Canada - winter tires

There are some other topics discussing tires if you haven’t searched and read them yet.

When it comes to winters tires I buy the best ones I can afford. I don’t want to sacrifice safety to save a few bucks. Is there actually a difference between cheap ones and expensive ones…I don’t know but I don’t want to find out the hard way either.

You’re going to get lots of options and everyone’s situation is different depending on where they live. I live where we get a lot of snow mixed with wet road conditions. We are required to use winter tires from October to April. I just bought Nokian Hakkaapelitta R5’s for my 2023 Mini SE and Bridgestone Blizzaks for my 2012 Cooper S. Both are 195/55R16 as they are an easier size to find winter tires. This is our first winter with both Mini’s so I can’t speak to the winter driving of either just yet. We put both sets on separate wheels so we can swap them in our garage when needed.

 

The Tires (Summer/Winter/All-Season) thread is the main discussion on winter tires. Basically any snow tire will be good, but some will really cost you range in the SE. There's also the noise factor, since the SE doesn't make any engine noise when running.

For my SE I ended up going with Nokian snow tires because they are made for EVs and have low rolling resistance. I love the Hakkapellitta R3s I have used for two winters (and about to use for a third), but apparently they've been replaced with R5s (which I can't get). On my Clubman I have Continental winter runflats which are good for snow traction, but they are noisy (even in an ICE vehicle) and I won't use them again.

As for winter wheels, I opted for 16" because of more cushion (taller sidewall) as opposed to the 17" Power Spoke summer wheels my SE came with. I ended up ordering Spectre Grey Revolites because I wanted the lightest, most aerodynamic wheel for my SE, but any 16" or 17" wheel that fits the MINI hardtop will work. The SE can not use 15" wheels.

If you want to keep it simple, the winter wheel packages offered by MINI are decent, if not optimized for the SE. Keep in mind the cost of the wheels is a one-time purchase, they will likely outlive the life of your SE. Tires, on the other hand, need replacing every 2-3 years.

 

It will come down to the type of winters you have and what your local county/region standards are for snow removal (blading/salt/sand). I personally have had great success with Nokian Hakkapeliitta (studded and studless) in many of my previous vehicles. Personally Nokians are on the loud side.

Generally you can run 2 OEM sizes:
16 inch wheels 195/55R16 - Nokian tires are only this size
17 inch wheels 205/45R17 - limited choices

I prefer to have separate rims + tires for winter and summer. If you have a BMW club membership at your local chapter, you might be able to get a discount on parts at a BMW/MINI combined dealership which often includes TPMS (~$1,889 CAD online). If you don't like the 16" Revolite-Spoke 517 wheels then you will have to shop around on the new or used market.

 

Contact Tire Rack. The staff there is very knowledgeable, and will help you get the right tire. When I was in NY I needed a winter tire that was better on ice than in snow. In CO I need a winter tire that is better in snow than on ice.

 

THIS. Amanda is wise. I’m in Montreal as well, I don’t leave town much (not a winter sports enthusiast), and it’s well known we have the best snow clearing (no, really!) on the planet, but winter tires aren’t just about “snow.” The best winter tires have a rubber compound that works well in cold temperatures on every surface.

 

I finally slapped the R5s on today. What do you think? Every year around this time, I have to re-learn that real winter tires are squirmy, and the R5s seem no different. I think they’re a little less sharp than the R3s overall, but are way more beefy. Sad to say, I can’t wait for the first real snow to give them a test (though I really hate snow otherwise).

 

I'm way down south in NC. I'm also a Nokian fan. I run all-weather WR-G4 as winters as, well, we don't get 'real' winter down here. On my R53, they grip great on both snow and sheet ice. Perfect for what the locals refer to as 'cold' weather here.
In the frigid wastelands of Canuckia, I'd be going straight for Hakkas.
I have 195/55-16 on dedicated winter rims. I'm another believer in smallest possible winter tyres. The SE is a porker, so I went with 195s rather than the skinnier option for other f56s.
There are other good winter tyres, but I'd stay well away from cheapos. Tire rack is a great source of info.

