Consumer Reports - Clarity Much-Worse-Than-Average Reliability - Really?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Gearhead
  • Start date Start date
  • Replies Replies 92
  • Views Views 30K
Henry Lee said:
I am in the market for a new EV or Phev next year and Clarity was one ofof my top choices. When I heard the CR podcast I was shocked and removed it from my list. but after seeing this thread its back on. I am a software engineer in silicon valley and bugs R us. It seems the problems with the Clarity are all or mostly software related. I think in this day and age, cars have so much software in them it is bound to have bugs. Look at your phone, mine is full of them. I would be much more concerned about mechanical problems in general.

I don't expect Honda or most other car makers to focus on their software (look at the sheer number of crappy head units out there). The only exception seems to be Tesla, where Musk was formerly a software guy so perhaps he thinks like one. I haven't tried tesla's infotainment system but I suspect it's one of the best. What makes them truly unique among car makers is the Ota updates which is a must in Windows, Android, Mac Os, etc. But software updates in the car industry is probably like the unicorn. Tesla does it right with Ota updates maybe because of his software background.

CR should really categorize mechanical and software issues, not lump them.
Click to expand...

For sure keep the Clarity on your list. It’s a great car. Negotiate price like crazy because dealers are likely desperate to sell/lease the ‘18s. Use the info on this forum to do a pre-purchase inspection and enjoy the ride.
 
I’ve had my clarity for two months and the biggest annoyance I had with the car was that the car didn’t charge well at some public L2 chargers. Got the software fix two days ago and so far (knock on wood) it’s working fine now. This wasn’t the end of my world and I still think this is one of the best cars out there. My biggest annoyance overall is with Honda because the dealers still don’t understand this technology. If it wasn’t for this forum and what other owners had posted I would have gone crazy trying to understand why I was getting the warning lights and the car wasn’t charging because FOR SURE no one at the dealer could help me. Put the car on your list - you won’t be disappointed.
 
PHEV Newbie said:
Just out of curiosity, has anyone encountered a defect that rendered the car undrivable? Excluding accidents, flat tires, and your battery going dead.
Click to expand...
That sounds like my accident. Which is a disaster caused by combining poor oem tire, overinflation from dealer, rainy day, and downhill slope.

In short, I rear ended into a Toyota. The brake simply doesn't slow it down. Mechanic checked brake system, both physically and the accident data recorder.

I'm still diving my Clarity. I still love it. Just now I know to check tire pressure and keep distance.
 
Maybe I missed it but are they rating all of the Clarity models worse than average? Or only the PHEV model? What does the data say about the model to make it not reliable? Curious what reliable means to CR.
 
Consumer Reports now has much more credibility problems than my Clarity has reliability problems. I stopped renewing my subscription a while back. It’s a shame, they were once a great organization.
 
insightman said:
The unpopularity of the Clarity as indicated by large numbers of them languishing on dealer lots (or being sold/leased well-below MSRP) does not bode well for resale value. The fact that few have ever heard of a Clarity doesn't help resale value, either. Even if you didn't qualify for the $7,500 tax credit, the resale value will reflect that discount. The march of technology doesn't work in the Clarity's favor, either.
Click to expand...

Honda should stop flooding the US market, and provide enough cars to Canada so someone can actually buy one and get it within a reasonable delay. As it is, as we have to order them demand exceeds supply and it is difficult to negotiate anything.

Edit: it was also ‘supposedly’ impossible to get the base model.
 
Last edited:
insightman said:
The unpopularity of the Clarity as indicated by large numbers of them languishing on dealer lots (or being sold/leased well-below MSRP) does not bode well for resale value. The fact that few have ever heard of a Clarity doesn't help resale value, either. Even if you didn't qualify for the $7,500 tax credit, the resale value will reflect that discount. The march of technology doesn't work in the Clarity's favor, either.

Resale value was never part of the equation in my purchase decision. I knew I wanted one the day Honda announced there would be a plug-in variation of the Clarity Fuel Cell. Because I'm a Honda fan-boy (OK, fan-geezer), there would have to be a better Honda to make me want to sell our Clarity and that doesn't appear to be happening anytime soon. I will admit I was worried enough about reliability to purchase an extended warranty, however.
Click to expand...

