Exploding Kona Electric

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I am definitely not a battery wizard. But I understand that batteries can ignite even without any current following (through whatever they are connected to), since it is an internal problem, those dendrites, that can cause that. If (correct me if I'm wrong) that is the case, fusing cells doesn't make a difference, even cooling I believe doesn't make a difference since it will heat up so much that the cooling wouldn't be able to keep up. It's basically just like an ice car. Once that engine is burning, your little handy dandy fire extinguisher won't make a difference.

However, just like you, I am not obsessing about it. There is FAR more ice cars on fire than EVs. And that is percentage wise, not total, since there are of course far more ice cars on the road than EVs.
 
[QUOTE="GeorgeS, post:
I still bought a Kona and feel safe. I do worry about if an accident should occur would the first responders have insulated tools to prevent themselves from the 400+ voltage of the battery. Little more dangerous than ICE because you can smell gasoline.[/QUOTE]


In an EV the high voltage battery does not have ground attached to the frame like a 12 volt system. It is my understanding that the High Voltage battery is isolated inside a conductive box thus all shorts are internal to the box thus significantly reducing the potential (no pun intended ) for shocks. In that case the fireman would need to touch both a positive and negative leads at the same time to complete the circuit. Fireman are trained in dealing with electrical issues during fires. There is even a Kona EV emergency response guide available on the web put out by Hyundai. I have attached a copy.
 

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Fastnf said:
[QUOTE="GeorgeS, post:
I still bought a Kona and feel safe. I do worry about if an accident should occur would the first responders have insulated tools to prevent themselves from the 400+ voltage of the battery. Little more dangerous than ICE because you can smell gasoline.
Click to expand...


In an EV the high voltage battery does not have ground attached to the frame like a 12 volt system. It is my understanding that the High Voltage battery is isolated inside a conductive box thus all shorts are internal to the box thus significantly reducing the potential (no pun intended ) for shocks. In that case the fireman would need to touch both a positive and negative leads at the same time to complete the circuit. Fireman are trained in dealing with electrical issues during fires. There is even a Kona EV emergency response guide available on the web put out by Hyundai. I have attached a copy.[/QUOTE]

Which brings up the question: why is there no mention of the 2 wire link with the fireman's hat on it (the one beside the 5 pin diagnostic plug cap located passenger side near the firewall in the motor compartment) which I assume is some kind of isolation or kill switch by cutting the 2 leads. Any one have any more info on the operation of this?
 
Yes, that link is in series with all the other safety interlocks in the loop.

The manual has a lot of deficiencies throughout it. Wrong numbers,
mislabeled diagrams, typos. Not nearly on par with Toyota's one for
the early Prius, which was also a nice technical rundown on the car.

_H*
 
hobbit said:
Yes, that link is in series with all the other safety interlocks in the loop.

The manual has a lot of deficiencies throughout it. Wrong numbers,
mislabeled diagrams, typos. Not nearly on par with Toyota's one for
the early Prius, which was also a nice technical rundown on the car.

_H*
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Once things settle down a bit I intend to stop by the local fire hall and confirm they have access to those files, including the link;)
 
electriceddy said:
Once things settle down a bit I intend to stop by the local fire hall and confirm they have access to those files, including the link;)
Click to expand...

If they had an actual fire, they won't exactly be flipping through manuals or pulling up a browser to figure out what to do.

But you could take your car too in case they wanted you to pop the hood and see what they look like in real life. For people who are visual learners, seeing it up close is way better than reading some document.

Is there any standardization at all about where these things are found on a car, or what they look like?
 
Contrary to the fire in Canada, still photos in the news video show that the motor compartment is in relatively good condition, as are some other exterior parts. I would have thought the heat would go straight up the firewall and cook those areas. Assuming it actually is a battery failure, perhaps it depends on what part of the enclosure fails up under pressure.
There was a photo posted of a Zoe partially submerged in a lake a while back and I had wondered how the venting was arranged to keep the battery dry. Turns out it's placed at the highest point, inside the main fuse / disconnect. I would expect the same in the Kona and as such outgassing may initially vent into the cabin under the rear seat.
 
