Id probably beat into their head to always hit hv when starting the car, no matter what.
. I've remembered 99.99% of the timeLike another poster said, I would never loan my car to anyone; for anything over over 30 miles , unless I could beat this entire button push time/when/how long/etc into their heat exhaustively
Id probably beat into their head to always hit hv when starting the car, no matter what.
I am so confused on everything being said on the Honda Clarity. It is a plug in hybrid. It does not require the battery charged... ever. With no battery charge, it will still drive as a normal gas hybrid car and while the power may be a bit less than on EV mode, it will still maintain freeway speeds with gas only. If it does not, SOMETHING IS LIKELY WRONG WITH THE ENGINE, FUEL PUMP OR ACCELERATOR PEDAL FAILURE. Also, using the engine to charge up the battery while driving is very inefficient and costs MORE to drive. Just drive the car in EV/hybrid normal mode and let the engine switch over to hybrid when the battery is depleted. Delaying battery use may give you a bit more pep up hills, but your overall economy will suffer accordingly. It has a 1.5l motor that while small, offers plenty of power for everyday driving. If you want more power up hills, conserve the battery until your climb begins.
Sorry man, if you just drive the car in ev mode and you depend on the car to switch to hv mode when the battery gets low- generally when you get to 2 bars; you will potentially be very disappointed with the performance.
As described in my original post, if this happens to occur at the base of a tall, sleep incline at free way speeds (with the AC on for good measure you can certainly blow through your 2 bars of EV to a single bar. Then, it doesn't take a whole lot on a steep incline to burn through that last ev bar.
Then the clarity becomes a loud engine reving sound maker with virtually no power whatsoever . I don't believe that my car has anything wrong with it. I just so happen to hit a corner case of a corner case.
I'm just trying to encourage people to make sure that they hit the ev button before 2 ev bars makes its appearance.
In certain corner cases, 2 bars of EV is simply not enough to power the clarity through to road less demanding, where it can both power the car and do some battery charging.
Just trying to help the community. And with some bad luck, this could result in an accident and possibly your death. IF you are trying to change lanes on the freeway at a high speed and lose most or all power, disaster could occur. Will this happen? The odds are probably super low; but I want people to at least be aware of this.
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As described in my original post, if this happens to occur at the base of a tall, sleep incline at free way speeds (with the AC on for good measure
you can certainly blow through your 2 bars of EV to a single bar. Then, it doesn't take a whole lot on a steep incline to burn through that last ev bar.Then the clarity becomes a loud engine reving sound maker with virtually no power whatsoever . I don't believe that my car has anything wrong with it. I just so happen to hit a corner case of a corner case.
I'm just trying to encourage people to make sure that they hit the ev button before 2 ev bars makes its appearance.
In certain corner cases, 2 bars of EV is simply not enough to power the clarity through to road less demanding, where it can both power the car and do some battery charging.
Just trying to help the community. And with some bad luck, this could result in an accident and possibly your death. IF you are trying to change lanes on the freeway at a high speed and lose most or all power, disaster could occur. Will this happen? The odds are probably super low; but I want people to at least be aware of this.
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I think you are missing the main difference between traditional hybrids and the Clarity. That 1.5L Engine does not connect to the wheels directly like a traditional hybrid, unless you are at highway speeds and in ideal conditions.
Anything under 60, it's only going provide additional Electricity to the electric traction motor in-line with the traction battery. Something like 90% of the Wheel Horsepower is from the electric traction motor, not the 1.5L ICE.
Most traditional hybrids are the opposite. The ICE provides 90% of the HP driving the wheels thru a traditional 4-6 speed or CVT transmission and the electric Motor+Battery provides the additional 10%.
Anything under 60, it's only going provide additional Electricity to the electric traction motor in-line with the traction battery. Something like 90% of the Wheel Horsepower is from the electric traction motor, not the 1.5L ICE.
Most traditional hybrids are the opposite. The ICE provides 90% of the HP driving the wheels thru a traditional 4-6 speed or CVT transmission and the electric Motor+Battery provides the additional 10%.
