Mike's wife's monthly Kona EV efficiency report

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navguy12 said:
July 2021 results:

View attachment 12948

View attachment 12949

View attachment 12947

View attachment 12946

Summary costs as of 31 Jul 2021:

View attachment 12950

Total operating costs, per km (total costs minus capex costs):

$9.3868 - $8.8731 = $0.5137/km
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122 Wh/km accumulated consumption is very respectable, keep up the good driving habits. Anything under 125 really feels rewarding.
Personally I did achieve similar results:
https://insideevsforum.com/community/index.php?threads/range-is-increasing.8938/page-2#post-140570
I think before the summer winds down, that # will get even better.
We definitely are fortunate to own and drive probably the most efficient BEV for the invested $ even by todays standards.:)
 
Am I understanding correctly? (Math was never my strong suit)

Your car shows12.2 kwh/100km. Your data shows electricity use as 18.4 kwh/100km. Is the difference just that a lot of juice gets lost somewhere in the charging process?

If so, my assumption is wrong that I can just multiply what the car shows me by my kwh electricity rate to get my electrical cost. Based on your numbers, I need to bump it up by approximately 50%?

Or am I just mis-interpreting your numbers?

Thanks for this - very interesting.
 
Das KONA said:
Your car shows12.2 kwh/100km. Your data shows electricity use as 18.4 kwh/100km.
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The 12.2 figure is for this month only…and I believe you are pulling the 18.4 (actually 18.023) figure from the lifetime information on my summary page.

To review this month, the delta between what the car says was used (122 Wh/km) versus what was pulled from the grid (rounded to nearest whole number of 151 Wh/km) was 23%:

45EE7B97-D770-46ED-8F26-42D2DC230EAD.webp

YMMV, but for the past 12 months of ownership, the figure is 20% (146 Wh/km versus 180 Wh/km).

Some of the energy is lost in converting from AC to DC…some is lost by the BMS that constantly exercises the 12 volt battery, so it has to be topped up almost continuously…and if the algorithm is the same as my TM3, the Kona EV odometer will not capture any energy used unless the car is in “drive” or “reverse”.

If the car is parked bu the AC is on full blast, that energy has to come from somewhere and I don’t think the cars odometer captures that.

As to figuring what you pull from the grid at home so you can figure what your energy spend is on the car versus the rest of your house, the best thing to do is get one of the in-line meters that I use (and re-zero every month).

Hope that makes sense. :)
 
Thanks - that makes it clear. I'm not detailed enough to get me an in-line meter, but it's really helpful to know when I work out my ICE v. EV savings I need to gross up the car's number by roughly 20%.

What you say about the energy for AC is interesting. As it happens, our grandson drove my wife to emergency at the hospital this weekend (she's fine) and the poor guy had to spend almost 3 hours in the car waiting on a hot afternoon. I told him to just run the car and keep the AC on, which he did. We were both surprised that the GOM only went down by a few kilometres. If that's because the car doesn't take into account AC drain in computing your remaining (guesstimated) mileage, that doesn't make much practical sense to me. I would have thought the GOM just divides the amount of charge left by how much you used by mileage in some recent amount of driving. Since just using the AC reduces the amount of charge, why would that not reflected in the estimated range left? Or maybe it does, since our remaining mileage did go down a little (less than 10 km) and AC doesn't use as much battery as I would have thought?

Also, he and I were driving later with the consumption screen up that shows what motor, accessories, etc. are using at the moment. We had AC on and switched to and from "driver only". That only made a very small percentage difference on the screen. Maybe that makes sense since you're still running the AC and just changing how many vents it blows through (I suppose).

Anyway, just musing about these things and hope I'm not hijacking your thread but I thought this was sort of relevant.
 
Das KONA said:
Thanks - that makes it clear. I'm not detailed enough to get me an in-line meter, but it's really helpful to know when I work out my ICE v. EV savings I need to gross up the car's number by roughly 20%.

What you say about the energy for AC is interesting. As it happens, our grandson drove my wife to emergency at the hospital this weekend (she's fine) and the poor guy had to spend almost 3 hours in the car waiting on a hot afternoon. I told him to just run the car and keep the AC on, which he did. We were both surprised that the GOM only went down by a few kilometres. If that's because the car doesn't take into account AC drain in computing your remaining (guesstimated) mileage, that doesn't make much practical sense to me. I would have thought the GOM just divides the amount of charge left by how much you used by mileage in some recent amount of driving. Since just using the AC reduces the amount of charge, why would that not reflected in the estimated range left? Or maybe it does, since our remaining mileage did go down a little (less than 10 km) and AC doesn't use as much battery as I would have thought?

Also, he and I were driving later with the consumption screen up that shows what motor, accessories, etc. are using at the moment. We had AC on and switched to and from "driver only". That only made a very small percentage difference on the screen. Maybe that makes sense since you're still running the AC and just changing how many vents it blows through (I suppose).