 

Well I posted in the wrong thread (oh well) for HVAC but anyways the R5s are quieter than the R3s.

 

Just did a deep dive research on winter tires for the SE (rolling resistance and tread wear and such), and ended up with 2 choices. Nokian hakkapeliitta R5 and Michelin X ice snow.

I was going to go for the Michelin X ice snow as they are available at discount tire direct, but then I found out that Michelin had discontinued the X ice snow in the size 195/55R16. Since it could become a challenge to find a replacement tire down the road if one should get a flat that cannot be repaired, so I went for the Nokian with dedicated winter wheels.

There were plenty of great reviews on the R3 (the previous version) by Tesla owners.

As many have stated, when it comes to winter tires, I don't mind spending more for the best for my application.

Good luck.

 

As an extra unpaid pitch for the Tire Rack pros, I narrowed the choice for the 10 Cooper we bought down to two goodyears. I was on their site, texted the expert, told him how the car would be driven, and asked if we would notice a difference of $20 a tire. No! We would not notice a difference in performance etc. with the less expensive tire on that car (stressing that car). My Omega tells time just as accurately as my Timex. For some reason I didn't mind spending/wasting the money for the "better" luxury item that I didn't/don't need (includes the SE), but I do mind spending/wasting money on an added bit of performance that the car will never achieve (says the guy who told his college roommate he was wasting his money on the Warhol print of Jagger that is now worth a ton more than he paid).

I trust the experts at Tire Rack, and the reviews by the experts more than the experts on the web.

 

First of all, I think tirerack provides a great tire and wheel buying experience and they provide good information and customer service.

But we are talking about something very specific here, that is, certain characteristics of the winter tires in regards to electric vehicle application.

We are not talking about whether Cooper winter tires would provide traction in snowy or icy road conditions. We are talking about rolling resistance and tread wear for instance which would make a meaningful difference in an ev application due to the instant torque of the electric motor and range factor.

It's not about "luxury", it's about technology and Innovation.

I was actually informed by tirerack that they don't test rolling resistance on the tires. So when it comes to winter tires technology innovation testing and such, I don't think a tire rack "expert" can be compared to a tire company that invented winter tires that test their tires in the Arctic circle.

My understanding is that the blizzak is constructed with two different compounds. The softer one on the surface for traction and harder one below. So once the softer compound has worn off, the traction capabilities of the tire diminishes noticeably as the tire has transformed into somewhat of an all-season tires.

Whereas the nokian for instance uses uniform compound on their winter tires which provide a more consistent and longer lasting tread life.

Your "watch" analogy is not a valid comparison unless you equate getting from point A to point B confidently to getting from point A to point B with wheel slippage and/or fish-tailing. Not to mention if one watch stops working after 1 year and the other watch continues to work for 4 years.

It's fine that people choose to buy whatever tires they prefer for their priorities and preference, but to say that others who don't do the same are misinformed or wasteful. That simply is not true in this case.

 

Please tell me where there is something written about winter tires and rolling resistance. Anything I've read over the last 45 years says there in an inverse relationship between rolling resistance and grip. It doesn't matter if it is winter, summer, R compound, etc. If we are to go with the best tire for winter driving, that would be the one with the best traction in certain conditions, i.e. ice v snow v dry cold v dry warm. How does that have anything to do with the GOM and range? Instant torque of the electric motor in the SE is nice, but it pales to the torque of other cars I've owned and own. If one wants the best traction, as a general rule, the tire would have most rolling resistance and the shortest tread life. I think that is basic physics. If you want, a neighbor of mine is a rocket scientist. I can confirm that theory with him. Or I can ask my cousin who is a retired engineer for the big 3.

The Blizzak has two compounds. That is correct. That is because after tire after the tread depth reaches a certain amount the tire is no longer of value as a winter tire, so Bridgestone changed the compound to a longer wearing all season compound for the end of the tire's life. Please explain how a Nokian with 4/32 of tread is as good as one with 8/32 of tread, and how the Nokian compound because it is uniform, not just better than an off brand provides a longer tread life. I don't buy the consistent part because 4/32 is not as good as 8/32 in winter conditions.