PHEV Newbie
Well-Known Member
Unfortunately, the Clarity requires some study to get the best experience out of it. The first issue is that Honda used it as kind of an experimental platform to learn how to build green vehicles with maximum efficiency (remember the BEV and fuel cell versions?). That's why they put in their 1.5 litre Atkinson Cycle engine instead of a 2.0 litre (which they already had and would fit in the Clarity). The smaller engine maximizes fuel economy in hybrid mode and the big traction battery can fill in the power deficits of the engine. That's the problem. Without full battery power, the tiny engine is way underpowered. You would be fine in city driving or cruising on a flat highway at 65 mph but you're screwed if you're going up a hill or trying to pass someone. The Clarity engine can produce only 103 hp at near redline (i.e., engine screaming). That's nothing for an over 2 ton car and it's unclear what the output is at the wheels are after the losses in generating the electricity to power the electric motor. For perspective, a Toyota Corolla puts out 169 hp for a car that weighs more than 1000 pounds less than the Clarity and no one calls a Corolla fast. Honda programming is very conservative to protect the battery. Even before the battery is down to two bars (if in HV mode), it will prioritize engine power (running at high rpm) to protect and conserve the battery. What does this mean? Lithium ion batteries are very tempermental. They like to be at around room temperature and at 50% state of charge. The farther you move from these conditions, the greater the battery degradation, especially if the battery is charging and/or discharging (i.e., hybrid mode). Using a battery to 0% and then charging to 100% kills battery life the fastest. That's why PHEVs and BEVs build in a buffer at the bottom and top (you can never charge to the actual 100% nor discharge to the actual 0% like you can with your phone). But the buffer is not that big so that's why car companies tell you to charge BEVs to only 80% for everyday driving and to charge before 20%. This would be good practice for your Clarity too but make sure you charge to 100% at least once a month for cell balancing. In addition, I think it's super important to switch to HV mode when the battery is at 50% unless you know you can get to your destination well before two bars and you can charge there. The first reason is battery longevity. Your battery is constantly charging and discharging in HV mode so doing that at 100% or two bars is bad for the battery. The second reason is power. At 50% and above, your battery will provide full battery power in HV mode when you need it (like hills and passing). From my experience, Honda programming reduces battery power to the HV system at about 30-40% and gives you less and less the more it gets depleted. Remember, full battery power will give you maximum 120 hp on the electric motor but 232 ft lb or torque. That's why EV mode feels peppy in town. To get the full 180 hp, you need the engine running hard and full power from the battery combined. Thus, when the battery depletes, you SOL in hybrid mode if you need any sort of power. BTW, the Clarity is rated at 212 hp but it's virtually impossible to get that kind of output.
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When the ICE isn’t directly driving the wheels it is generating electricity and sending it to the electric motor. The ICE/generator is capable of producing enough electricity for the motor to output about 60hp.
A 4200lb car requires about 50hp to the wheels to maintain a speed of 50mph up a 6% grade. It requires 30ho to the wheels ti maintain a speed of 70mph on flat terrain.
There’s no way on God’s green Earth that a properly functioning Clarity should become powerless and strand a driver, simply because the battery is down to 2 bars. I drove more than 80 miles on I-5 through the hilly terrain of Northern California with the battery at 2 bars. It never went to 1 bar and I maintained speeds of 65-70mph the entire time. I’ve driven over some lesser passes in southern Oregon under the same conditions, with the same results.
There’s something seriously wrong with the cars that behave as reported by some owners. The problem is, if the car isn’t throwing a code there isn’t much an owner or dealer can do.
Sorry man, if you just drive the car in ev mode and you depend on the car to switch to hv mode when the battery gets low- generally when you get to 2 bars; you will potentially be very disappointed with the performance.
As described in my original post, if this happens to occur at the base of a tall, sleep incline at free way speeds (with the AC on for good measure you can certainly blow through your 2 bars of EV to a single bar. Then, it doesn't take a whole lot on a steep incline to burn through that last ev bar.
Then the clarity becomes a loud engine reving sound maker with virtually no power whatsoever . I don't believe that my car has anything wrong with it. I just so happen to hit a corner case of a corner case.
I'm just trying to encourage people to make sure that they hit the ev button before 2 ev bars makes its appearance.
In certain corner cases, 2 bars of EV is simply not enough to power the clarity through to road less demanding, where it can both power the car and do some battery charging.
Just trying to help the community. Xx
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As described in my original post, if this happens to occur at the base of a tall, sleep incline at free way speeds (with the AC on for good measure
you can certainly blow through your 2 bars of EV to a single bar. Then, it doesn't take a whole lot on a steep incline to burn through that last ev bar.Then the clarity becomes a loud engine reving sound maker with virtually no power whatsoever . I don't believe that my car has anything wrong with it. I just so happen to hit a corner case of a corner case.
I'm just trying to encourage people to make sure that they hit the ev button before 2 ev bars makes its appearance.
In certain corner cases, 2 bars of EV is simply not enough to power the clarity through to road less demanding, where it can both power the car and do some battery charging.
