Honestly it just looks like its figuring out your driving habbits better. Its getting closer to your actual mileage. Do you have a similar community in similar temps per day?
Low Estimated Range-- is this normal?
- Thread starter Dan Albrich
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Honestly it just looks like its figuring out your driving habbits better. Its getting closer to your actual mileage. Do you have a similar community in similar temps per day?
su_A_ve
Active Member
We too are seeing a precipitous drop in range here in NY. We had been getting a range in the mid 50s in the nice weather. Now, with temps in the 40s, we’re only getting about 35-37. This is a bit disappointing and I’m not seeing this same % drop on my Tesla.
Yesterday during the storm, I drove less than 15 miles and used 50% of the battery, leaving me with only 14 mile range, even though I had started at 38. Didn't make it back to work this morning by about a mile (only 13 mile commute).
After charging today in the morning, the range was down the 32. Had to do errands over lunch, so filled it up in the afternoon and range only went up to 33.
BTW, I noticed that after the range software update, full charge only shows 99% on the app.
Richard_arch74
Active Member
@Ken7, just curious, what kind of % drop are you seeing with your Tesla?We too are seeing a precipitous drop in range here in NY. We had been getting a range in the mid 50s in the nice weather. Now, with temps in the 40s, we’re only getting about 35-37. This is a bit disappointing and I’m not seeing this same % drop on my Tesla.
Sent from my SM-G955U using Inside EVs mobile app
May be related or may not: I have found the app errors out more often on my Android device if I have the display set to turn off after 30 seconds. When I bump the display sleep to not happen until 1 minute of inactivity, the action I asked the app to complete seems to finish more often. If the display turns off while the app is still working on the task I gave it, like turning on pre-conditioning or changing the charge schedule, the error will usually happen.
Try extending your phone's display 'On time' (if it was short) and see if you have fewer errors in the app.
Hmm ok will do thanks
. I usually have it set to pre-condition on a schedule, I just wish you could set different times for different days
vicw
Active Member
This month, since November 5th, our average local low has been 44.8, average high 54.9 and overall 49.8 degrees average. I think you said you are in Boston, which I presume would normally be colder overall. All of the driving during this period has been local, with max speed of mostly 35 & 45 mph, and just a few miles of 55 mph.
Robert_Alabama
Well-Known Member
I'm beginning to believe that any operation of the Climate control in cold weather is really draining the range on the Clarity. I haven't proven it yet as I haven't driven a lot in cold weather (Alabama). Even so, just with the reduced temps I've seen, my range has dropped to the mid 40s from mid 50s. I want to try driving some with no cabin heat (other than maybe just the heated seat) to see how much of the range will come back. Anyone who has tried this, I'd like to hear from them.
There are three main factors that cause the range reduction in colder temps.
If decreased mi/kWh doesn't account for the majority of the range reduction, then it may be time to have the dealer test the battery. But even @ 40-50 F, a 30% drop in range really isn't out of line under many conditions and usage patterns.
Note: Best to track actual range and not the reading off the Guess-o-meter as that seems to get increasingly conservative as temps decline.
- Battery capacity is less due to the slowed chemical reaction (the kWh rating you see for batteries is at about 70 degrees Fahrenheit with a .3C discharge rate).
- Cooler temps cause increases in air resistance, rolling resistance, thicker lubricating fluids, and often moisture making any vehicle work harder and lose range/efficiency (people tend not to notice in ICE vehicles).
- The noted need for heat from battery power (whether cabin air or seats) for both comfort and moisture control.
- Smaller batteries seem to more sensitive to colder temps. Less thermal mass?
- Shorter trips are less efficient. If the battery and car have a chance to cool between trips, the energy price to get things up to temp needs to be paid again.
- Heat pumps make a big difference until it gets really cold - resistance heat is much less efficient. (I believe the PHEV version forgoes the heat pump. Our Clarity Electric does have the heat pump and there is a huge difference from the Fit EV which did not). There are some PHEV's that have neither and the ICE is the only source of heat.
- Preconditioning helps a lot - more so if connected to 240V charging
If decreased mi/kWh doesn't account for the majority of the range reduction, then it may be time to have the dealer test the battery. But even @ 40-50 F, a 30% drop in range really isn't out of line under many conditions and usage patterns.
Note: Best to track actual range and not the reading off the Guess-o-meter as that seems to get increasingly conservative as temps decline.
Rich, with the Tesla it’s different. I keep it charged at 90% of capacity and the reported range of 220 miles is the same regardless of temperature. The difference is in how close I get to that estimated range. In warm weather I have no problem hitting 100%-105% efficiency. Now that it’s cold, my efficiency has dropped about 10% to an average of 90% of the range estimate. I can still hit 100% at times, but it’s harder.
Dan Albrich
Well-Known Member
One more followup from me on this thread:
I've been extremely careful about using the heater (climate control) -- basically only using for defrost. I also don't goose it to a higher temperature than say 70. I do use the heated seat. With these changes I'm now able to get the estimated range back to 40miles. Like others I think actual is a bit lower- maybe 35 actual miles but I haven't done any precise measurements.
I do know if I set the heater to say 75 when its cold, while driving, and if the estimated range is in the dash (the one with miles and tenths of miles), I can literally watch the tenths of miles click down as I drive. Turning off the cabin heat completely returns the rate of discharge to a much more modest rate.
I've been finding a happier compromise by still using cabin heat when its cold, but to be mindful to turn it off anytime not needed. Typically if I can get the car to some reasonable temp, I can then turn off completely and keep driving and be OK heat wise. But being a 'task master' about keeping the heat off seems to really help. I think I had been 'goosing the cabin heat' when I got in the car, and sometimes just leaving it on at like 75 because I do a lot of short trips and open and close the doors as I get in and out-- so the car never really gets to warm inside, and stay warm if that makes sense.
