Consumer Reports - Clarity Much-Worse-Than-Average Reliability - Really?

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I put about as much stock in these reliability reviews at this point as I do JD Powers 90 day quality rankings...who cares about 3 months of quality?

Ask me about the cars reliability/quality after I've driven it for 5 years at a minimum.
 
Surprised at the reaction here to this. Consumer Reports is providing data that they received from subscribers. This seems like another case of people seeking affirmation instead of information. We know by our comments here that many of us have had "issues" with our Clarity. Mine so far in under a month's ownership have been:
1) Tire pressure warning light. Caused by the dealer not insuring that my tires were inflated correctly at delivery. Three of my tires had over 50 psi in them. Now, if after I adjusted the tire pressure correctly, the light went away, then I would not have even considered this much of an "issue". But it didn't go away after I did. I would never have guessed that I had to recalibrate it after I fixed the air pressure. Only figured that out due to this great forum.
2) Emission System Failure light. Got this in my first week of ownership. If I lived closer to the dealer, I would have brought the car back to them for it. I put it off however, and the light went away after a few days. I hope it stays that way.
3) Incorrect HV range reading. Right now, my Clarity says I can drive 641 HV miles.
4) Unexplained alarm going off. Happened 3 times last week. Again, this great forum explained this issue. This is because the Auto Lock feature will cause the alarm to go off if a door is open when you walk away from the car. That shouldn't happen. Had to turn that feature off.

I also did not have my rubber plugs installed, and was getting an unexplained multiple beeping (another auto lock issue), but I don't really consider those issues. I have not experienced the charging issues that some have been having, but we know that is an issue also.

So, does this mean I am unhappy with my choice of buying a Clarity? Nope. These problems are annoyances, but nothing big, and I still think long term it will be a reliable car. It's a high tech new model year car, I trust Honda will work out some of the bugs. But can I say that it's surprising to me that the Clarity data has been poor so far? No. I have never had this many small issues with a car that I have bought before, new or pre-owned. Am I surprised that it's LAST? Yes.
 
I would think that almost none of the minor annoyances I've read about would foretell of long-term driveability issues. That is what I'm most interested in and what I would actually consider reliability. Dealerships forgetting plugs or not setting tire pressure properly are not vehicle reliability issues, rather dealership competency issues.

Anyone that has worked in software development knows there are always bugs to squash, and if you wait until you're confident there are none left to find, you'll never ship it. I would imagine Honda knew of some of them before they shipped, but did so anyway to get them on the lot, knowing they could be fixed via a software update.

If resources were limited (which I'm sure they were), I would be happy to find out that they put them towards actual reliability issues and not minor things that could be easily corrected once the cars were in owner's hands. (E.g., I'd rather them have Bob working on the thermal management system than making sure my estimated HV miles were displaying properly).
 
Alright, lets stop harping on Consumer Reports 'bad reporting' and tie it back to the three main categories:

1. Dealer didn't do a good job on checking the delivery check list. (0% battery, car plugs, over inflated tires) I think many can agree to this being a cause for "initial quality" concerns.
2. OS update: There was issues with the OS and software miscalculating items. This has been addressed, not that big of a concern.
3. This is a very techy car. If you don't know all the features and everything going on with the car from the start, it is easy to say there is a problem and report it.

Any one of these three issues could explain why CR is reporting below average reliability. CR probably only keeps a tally of complaints and doesn't follow up on what the issue is and what the cause is. Like many computer problems, it could just be user error.
 
CR is rightfully being ripped for exactly the reasons you listed. They should call it something other than reliability if the things they list are not indicative of potential long-term reliability concerns.

I can't agree that missing car plugs or over inflated tires are vehicle quality concerns, rather dealer quality concerns. The plugs and the tires themselves are fine, which is what should be evaluated in this type of comparison. Some people are not making the distinction, even though it is vital to the discussion of vehicle reliability. The 0% battery is one that I think could impact the car long-term, based on the science behind the batteries, although it is not caused by an inherent flaw in the vehicle design, but lack of understanding of the vehicle by dealers.
 
Anything that talks about Reliability on a car that has not been released for more than a year must be taken with a grain of salt. I'm sure we notice that news reports everywhere is taking extreme positions to increase clicks and drive viewership. Lets just say even CR is reporting "Fake news" now for more views and get a good laugh.
 
Just out of curiosity, has anyone encountered a defect that rendered the car undrivable? Excluding accidents, flat tires, and your battery going dead.
 
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Crota said:
Anything that talks about Reliability on a car that has not been released for more than a year must be taken with a grain of salt. I'm sure we notice that news reports everywhere is taking extreme positions to increase clicks and drive viewership. Lets just say even CR is reporting "Fake news" now for more views and get a good laugh.
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Ugh... What extreme position are they taking here? They crunch numbers and report the results. If you want to take issue with the fact that small annoyance items may be weighed more heavily than they should, many people would agree with you. But please don't call something "fake news" just because the data is not favorable to your "side".
 
Texas22Step said:
Yes, Honda could have included vehicle software reporting for every detail, but really why, if the car is intended to ultimately serve a broad swath of the driving public?
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I'd pay $200 extra to get a mondo-info screen option. That option would generate more income for Honda and prevent the broad swath from becoming confused by TMI.

I want to know the values of the different factors that contribute to ICE activation. This screen would have a larger icon that lights up when the ICE is activated and will track the amount of time the ICE is running. How about a tachometer, too? I want to know when regenerative braking transitions into mechanical braking. Show me the values of the factors that contribute to the initiation of Engine Drive mode. Other cars show the flow of power in and out of the battery in kWh. I want that, too. I especially want to know when the ICE is running to provide resistance to the starter motor/generator as a way to use up excess regen braking power when the battery is fully charged. And let's open up the logic contributing to the Maintenance Minder, too.