But, on the other hand, I agree with the need for range. That is why manufacturers got rid of the spare, and being a firm believer in building lightness, I tossed the cigarette lighter out of all my cars. I don't want the excess weight to affect the mileage/range.

Other than should I take one lug not off each to reduce unsprung weight to increase range (and if yes, which one? the top or bottom one? ), I don't think there will be much more useful info in this thread.

 

I was not suggesting that lower rolling resistance would yield better traction. You misunderstood what I wrote.

What I was talking about is the benefits of running winter tires that provide superb grip and traction with a relative lower rolling resistance compared to the other comparable tires. And the new Hakka R5 is supposed to achieve that according to Nokian and I am sure they will be tested by various sources in the form of reviews and such. That's what innovation does, it enhances and achieves things that cannot be done before. And yes you should go ahead and ask your neighbor and your cousin to read up on the engineering reports and data on the hakkapeliitta R5 and see what they have to say.

As for my point on the uniform compound on the nokian hakkapeliitta R5. If the compound that they use provides the intended function (grip and traction and such in winter condition), such compound with such function remain to present longer because it's the same compound. We are not talking about when the tires are worn down to the point that need to be replaced soon. We are talking about when the tires wear down to the similar point when the blizzak became an all season tires but the nokian remain to be winter tires.

The low tread life of the blizzak is the reason why people (including some on this forum) to report that the blizzak last only 12k to 15k miles and at the same time people report the nokian r3 last for about 40k miles.

 

In bad weather, if a more expensive tire stops you 6 inches shorter than a less-expensive one, that small difference could save you more in repair costs (and out-of-service time) than the difference in the tire prices. Later, when you're selling your vehicle, you would not have a value-reducing collision show up on CarFax.

 

And buying the more expensive tire that looks better on paper may not be the better tire for that days weather. That's why pro teams have different sets for different circumstances and many races come down to who put the dry tires on v who put the wet tires on. Unfortunately we don't get that luxury, and have to compromise.

 

The more expensive tires in any category more often than not excel in more conditions than cheaper tires.

 

I opted for a set of Continental Extreme Contact DWS 06 Plus all seasons to get me through the cold months - was a little worried when the sales rep described the stock tires turning into hockey pucks. Although we do get a lot of lake effect snow cold etc.we also have extended periods were the roads are bare. I don't intend to drive my SE in the deep snow when we get it - just wanted something a little more aggressive if out and about and get caught in light snow. I'm a little tapped out due to tuition bills and can't spring for a set of dedicated snows at this time. When the time comes Blizzaks will be my choice - just based on previous experience.
My car is stuck at the port now for 2 weeks - may not have to worry about the cold weather.

 

This is a huge oversimplification. If the tires were identical, then yes but there's so much more that influences rolling resistance.

Ultimately rolling resistance is lost energy due to inelastic deformation (the energy lost changes to heat which is why tires warm up when used). Softer rubber does deform more in the tread but the majority of the loss is in the deformation of the sidewall. Thinner sidewalls rely more on air pressure and have less rubber deforming every revolution.

The OEM summer tires have an incredibly thin sidewall (deforms under its own weight) and are incredibly efficient. The efficiency of my all seasons (UHP BFG comp 2) and winters (X-ICE Snow) is basically identical despite the difference in rubber compound.

 

My R53 was real mess when I got it. Months later after a lot of late nights and long weekends, I had it breathing. It still had some issues. Like non functional traction control. I was low on funds after replacing or fixing so much. So it also still had Walmart 'all season' tyres on R50 rims. That was kinda fun, at times. If it was raining, stomping the throttle in the first three gears would spin the wheels. In the dry, only the first two gears. No clutch abuse needed to make smoke. There is an on-ramp on my way to work, it was no problem doing 0-90 spinning the wheels all the way.
That was a very hairy winter. Great handling saved my *** on too many occasions, if not my underpants. Spring saw good summer tyres and wheels. Next winter, Nokians went on the R50 rims. Those would only spin in 1st in the wet with TC off

Spend the money on good tyres, even if you have to eat potatoes for months.

Conti extremes are perhaps the best all season for the Mini. I hope knowing that makes those potatoes taste a little better!