Just trying to help the community. Xx
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Are you calling me a liar
. ? I'm kidding , but Believe me, it happened and it got my heart racing like an angry bees ClarityYou say there's no way in hell it happened? I'm telling you that it did, and the car has worked normally since. I don't remember my speed, but I could have been going as fast as 85 before I realized that I forgot to hit the button, with the AC running and 2 devices pulling 25 watts each off of the cigarette lighter. Probably closer to 75 but faster is possible.
I was in efficiency mode and not sport, if that matters, headlights on.
What I said and what you claim I said are two completely different statements.
I’ve also said that the battery display on our car never showed less than 2 bars and that the car never lost power while the car was driven in what I believe were similar or more challenging conditions than what you’ve described.
So, based on my experience with our car, and some known figures for power requirements under certain conditions, I’d say there’s something wrong with your car.
Not to argue but you said: There’s no way on God’s green Earth that a properly functioning Clarity should become powerless and strand a driver, simply because the battery is down to 2 bars.
You're correct that it won't at 2 bars, but it can go from 2 to 0 in 60 seconds or less under the wrong circumstances.
My car functions as it always has. I get roughly the same mileage as always. 2 bars is not a lot when you hit a fairly steep freeway hill with the AC on.
This doesn't happen every day, if was a corner case. I'd be willing to bet that most Clarities would perform as mine did.
I'm not trying to argue. I'm here to report what happened for others to learn from. I believe that it can result in a dangerous situation, if you are totally unaware of this possibility. Maybe I am completely wasting my time, or maybe I am helping a reader immensely when this occurs to them or if it helps preventing it from happening.
I firmly believe that this will happen to most if not all Clarities under smiliar situations. I don't hate the car. I actually like the car. It's just that it can brick under rare circumstances that people should try to avoid like the plague.
Telling people that there is something wrong with my car and that this won't happen to other people in similar situations is a dangerous thing to tell people. I believe it to be false and dangerous information. I can't prove it, but I strongly suspect it.
You are probably on this forum to share your experiences to help people as well. Perhaps you have been in similar situations, and the car didn't brick. I doubt that you have been in a similar situation enough times to say with certainly that it won't happen in the vast majority of Clarities.
Perhaps I have less battery life than you do. No 2 batteries will have the exact same life. You can not take your experiences and mine, and come to the conclusion that my experience is the rare case and your's is the norm. You don't have enough data to make that statement.
I can state that my story may very well be common under similar situations. It's much safer to assume that my statement is accurate than to ignore it assuming my car is defective.
You're correct that it won't at 2 bars, but it can go from 2 to 0 in 60 seconds or less under the wrong circumstances.
My car functions as it always has. I get roughly the same mileage as always. 2 bars is not a lot when you hit a fairly steep freeway hill with the AC on.
This doesn't happen every day, if was a corner case. I'd be willing to bet that most Clarities would perform as mine did.
I'm not trying to argue. I'm here to report what happened for others to learn from. I believe that it can result in a dangerous situation, if you are totally unaware of this possibility. Maybe I am completely wasting my time, or maybe I am helping a reader immensely when this occurs to them or if it helps preventing it from happening.
I firmly believe that this will happen to most if not all Clarities under smiliar situations. I don't hate the car. I actually like the car. It's just that it can brick under rare circumstances that people should try to avoid like the plague.
Telling people that there is something wrong with my car and that this won't happen to other people in similar situations is a dangerous thing to tell people. I believe it to be false and dangerous information. I can't prove it, but I strongly suspect it.
You are probably on this forum to share your experiences to help people as well. Perhaps you have been in similar situations, and the car didn't brick. I doubt that you have been in a similar situation enough times to say with certainly that it won't happen in the vast majority of Clarities.
Perhaps I have less battery life than you do. No 2 batteries will have the exact same life. You can not take your experiences and mine, and come to the conclusion that my experience is the rare case and your's is the norm. You don't have enough data to make that statement.
I can state that my story may very well be common under similar situations. It's much safer to assume that my statement is accurate than to ignore it assuming my car is defective.
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I know what I said. Thank you for confirming.
Read again what you claim I said and see if you can understand that I did not say what you have claimed I said.
Robert_Alabama
Well-Known Member
I would say in general that you are asking for a bad experience to run the Clarity battery to depletion and drive for very far on the ICE. At best, you are very likely to get noisy high RPM behavior, at worst you need power that you don't have with the battery depleted. By the way, the Clarity isn't the only PHEV that this can happen to. I had a first generation Chevrolet Volt (2012) that would throw messages on the dashboard display that "Propulsion Power Reduced" after battery depletion. Engine noise seemed louder than the Clarity, and the Volt would struggle to get above 55 mph. I traded that Volt in 2019 and it was a great car, but it taught me to avoid this outcome.
