MSRP divided by max range = cost per mile.

IMO, that's a rather useless metric... It completely ignores the significantly reduced cost of ownership of EVs. With my costs, my MINI is $0.14 less per mile than a gas car. Doesn't seem like much until you multiply it by 15,000mi per year and multiple years of savings.

Include the cost per mile of fuel/electricity and the result will look a lot different..
 
I agree but when you write for the oil & gas industry you need to put ICE vehicles in the best light as possible. In Europe, petrol prices can be in the $7.50USD+/gal range so there are significant savings with electric. Would be nice to get $3.42USD/gal premium at Sam's Club in Dallas, TX.

Perhaps we need to get a $1,000 electric kickscooter with 40 miles of range. That's an easy $25/mile.
 
I'm trying to imagine for whom MAXIMUM miles/$ is important, but can't really think of anyone.

The poorest? Not really... how far you can go per $ might matter, but not the max range before you have to refill the tank of your (cheapest-possible-yet-still-running) ICE vehicle.

The richest? Nah, cost is irrelevant.

The middle class? Perhaps, but only if 1) routinely traveling longer distances on a regular basis, and 2) saving $$ is much more important than other factors. Otherwise, who cares? Anybody with a reasonable amount of disposable income will choose to upgrade to the next tier of vehicles.

TL,DR: it's a dumb calculation.
 
I think it’s important metric for determining value per battery mile for someone in a single car household. You can’t have an EV as your only car in most households because of some weird metrics.
 
“With a range of more than 200 miles, the typical EV should now be able to meet the daily needs of most U.S. households”

Right… because most US households cover 73,000 miles per year just in daily driving needs…
 
Jim Matthews said:
There's lies, damned lies and statistics.

What matters to car buyers is total cost of ownership.
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What mattered to this car buyer was the driving experience. The unexpectedly low price of the MINI Cooper SE I'd been waiting and saving for since 2009's MINI-E was a bonus. A used 2008 Tesla roadster just sold for more than $250,000. Except for a used Tesla Roadster, there's no other small, sporty EV at any price that can provide the kind of fun I have in my SE. I doubt the collector who bought that Tesla with 840 miles on the odo will even drive it.
 
insightman said:
What mattered to this car buyer was the driving experience. The unexpectedly low price of the MINI Cooper SE I'd been waiting and saving for since 2009's MINI-E was a bonus. A used 2008 Tesla roadster just sold for more than $250,000. Except for a used Tesla Roadster, there's no other small, sporty EV at any price that can provide the kind of fun I have in my SE. I doubt the collector who bought that Tesla with 840 miles on the odo will even drive it.
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I remember seeing one street parked years ago in SF and wondering what it was like to have the wallet to drive one, now I know it’s a hefty one, wow!

I wonder if there will be any thing again like the mini EV since the tax credit talk is moving to larger and bigger US made vehicles . I’m glad the GF bought hers and enjoys slamming the accelerator… we almost test drove a leaf .
 
AndysComputer said:
“With a range of more than 200 miles, the typical EV should now be able to meet the daily needs of most U.S. households”

Right… because most US households cover 73,000 miles per year just in daily driving needs…
Click to expand...

Yes, but the first time you need to go to a neighboring city and don’t have time to delay for a -10*F 23kW DC fast charge (when it should max at 50*F in ideal conditions) it’ll remind you why it can’t be your only car.

We’ve been promised an unsustainable level of convenience from the ICE car, and it’s going to be hard to ever step back from those conveniences. People view my daily Sonic’s “275-300 mile city range” as short …
 
Urbanengineer said:
Yes, but the first time you need to go to a neighboring city and don’t have time to delay for a -10*F 23kW DC fast charge (when it should max at 50*F in ideal conditions) it’ll remind you why it can’t be your only car.
Click to expand...
I've actually done exactly that, except it was -25 ºF. The cold-soaked batteries added about 15 minutes to my charge, and then the batteries were warmed enough to get close to 50 kW. DC Fast charge warms batteries up pretty quickly. :)
 
Urbanengineer said:
I think it’s important metric for determining value per battery mile for someone in a single car household. You can’t have an EV as your only car in most households because of some weird metrics.
Click to expand...

Agreed, even though I'm single and always travel solo I will likely keep my 2011 Outback for travel/weather conditions beyond the capabilities of the Mini. Besides the EV part, the reason I will purchase a Mini is for the fun factor. It doesn't and will not pencil out for me.
 
Urbanengineer said:
Yes, but the first time you need to go to a neighboring city and don’t have time to delay for a -10*F 23kW DC fast charge (when it should max at 50*F in ideal conditions) it’ll remind you why it can’t be your only car.
Click to expand...