Not into the cabin, as there's a fairly substantial access plate in the way even if
it's only glued down. But probably out under the floor sheetmetal to the open,
at least until heat and force grew enough to burn through. Hopefully by then
a cabin occupant would have noticed there's a problem..

_H*
 
Ed Zwieback said:
Big News Item on 11 Jun: "Kona Electric gets update following 2 battery fires"
https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/hyundai-kona-electric-battery-fire-update/
Is this update for real ? I checked MyHyundai for my '20 kona EV and no mention of a recall/update.
Click to expand...
It's only for 2019 and early 2020 models.

Which now that I think of it, means it has nothing to do with the second fire because the update had been integrated into the later 2020 models before the second fire. Funny that nobody mentions that in the articles.
 
Esprit1st said:
It's only for 2019 and early 2020 models.

Which now that I think of it, means it has nothing to do with the second fire because the update had been integrated into the later 2020 models before the second fire. Funny that nobody mentions that in the articles.
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That's because the articles are simply repeating the supposition in the first article. Hyundai has never acknowledged that the update has anything to do with fires.
 
Wildeyed said:
That's because the articles are simply repeating the supposition in the first article. Hyundai has never acknowledged that the update has anything to do with fires.
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Its kind of obvious given the details here:
https://insideevsforum.com/communit...rm-of-software-update.8713/page-5#post-101075
Cell deviation and insulation resistance detection improvement also given that it is stated on the service campaign notice as "BMS has been enhanced to include additional monitoring of the HV Battery when the vehicle is parked"
Of course no company is going to mention fire prevention as the primary reason.
 
electriceddy said:
Its kind of obvious given the details here:
https://insideevsforum.com/communit...rm-of-software-update.8713/page-5#post-101075
Cell deviation and insulation resistance detection improvement also given that it is stated on the service campaign notice as "BMS has been enhanced to include additional monitoring of the HV Battery when the vehicle is parked"
Of course no company is going to mention fire prevention as the primary reason.
Click to expand...
What I'm saying is that it still doesn't establish that the software changes were the direct result of fires. Correlation and causation are different. Internet fan sites start rumours and make assumptions and then watch it ripple outward across the internet. I hope it IS about stopping fires. I want a safer EV.
 
Wildeyed said:
I believe your 2020 model is exempt.
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Wildeyed: Thanks for your input and I hope you are right.
My 2020-Ult. mfgr. date was 26 Oct 2019.
As my Kona garage is right below our bedroom, I would sleep better if I knew that Hyundai knew the cause and the fix, and I got Hyundai info that my car was "exempt".
 
Are we supposed to get notified of this recall? I haven't heard anything, and when I type my VIN into their Safety Recall and Service Campaign website, I get "There are no open Safety Recalls or Service Campaigns for this vehicle."
 
Ed Zwieback said:
Wildeyed: Thanks for your input and I hope you are right.
My 2020-Ult. mfgr. date was 26 Oct 2019.
As my Kona garage is right below our bedroom, I would sleep better if I knew that Hyundai knew the cause and the fix, and I got Hyundai info that my car was "exempt".
Click to expand...
The best method to find out is to inquire at the dealer service department you purchased from (or another reputable other) include S/N , as this is an early 2020 production date possibly manufactured before additional HV Battery monitoring as per the new update.
BTW, I don't lose any sleep over having mine parked in my carport right beside my bedroom as hundreds of pounds of lithium have been parked there for 8 plus years now.
Obviously working smoke detectors is always a confidence contributing factor.
 
My garage is right beside my master bedroom.. However, the wall between my garage and my master bedroom is concrete block, so I doubt that I'm in any danger..
 
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