KiwiME
Well-Known Member
As best as I can determine the dash indicates DC power. As such it ignores on-board charge efficiency, which is not particularly good.
Mike's wife's monthly Kona EV efficiency report
- Thread starter navguy12
- Start date
- Replies 195
- Views 43K
navguy12
Well-Known Member
I’ve always been an advocate of eliminating all “road” taxes on any energy type.I came to the same conclusion. As the price of gas keeps going up it is getting even less than 2 litres.There are issues which will need to be addressed at some point, like EV drivers don't pay road taxes collected at the gas pumps to fix pot holes. But the Ont. Govt. is so eager to be reelected, does not worry about pot holes. Actually they are repaying some 'pot hole taxes', collected already for license plate stickers.
So let's not try to explain to their kind the 20% difference between your calculations and mine.
The “road” taxes should be covered by a simple formula, namely GVWR and kms driven per year. Have a matrix set up and regardless of vehicle type or propulsion type, that is what the yearly plate sticker fee would be…but wait, (temporarily) there are no plate sticker fees (in Ontario)
In that case, an argument can be made that “roads” should be funded via general revenue (income taxes). Even people who don’t own a vehicle enjoy a first world lifestyle via goods and services they use/consume that have arrived via use of the “road” network.
Lars
Well-Known Member
I’ve always been an advocate of eliminating all “road” taxes on any energy type.
The “road” taxes should be covered by a simple formula, namely GVWR and kms driven per year. Have a matrix set up and regardless of vehicle type or propulsion type, that is what the yearly plate sticker fee would be…but wait, (temporarily) there are no plate sticker fees (in Ontario)
In that case, an argument can be made that “roads” should be funded via general revenue (income taxes). Even people who don’t own a vehicle enjoy a first world lifestyle via goods and services they use/consume that have arrived via use of the “road” network.
There is more than one way to skin a cat. I like your first suggestion. It would also cover the road use by truck(s) carrying the 70" TV. etc... from source to destination.
Lars
Well-Known Member
You are making sense. My AC source = 240V * 30A => 7,2kW. The 5.7kW (AC) indicated by the car is ~ 25% less. I doubt that there is an actual 25% loss in the conversion. This seems too high to me. There are likely other 'fine variables' involved. Like as the battery reaches 70%+ the charger (energy absorption) may slow down. I never bothered to check/observe this. But again we are talking about pennies/100km.
navguy12
Well-Known Member
In both our EVs, the “loss” patterns are the same.
In cold weather months with little travel, the difference between what the car says was uploaded and what the inline meters say was pushed, increases.
In warm weather with lots of travel, that difference narrows.
For my wife’s Kona EV, the lifetime average is 20%.
Rob Fitzgerald
Member
Saw a post elsewhere about an announcement from the Green Party that they would instate a $10k rebate at the provincial level. Boy that would be swell.I came to the same conclusion. As the price of gas keeps going up it is getting even less than 2 litres.
So let's not try to explain to their kind the 20% difference between your calculations and mine.
navguy12
Well-Known Member
Unfortunately, my brother created it years ago as it is way above my computer skills and he doesn’t want me sharing it.
Sorry.
Edit: however, I could explain the layout if that would help. Let me know if that would interest you and next time my laptop computer is on and I have some spare time I’ll post a short explanation. Cheers.
navguy12
Well-Known Member
June 2022 results:
Summary costs as of 30 June 2022:
Total operating costs, per km (total costs minus capex costs):
$4.3747 - $4.0443 = $0.3304/km
Discussion:
We are moving to an apartment on 28 July 2022, so the data for total kWh pushed from the grid (while at home charging) will become an estimate (as of 28 Jul 2022) until such time as I can figure out a data collection solution.
Cheers.
Summary costs as of 30 June 2022:
Total operating costs, per km (total costs minus capex costs):
$4.3747 - $4.0443 = $0.3304/km
Discussion:
We are moving to an apartment on 28 July 2022, so the data for total kWh pushed from the grid (while at home charging) will become an estimate (as of 28 Jul 2022) until such time as I can figure out a data collection solution.