Unfortunately for manufacturers, in many cases it's all 4-door sedans that are languishing on lots. My local very small Honda dealer has 28 new Accords, way more than any other model, on their lot. It really emphasizes a possibility that if Honda had chosen to make the CR-V or HR-V, or Ridgeline into a PHEV with a decent EV range instead of a 4-door sedan, they might have customers bidding up prices from MSRP! The market is now in small-mid SUVs and trucks, not cars.
 
Wall-e said:
Maybe I missed it but are they rating all of the Clarity models worse than average? Or only the PHEV model? What does the data say about the model to make it not reliable? Curious what reliable means to CR.
Click to expand...

Looks like all models although I doubt CR reviewed all 3. Clarity is at the bottom of the EV/plugin midsize category. Unfortunately according to CR a car can have a bulletproof drivetrain, suspension etc but if a software glitch requires a couple of bug fixes the car is rubbish for all time. They're very behind the state of the art as Elon Musk pointed out when the Model 3 received a weak reliability rating before 1 car was sold.

I need the HV mileage update and looks like the rubber body plugs are missing. I'll get around to visiting the service department soon but I'm driving the car 7 months now. It's rock solid and drives great. Doesn't strike me as a car with major issues.

This is what happens when analysts try to come up with metrics that apply to a varied set of items. Too much detail and relevant nuances are washed out. In this case everything, regardless of severity is treated as an 'incident'. Not very useful given the vast variety of possible 'incidents'.
 
Henry Lee said:
I am in the market for a new EV or Phev next year and Clarity was one ofof my top choices. When I heard the CR podcast I was shocked and removed it from my list. but after seeing this thread its back on. I am a software engineer in silicon valley and bugs R us. It seems the problems with the Clarity are all or mostly software related. I think in this day and age, cars have so much software in them it is bound to have bugs. Look at your phone, mine is full of them. I would be much more concerned about mechanical problems in general.

I don't expect Honda or most other car makers to focus on their software (look at the sheer number of crappy head units out there). The only exception seems to be Tesla, where Musk was formerly a software guy so perhaps he thinks like one. I haven't tried tesla's infotainment system but I suspect it's one of the best. What makes them truly unique among car makers is the Ota updates which is a must in Windows, Android, Mac Os, etc. But software updates in the car industry is probably like the unicorn. Tesla does it right with Ota updates maybe because of his software background.

CR should really categorize mechanical and software issues, not lump them.
Click to expand...

You’re bang on.
 
insightman said:
I replaced the engine in my LeCar all by myself. I'd never done anything like that before but I got the car cheap from an ex-girlfriend and I wanted to show her I could do something her new BF could not. It was quite a revelation to discover how often Renault changed the mix of parts used to assemble this car. It made for a very educational experience. My enduring memory of that car is driving in the winter with my fingers pressed into the air vent to the left of the steering wheel so that at least the tips of 3 fingers could be warm while the rest of me was freezing. I sold the car to a dad who bought it for his son to punish him for getting too many speeding tickets in his Camaro. Haven't seen one on the road in decades.
Click to expand...

LOL! You should have driven my well-used 1958 Renault Dauphine, when you could get it started, that is. It even had a feature that allowed one to use the wheel lug wrench to turn and start the rear, water-cooled engine by the fly-wheel in really cold weather (which was basically all of the time in the mountains of Wyoming, where I grew up). Worst car I ever had, (although the Cadillac Cimarron was a close second). The Clarity is truly a dream car come true in my (old) book.
 
One year and 6,000 miles after leasing my Clarity BEV, it’s never been back to the dealer or needed service. We absolutely love this car. I’m surprised that some seem to be having issues with theirs (and maybe the PHEV is more prone to having problems because of its drivetrain?) but ours has been great.