I have more items on my list, too. Why shouldn't Honda make this information available to nerds who want to know what's going on in the mind of their Clarity PHEV? Especially if there are people like me who are willing to pay for this information that would be of no interest to the less-technical Clarity PHEV driver? OK, I'd pay $300.
 
leehinde said:
KenG said: They lost me a while back when they gave glowing reviews to the Renault Le Car....Hey CR.... see any on the road?

leehinde said: I had one of those! Hah; had to replace the engine....
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I replaced the engine in my LeCar all by myself. I'd never done anything like that before but I got the car cheap from an ex-girlfriend and I wanted to show her I could do something her new BF could not. It was quite a revelation to discover how often Renault changed the mix of parts used to assemble this car. It made for a very educational experience. My enduring memory of that car is driving in the winter with my fingers pressed into the air vent to the left of the steering wheel so that at least the tips of 3 fingers could be warm while the rest of me was freezing. I sold the car to a dad who bought it for his son to punish him for getting too many speeding tickets in his Camaro. Haven't seen one on the road in decades.
 
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I wonder how this will affect used resale value? As they said in the video for the 10 worst reliable; "These are the ones you can just knock off your list immediately." No longer being a recommended vehicle and assigning it a much worse than average predicted reliability must change the value? Life on the leading edge.......
 
Sandroad said:
I wonder how this will affect used resale value? As they said in the video for the 10 worst reliable; "These are the ones you can just knock off your list immediately." No longer being a recommended vehicle and assigning it a much worse than average predicted reliability must change the value? Life on the leading edge.......
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That’s what crossed my mind too about how CR influences many.
 
CR really needs to avoid lumping in non-safety related glitches into overall reliability. The only things considered should be major systems that would make the vehicle unsafe or undrivable.

I remember people up in arms over in the Subaru camp because our cars took a hit over infotainment system glitches.
 
Sandroad said:
I wonder how this will affect used resale value? As they said in the video for the 10 worst reliable; "These are the ones you can just knock off your list immediately." No longer being a recommended vehicle and assigning it a much worse than average predicted reliability must change the value? Life on the leading edge.......
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Unless you are selling your car now, if won't have much impact if any. The survey is repeated each year so if long-term reliability is good, your value is intact.
 
Phunny said:
Unless you are selling your car now, if won't have much impact if any. The survey is repeated each year so if long-term reliability is good, your value is intact.
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Interesting thought. I assumed that once the '18 Clarity was listed as much worse than average in reliability, it would always be listed as such (and therefore always listed as not recommended). I think I have only seen individual model year vehicles on CR's info go down in reliability, not up. I wonder if the '18 Clarity will be different and it will once again be recommended someday?
 
Industrial said:
CR really needs to avoid lumping in non-safety related glitches into overall reliability. The only things considered should be major systems that would make the vehicle unsafe or undrivable.

I remember people up in arms over in the Subaru camp because our cars took a hit over infotainment system glitches.
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Yes, I remember that too. I think it's still an issue on subaruoutback.org. I wonder how many owners it takes with Bluetooth connectivity problems because they don't read the manual to whack electrical system reliability for CR's data? Rant over.
 
The unpopularity of the Clarity as indicated by large numbers of them languishing on dealer lots (or being sold/leased well-below MSRP) does not bode well for resale value. The fact that few have ever heard of a Clarity doesn't help resale value, either. Even if you didn't qualify for the $7,500 tax credit, the resale value will reflect that discount. The march of technology doesn't work in the Clarity's favor, either.

Resale value was never part of the equation in my purchase decision. I knew I wanted one the day Honda announced there would be a plug-in variation of the Clarity Fuel Cell. Because I'm a Honda fan-boy (OK, fan-geezer), there would have to be a better Honda to make me want to sell our Clarity and that doesn't appear to be happening anytime soon. I will admit I was worried enough about reliability to purchase an extended warranty, however.
 
I am in the market for a new EV or Phev next year and Clarity was one ofof my top choices. When I heard the CR podcast I was shocked and removed it from my list. but after seeing this thread its back on. I am a software engineer in silicon valley and bugs R us. It seems the problems with the Clarity are all or mostly software related. I think in this day and age, cars have so much software in them it is bound to have bugs. Look at your phone, mine is full of them. I would be much more concerned about mechanical problems in general.

I don't expect Honda or most other car makers to focus on their software (look at the sheer number of crappy head units out there). The only exception seems to be Tesla, where Musk was formerly a software guy so perhaps he thinks like one. I haven't tried tesla's infotainment system but I suspect it's one of the best. What makes them truly unique among car makers is the Ota updates which is a must in Windows, Android, Mac Os, etc. But software updates in the car industry is probably like the unicorn. Tesla does it right with Ota updates maybe because of his software background.

CR should really categorize mechanical and software issues, not lump them.

Gearhead said:
According to CR - "The Clarity had much-worse-than-average reliability. Member-reported problems were electronic glitches that led to multiple warning lights when there wasn’t a problem, a faulty cabin temperature sensor, and the trunk failing to open. A Honda spokesman said the automaker has not seen the trunk problem in its warranty data. He said that Honda had issued two bulletins to dealers to handle the warning-light problem, and said it is working on guidance for dealers on how to handle the sensor problem."

I'm interested in your experience. I've owned my Clarity since March and other than the HV range issue the car's been flawless and a great ride.

After the CR road test review of the Clarity I lost a lot of faith in their testing. Now I have to wonder about their reliability data and analysis.
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