I still just have level 1 charging at home. I am pre-heating mornings now (figure even thought I can't heat and warm at same time it may have some benefit while still plugged in vs. just heating once I leave-- dunno).
Anyway, I'm glad I'm no longer seeing 26 miles estimated range with 100% charge. That was making me worry something was bad/broken. And no chance my Clarity is going to see 50 or more miles of estimated range (I've tried experiment of leaving heat off entirely, and there just isn't that much play in estimated range). Finally although my daily commute is just 5 miles each way, I do live up a hill. I'm maybe 800' above level, but I have to use power to get up the hill, even if I get some back on way down. It would be intesting to test on totally flat ground but since that's not where I live not easy to do for now.
And again, thanks for all the helpful posts and discussion around the range etc.
-Dan
I've been extremely careful about using the heater (climate control) -- basically only using for defrost. I also don't goose it to a higher temperature than say 70. I do use the heated seat. With these changes I'm now able to get the estimated range back to 40miles. Like others I think actual is a bit lower- maybe 35 actual miles but I haven't done any precise measurements.
I do know if I set the heater to say 75 when its cold, while driving, and if the estimated range is in the dash (the one with miles and tenths of miles), I can literally watch the tenths of miles click down as I drive. Turning off the cabin heat completely returns the rate of discharge to a much more modest rate.
I've been finding a happier compromise by still using cabin heat when its cold, but to be mindful to turn it off anytime not needed. Typically if I can get the car to some reasonable temp, I can then turn off completely and keep driving and be OK heat wise. But being a 'task master' about keeping the heat off seems to really help. I think I had been 'goosing the cabin heat' when I got in the car, and sometimes just leaving it on at like 75 because I do a lot of short trips and open and close the doors as I get in and out-- so the car never really gets to warm inside, and stay warm if that makes sense.
I still just have level 1 charging at home. I am pre-heating mornings now (figure even thought I can't heat and warm at same time it may have some benefit while still plugged in vs. just heating once I leave-- dunno).
Anyway, I'm glad I'm no longer seeing 26 miles estimated range with 100% charge. That was making me worry something was bad/broken. And no chance my Clarity is going to see 50 or more miles of estimated range (I've tried experiment of leaving heat off entirely, and there just isn't that much play in estimated range). Finally although my daily commute is just 5 miles each way, I do live up a hill. I'm maybe 800' above level, but I have to use power to get up the hill, even if I get some back on way down. It would be intesting to test on totally flat ground but since that's not where I live not easy to do for now.
And again, thanks for all the helpful posts and discussion around the range etc.
-Dan
Not worth it to me to be cold in my car just to squeeze out more milage. Relax and enjoy the car. Either way you are helping save the planet, albeit a tiny amount regardless
It's 43 here and my app is showing 55 estimated EV range. I've really made a big effort to coast more, so I'm not putting energy into the car it doesn't need. I also take off from stops much slower than I used to. I generally try to keep it near the 2nd big "hash mark" when possible. I also use just the seat heater plus defrost as needed. I PC before I leave and wear my coat.
I used to warm my old car up so much that I could take my coat off. After seeing the difference in range, I don't mind putting up with it.
I used to warm my old car up so much that I could take my coat off. After seeing the difference in range, I don't mind putting up with it.
Today was the first day I drove the Clarity in really cold weather (17 F in Boston - and I don’t want to hear snickers from great white north Clarity owners
). Was mostly highway and I drained the battery in about 25 miles. I did make use of both seat heaters as comfort trumped efficiency for my wife and me. I also noticed that the car seemed a bit more sluggish at highway speed. Has anyone noticed lower power in cold weather? Looks like the best strategy for trips like this would be to just use the ICE since the cost of recharging the battery is going to be more then the gas the ICE would be using.
jazdean
New Member
I live in Seattle, very temperate, also bought my Clarity in April, and have observed a very similar history of a drop in EV range. Range was initially 47-52 miles, now is consistently 40-45, and by now I mean since I finally bought a tank of gas at around 3200 miles. I had an HV range error at that point in which the range was stuck at 1000 miles. Just had a s/w update and am hopeful the EV range will improve.
Bjsurprise
New Member
i just bought my Clarity a couple weeks ago so am a "newby" and still learning how things work. I assumed that the battery would fully charge to achieve approximately 47 mile range on the battery for travel and this occurred for the first week. I do live in the mountains of North Carolina so temps have gotten down below freezing at night recently and i do drive up and down some hilly roads up here. For the last week, when fully charged at home, the read-out shows i have a battery range of around 36 miles which surprised me but after reading some of the messages, it appears that the initial mileage range after full charge, is based on previous usage and I should not expect the read-out to show 47 miles under all conditions at full charge. In actual driving recently, I am probably getting more like 30 miles or less of driving recently on the battery. This is a little disappointing and i wish i would have had a better understanding of this before i bought the car but dealer sales reps don't really understand much about these cars to even explain how they work. If i am not understanding any of this correctly, i would certainly appreciate anyone that can clarify this for me.
AnthonyW
Well-Known Member
In the winter you will get low 40’s. Next summer you can easily achieve high 50’s. So it will even out to 47. The battery’s optimum temperature range is 77 to 95. The best you can do is time your charge to finish right before you need to leave, keep your tires inflated and employ some mild hypermiling techniques.
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Sent from my iPhone using Inside EVs
Claritydfw
Member
Today was the first day I drove the Clarity in really cold weather (17 F in Boston - and I don’t want to hear snickers from great white north Clarity owners
Well it was in the 50s when I got up and I almost had to put a light coat on. Now it’s 78 as I am typing this
. But with the bragging over now I am curious as to what your highway speed was. I am also assuming you had the cabin heater on too.