I agree it is highly unlikely to be the only car for well the vast majority of the world. After all, daily use is one thing but occasionally, even if only rarely, we need to cover a few hundred miles.
But that is not how the article was phrased. They said ppl need 200 miles for their daily driver and much more if their only vehicle due to road trips etc. I disagree with the sentiment that people (or at least 99% of people) need in excess of 200 miles of range for their daily needs. Even in extreme cold and a real world range of half of that, so 100 miles in reality, is fat in excess of what most people need for their daily use. Most people do not cover 36,500 miles per year in their daily driver, only a third of that in fact.
So I take issue with this report because it is creating unnecessary range anxiety and giving the impression that EVs are not practical because people *need* far more range than they actually do.
No, the Mini is not a road tripping car, it’s even inconvenient if there are charges spaced close enough to do any kind of inter city trip because you drive on the highway for 80 minutes then need 40 minutes of charging. Not ideal. However something like a Tesla can cover a 10.5 hour drive with only an additional hour of charging (I know because I have done it) which is perfect to fit into two bathroom stops and a lunch stop. So it doesn’t take any longer than a gas car to do the same trip (again, I’ve done the same trip in both).
But not everyone makes those kinds of drives. The Mini could be my wife’s only vehicle, as she won’t drive more than an hour away and would fly the 10 hour road trip. But she’s an exception.
Equally not many Americans are a single car family so again the concept of the Mini being the only car is moot.
 
AndysComputer said:
I agree it is highly unlikely to be the only car for well the vast majority of the world. After all, daily use is one thing but occasionally, even if only rarely, we need to cover a few hundred miles.
But that is not how the article was phrased. They said ppl need 200 miles for their daily driver and much more if their only vehicle due to road trips etc. I disagree with the sentiment that people (or at least 99% of people) need in excess of 200 miles of range for their daily needs. Even in extreme cold and a real world range of half of that, so 100 miles in reality, is fat in excess of what most people need for their daily use. Most people do not cover 36,500 miles per year in their daily driver, only a third of that in fact.
So I take issue with this report because it is creating unnecessary range anxiety and giving the impression that EVs are not practical because people *need* far more range than they actually do.
No, the Mini is not a road tripping car, it’s even inconvenient if there are charges spaced close enough to do any kind of inter city trip because you drive on the highway for 80 minutes then need 40 minutes of charging. Not ideal. However something like a Tesla can cover a 10.5 hour drive with only an additional hour of charging (I know because I have done it) which is perfect to fit into two bathroom stops and a lunch stop. So it doesn’t take any longer than a gas car to do the same trip (again, I’ve done the same trip in both).
But not everyone makes those kinds of drives. The Mini could be my wife’s only vehicle, as she won’t drive more than an hour away and would fly the 10 hour road trip. But she’s an exception.
Equally not many Americans are a single car family so again the concept of the Mini being the only car is moot.
Click to expand...

My average daily distance is something like 25mi but that is a poor representation of my typical car usage. Sizing range for the once a year road trip is dumb but sizing based on average usage is also bad. A car should be able to handle typical usage which for many (especially those not in cities) means larger ranges closer to or above 200mi.

I regularly (multiple times a month) drive 100-150mi to destinations that will most likely never have charging infrastructure (national forest). These places are fairly remote with minimal or no cell service and are not somewhere you want to be pushing range limits. Throw in some off-road, cold and/or some kayaks on the roof and 200mi range might not be enough for an only car for me. When I eventually replace my wife's gas car with an EV, it'll need at least a ~250mi range as the primary car even though she drives around 6mi per day.

This is not unusual for a huge percentage of the US. 20% of the US is officially rural but there are a lot more people like me who live in urban areas but need their cars for longer trips for recreational activities.

Lower range cars absolutely have their place in cities or as a 2nd car but your 99% under 200mi is vastly overestimated. And just because most households have multiple cars (~60%) doesn't mean much since the primary car ideally should also be an EV.
 
I agree it’s hard for the only or main or longest range vehicle to be an EV when in my view that requires a vehicle with at least 3 hours of highway driving range and reliable 30 minute 10-80% charging rates as frankly at the moment that means a “long range” Tesla of some description which means the wrong side of $50,000. And that is simply not mass market.
As for what “daily use” means, to me that’s your commute, fetching groceries, going to the mall or whatever. And Americans do not need 200 miles of range for that.
We have a habit of projecting our own use as speaking for the majority when transport stats prove that people do not make trips as often as some think they do.
Your several times per month trips of 200 miles to the middle of nowhere (charger wise) are important to you but not necessarily to everyone else. That said… in a single car household I absolutely would expect an EV to be able to handle it worth our stress, which as you point out means an honest 250 mile range. And those cars are too pricey for most people at the moment.
As for inter-city work, I think something like a Chevy Bolt is a fine choice, 220+ mile range, I’d be happy with that as my only vehicle as driving from Dallas to Austin or even Dallas to Albuquerque would be do-able, the latter taking a little longer than I’d like but if I only did it say twice per year I could live with that.

Personally I suspect a large percentage of the market could live with a 160 mile range EV as their literal daily driver and these could be bought fairly cheap, as in under $30k. Infrequent longer trips by road (which due to restrictive amounts of vacation days) would be best served by renting a long range EV. Of course people don’t buy cars in a financially smart way (and I include myself in that as we have the LR Tesla in addition to our Mini when in reality I can’t justify the Tesla financially as I just don’t need it’s range nearly as frequently as I like to imagine I do) and instead do buy a vehicle for the 1 or 2 times per year that they need it’s capability, or worst still overpay for a capability they will never need but like to imagine they will.
 
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