There are a few issues that are not perfect - an intermittent buzz from the tweeter grilles located in the A pillars, and the XM satellite dropping after using the climate pre-conditioning. Both are we’ll documented in this forum, but neither are what I would consider serious enough to take in for service. Otherwise this car has been flawless in its first year.


Sent from my iPad using Inside EVs
 
V8Power said:
You’re bang on.
Click to expand...

That's what they did. And as many people suggest, they do weight the areas of concern. I think that it just that most new cars don't have problems, except for say the first 10,000 produced. It just so happens that the population Claritys is 10,000. So yeah, the reliability of the 2018 Clarity isn't great.

Here are the CR results for Clarity, scale of 1-5 with 5 being the best

"
Engine Major - 5
Engine Minor - 5
Engine Cooling - 5
Transmission Major - 5
Transmission Minor - 5
Drive System - 5
Fuel System - 5
Electric System - 5
Climate System - 5
Suspension - 5
Brakes - 5
Exhaust - 5
Paint/Trim - 3
Body Integrity - 3
Body Hardware - 1
Power Equipment - 3
In-car Electronics - 5

Overall Reliability - 1

Are All Problems Considered Equally Serious?
Problems with the engine-major, engine cooling, transmission-major, and drive system are more likely to take a car out of service and to be more expensive to repair than the other problem areas. Consequently, we weigh these areas more heavily in our calculations of model year Overall Reliability Verdict. Problems such as broken trim and in-car electronics have a much smaller weight. Problems in any area can be an expense and a bother, though, so we report them all in the Reliability History charts.




PAINT/TRIM: Paint (fading, chalking, peeling or cracking), loose trim or moldings, rust.

BODY INTEGRITY (noises & leaks): Squeaks, rattles, wind noises, loose or cracked seals, and/or weather stripping, air and water leaks.

BODY HARDWARE: Windows, locks and latches, doors or sliding doors, tailgate, trunk or hatch, mirrors, seat controls (movement and temperature), seat belts, sunroof, convertible top, glass defect.

POWER EQUIPMENT AND ACCESSORIES: Cruise control, clock, warning lights, body control module, keyless entry, wiper motor or washer, tire pressure monitor, interior or exterior lights, horn, gauges, 12V power plug, USB port, alarm or security system, remote engine start, heated or cooled seats.
"
 
Anybody want to explain to me how CR can take fifteen “5” ratings, three “3” ratings, and one “1” rating listed above and come up with an overall reliability rating of “1”??
Isn’t that at a 4.7 average even without weighting?? Is this the dreaded new math or am I missing something.
How did they arrive at a “1” for overall reliability? Thag not understand!
 
"Anybody want to explain to me how CR can take fifteen “5” ratings, three “3” ratings, and one “1” rating listed above and come up with an overall reliability rating of “1”??"

In addition, . . . I thought the major problem Consumer Reports wanted to point out involved new technology in cars. Yet, in the numbers above, "In-car Electronics" received a 5 !?! Yep, their "math" is perplexing.
 
KentuckyKen said:
Anybody want to explain to me how CR can take fifteen “5” ratings, three “3” ratings, and one “1” rating listed above and come up with an overall reliability rating of “1”??
Isn’t that at a 4.7 average even without weighting?? Is this the dreaded new math or am I missing something.
How did they arrive at a “1” for overall reliability? Thag not understand!
Click to expand...

It has to do with dividing by 0, using the square root of -5, and a dart board (blind-folded).
 
Here it is visually:
upload_2018-10-28_11-15-9.webp
 
KentuckyKen said:
Anybody want to explain to me how CR can take fifteen “5” ratings, three “3” ratings, and one “1” rating listed above and come up with an overall reliability rating of “1”??
Isn’t that at a 4.7 average even without weighting?? Is this the dreaded new math or am I missing something.
How did they arrive at a “1” for overall reliability? Thag not understand!
Click to expand...
All other cars have almost all 5s.

New cars don't usually require unexpected trips to the dealer in the first few months.

It's just a survey of end users about whether something inconvenienced them. So unless an issue is apparent to users now, it won't be reported to CR. A defective timing belt that still works won't yet show up. And a problem with air bags will never show up.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top