Anyway, just musing about these things and hope I'm not hijacking your thread but I thought this was sort of relevant.
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Cheers.

I figure you’ll be happy with simply adding the 20% to your odometer readings, “good enough for government work” ;)
 
navguy12 said:
Cheers.

I figure you’ll be happy with simply adding the 20% to your odometer readings, “good enough for government work” ;)
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There are a number of mysteries and unknowns, including the level of efficiency while charging. Still none seems to make a huge difference. By the way I also use the AC if I/we have to wait in the car. It just makes sense to me. Unless of course you are running on "battery fumes" - haha.

The little pop-ups reminding me not to drain the battery while I am in the car and running the radio etc. puzzle me. I am literally sitting on 60+kW of power in the drive battery. Please Hyundai engineers take care of this for me will you? At least while the drive battery is, say at or above 40-50%. Small thing but annoying.
 
Lars said:
The little pop-ups reminding me not to drain the battery while I am in the car and running the radio etc. puzzle me. I am literally sitting on 60+kW of power in the drive battery. Please Hyundai engineers take care of this for me will you? At least while the drive battery is, say at or above 40-50%. Small thing but annoying.
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This is the one major philosophical difference the Kona has, compared to how my TM3 uses 12 volts under all conditions.

In that car, whenever the car is woken up (such as opening the door), the system will use the traction battery to continually recharge the 12 volt battery, regardless of whether one is cleaning the interior (doors open/interior lamps on) or parked at some location and listening to the radio, etc...

The only issue is things like "Dog Mode" or "Sentry Mode" will not operate when the SOC is under 20%.

The method of powering ancillary 12 volt systems is the only real weakness I see in the Kona.
 
Lars said:
There are a number of mysteries and unknowns, including the level of efficiency while charging. Still none seems to make a huge difference. By the way I also use the AC if I/we have to wait in the car. It just makes sense to me. Unless of course you are running on "battery fumes" - haha.

The little pop-ups reminding me not to drain the battery while I am in the car and running the radio etc. puzzle me. I am literally sitting on 60+kW of power in the drive battery. Please Hyundai engineers take care of this for me will you? At least while the drive battery is, say at or above 40-50%. Small thing but annoying.
Click to expand...
Leave the car "on" or shift into "utility" mode. Those are the solutions.
 
navguy12 said:
The method of powering ancillary 12 volt systems is the only real weakness I see in the Kona.
Click to expand...
Hyundai have improved the charging algorithm via software update with a previous LDC TSB for early MY built cars, which has carried over to our later models. At least it is variable using these methods, but still I am curious as to what the lower SOC level of the traction pack would be where the car decides to save its remaining energy and disregard the auxiliary battery.
Wise decision on Tesla's part to limit unnecessary loads at a predetermined pack SOC while also allowing that indication to be known to the user.

"the LDC controller may set the LDC output voltage and the sub-battery charging time (or LDC operation time charging the sub-battery) according to the SOH of the sub-battery (S14), and then may determine whether or not the SOC of a main battery is sufficient to charge the sub-battery (S16). The information received from the IBS may include the internal temperature of the sub-battery, the SOC, a load resistance value detection, and the voltage."

Source:https://patents.google.com/patent/US9413182B2/en
 
electriceddy said:
Hyundai have improved the charging algorithm via software update with a previous LDC TSB for early MY built cars, which has carried over to our later models. At least it is variable using these methods, but still I am curious as to what the lower SOC level of the traction pack would be where the car decides to save its remaining energy and disregard the auxiliary battery.
Wise decision on Tesla's part to limit unnecessary loads at a predetermined pack SOC while also allowing that indication to be known to the user.

"the LDC controller may set the LDC output voltage and the sub-battery charging time (or LDC operation time charging the sub-battery) according to the SOH of the sub-battery (S14), and then may determine whether or not the SOC of a main battery is sufficient to charge the sub-battery (S16). The information received from the IBS may include the internal temperature of the sub-battery, the SOC, a load resistance value detection, and the voltage."

Source:https://patents.google.com/patent/US9413182B2/en
Click to expand...

Thanks for the good info! Just shows that Tesla engineers are ahead of thinking in other areas than 0 to 60 as well. ;)
 
Aug 2021 results:

aug2021 raw data.webp

aug2021 real upload data.webp
aug2021 odometer.webp
aug2021 in line meter.webp
Summary costs as of 31 Aug 2021:

aug2021 summary.webp

Total operating costs, per km (total costs minus capex costs):

$8.9658 - $8.4455 = $0.5203/km

Discussion:

The first annual routine maintenance was done on 20 Aug 2021 and involved $5.00 of shop supplies (to lubricate the four brake calipers).

However, the operating costs per km are higher than last month due to the purchase of a (what I log as) "Charging adapter kit", in this case an extension cable that my wife can use solely for her Kona whilst traveling (versus sharing the unit I bought for my TM3 three years ago):

https://www.evseadapters.com/products/nema-14-50-extension-cord-for-electric-vehicle-only-20-ft/
 
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