Dan Albrich
Well-Known Member
I'll add some more thoughts for discussion:
- I suspect that my Clarity had some damage before I received it, maybe as simple as sitting on a lot for months with a dead traction battery, so I started, from new seeing some behaviors that are now more common with older Clarities. When the traction battery degrades, it also effects the buffer. I believe exhausting the buffer is what causes anamalous behavior (power loss). I can avoid it with some active monitoring of my EV range. I doubt I can get my dealer to help me short of some sort of recall; they have not been generally helpful or good in any regard.
- I think there's an incident risk that causes this behavior to become worse. I simply mean if you allow this issue to occur, it may become more likely to re-occur. I can't land this one with data to back it up, save reading many reports online spanning a few years. So take this point or leave it as you please. But I do suspect, taking some care to avoid the buffer loss is reasonable.
- The one thing I have witnessed, repeatedly and I try not to do it, but if I floor it when in high-speed traffic, maybe already going 65 or more mph, to overtake, my car losses acceleration. There's a point where depressing the gas pedal increases speed, and if you "over do it" it feels like a gear that skips or is missing some teeth, and the car slows down. If I re-apply the gas more gently, I can get it to "grab" again. It's bad enough that I endeavor not to let it happen. Here in Western Oregon I never need to do this. but short on/off ramps in Arizona and Utah (for example) combined with people going 90mph, cause me to try and accelerate too quickly. So this literally never happens when I'm home in Oregon, and its difficult to avoid when I'm in places with posted speed limits of 75 combined with short on-ramps. The more I've had this issue occur, it seems the easier it is to get re-occurance. So don't intentionally do this. And yep, I suspect these issues are all connected and have to do with an inability for the car to get enough power to the electric motor under certain conditions. i.e. doing things like turning off AC, Heat, or other power draws does seem to help the car maintain power. I notice this later scenario (turning off heat for example) when I'm home in Oregon, winter time, and I let EV go to 0 accidentally.
- I'll add, I still like the car (if I can keep it running acceptably). I find its efficiency using EV or high mpg gas very helpful cost-wise when gas prices are high. I do find myself spending more skull sweat managing the car these days then when new. Accidentally hitting 0 EV is much easier now that years have passed, and the traction battery has less capacity. My winter range is just 20 miles now. BTW, my AH reading is still 43.02 so not getting down to 36.6 warranty yet.
- I suspect that my Clarity had some damage before I received it, maybe as simple as sitting on a lot for months with a dead traction battery, so I started, from new seeing some behaviors that are now more common with older Clarities. When the traction battery degrades, it also effects the buffer. I believe exhausting the buffer is what causes anamalous behavior (power loss). I can avoid it with some active monitoring of my EV range. I doubt I can get my dealer to help me short of some sort of recall; they have not been generally helpful or good in any regard.
- I think there's an incident risk that causes this behavior to become worse. I simply mean if you allow this issue to occur, it may become more likely to re-occur. I can't land this one with data to back it up, save reading many reports online spanning a few years. So take this point or leave it as you please. But I do suspect, taking some care to avoid the buffer loss is reasonable.
- The one thing I have witnessed, repeatedly and I try not to do it, but if I floor it when in high-speed traffic, maybe already going 65 or more mph, to overtake, my car losses acceleration. There's a point where depressing the gas pedal increases speed, and if you "over do it" it feels like a gear that skips or is missing some teeth, and the car slows down. If I re-apply the gas more gently, I can get it to "grab" again. It's bad enough that I endeavor not to let it happen. Here in Western Oregon I never need to do this. but short on/off ramps in Arizona and Utah (for example) combined with people going 90mph, cause me to try and accelerate too quickly. So this literally never happens when I'm home in Oregon, and its difficult to avoid when I'm in places with posted speed limits of 75 combined with short on-ramps. The more I've had this issue occur, it seems the easier it is to get re-occurance. So don't intentionally do this. And yep, I suspect these issues are all connected and have to do with an inability for the car to get enough power to the electric motor under certain conditions. i.e. doing things like turning off AC, Heat, or other power draws does seem to help the car maintain power. I notice this later scenario (turning off heat for example) when I'm home in Oregon, winter time, and I let EV go to 0 accidentally.
- I'll add, I still like the car (if I can keep it running acceptably). I find its efficiency using EV or high mpg gas very helpful cost-wise when gas prices are high. I do find myself spending more skull sweat managing the car these days then when new. Accidentally hitting 0 EV is much easier now that years have passed, and the traction battery has less capacity. My winter range is just 20 miles now. BTW, my AH reading is still 43.02 so not getting down to 36.6 warranty yet.
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