Cheers.
Four times the distance travelled compared to last June results equates to double the efficiency.
Awesome.
Qualifies driving EV longer distance over the same period results in lower cost for propulsion, a fundamental truth not shared by ICE counterparts (particularly fossil fuel costs being what they are)
navguy12
Well-Known Member
July 2022 results:
Summary costs as of 28 Jul 2022:
Total operating costs, per km (total costs minus capex costs):
$4.1759 - $3.8595 = $0.3164/km
Discussion:
We move today, so I have captured the July data early.
Going forward, the data for total kWh pushed from the grid (while at (new) home charging) will become an estimate until such time as I can figure out a data collection solution.
Summary costs as of 28 Jul 2022:
Total operating costs, per km (total costs minus capex costs):
$4.1759 - $3.8595 = $0.3164/km
Discussion:
We move today, so I have captured the July data early.
Going forward, the data for total kWh pushed from the grid (while at (new) home charging) will become an estimate until such time as I can figure out a data collection solution.
Regnaston
Member
Just curious, where are you from in Eastern Ontario? I am originally from Brockville (now I live in a town outside of Windsor, On)
navguy12
Well-Known Member
We were located near Trenton but have moved to Ottawa.
navguy12
Well-Known Member
Aug 2022 results:
Summary costs as of 29 Aug 2022:
Total operating costs, per km (total costs minus capex costs):
$4.0897 - $3.7468 = $0.3429/km
Discussion:
Since we pay a flat rate of $15.00/month for whatever hydro is drawn from the grid to charge this vehicle (no inline meter available), the actual cost per kWh (and actual hydro drawn from the grid) is based on my best estimate of a 25% correction factor for this month (using historical data with a low use rate for the current month).
The insurance for 2022-2023 was purchased this month, thus the cost per km is somewhat inflated compared to last month.
Summary costs as of 29 Aug 2022:
Total operating costs, per km (total costs minus capex costs):
$4.0897 - $3.7468 = $0.3429/km
Discussion:
Since we pay a flat rate of $15.00/month for whatever hydro is drawn from the grid to charge this vehicle (no inline meter available), the actual cost per kWh (and actual hydro drawn from the grid) is based on my best estimate of a 25% correction factor for this month (using historical data with a low use rate for the current month).
The insurance for 2022-2023 was purchased this month, thus the cost per km is somewhat inflated compared to last month.
Given your recent stats, it looks like ~600 km/month to break even. With winter approaching, that $15 charge/month looks like a pretty good deal
Does that cover your Tesla as well, or is it another $15 for that car?
navguy12
Well-Known Member
It’s another 15/month.Given your recent stats, it looks like ~600 km/month to break even. With winter approaching, that $15 charge/month looks like a pretty good deal
Does that cover your Tesla as well, or is it another $15 for that car?
We each have our own stalls.
My setup:
I normally install these 14-50 outlets higher off the floor (away from possible mechanical damage from a car/truck bumper) with the ground prong at the top so the EVSE tails down, but at $15 /month...who cares - great deal. You can't even park your car (without charging facilities) in most places for $15/ hr...re- city parkades.
BTW Velcro strip works pretty good for cord management, slip it under the 3/4" conduit.
navguy12
Well-Known Member
Yea, the “professional electrician” who did the installation would not have been my first pick. But, it’s not my private property so I live with it. Great idea ref the velcro strips; I keep my wall connector setup as is unless I’m leaving town for a trip…then the snips come out to cut the zip ties…and upon return home I have to monkey with it again for a few minutes to set it back up like this.I normally install these 14-50 outlets higher off the floor (away from possible mechanical damage from a car/truck bumper) with the ground prong at the top so the EVSE tails down, but at $15 /month...who cares - great deal. You can't even park your car (without charging facilities) in most places for $15/ hr...re- city parkades.
BTW Velcro strip works pretty good for cord management, slip it under the 3/4" conduit.