Active battery TMS operation

electriceddy

electriceddy

Moderator
Staff member
Just curious, has anyone had any TMS (temperature management system) activity since owning the Kona? (cold or hot ambient temperatures)
I can only vouch for one and the ambient was about -8 C (17.6 F) when the grill shutters were closed.
So far 0 kWh losses on active TMS settings for me.(battery conditioning).
I would assume the pack to be @ ambient w/o TMS active.
Because there is no pack temp. gauge on Kona, it would be nice to record those actual ambient temps to know when to expect the TMS should cut in.
I expect we will here from owners in the south portion of USA first as these temps should start rising before Canadians see any action.( unless any Canadians have other input on cold activation of battery conditioning).
I know on my last 2 leafs I could achieve a pack temp 125 F without much effort ( drive longer distance, up and down mountain type roads, higher ambient of course and 1-3 Quick charges ).
Is the Kona pack better designed to keep the cells cooler without having to activate the TMS?
 
So far I didn't have any activity from it here in Las Vegas. We already had temps of up to 35C but I also didn't have to charge nor did I have a longer drive in these temps yet.

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Esprit1st said:
So far I didn't have any activity from it here in Las Vegas. We already had temps of up to 35C but I also didn't have to charge nor did I have a longer drive in these temps yet.

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Click to expand...
That's a little higher than I would like to see (95F) I wonder what the cut in temp to activate cooling is?
Can't be too far off, hopefully not 100F .
Would be nice to know the actual temp of the pack, due to mass and the way the core is designed it may retain some ambient cooling from night.
 
So today I had the battery care system come on for the first time (that I can tell at least).

The car sat for about 8 hours in the sun here in Vegas while I was at work. After work I remotely started the AC and drove home. Only about a 9 mile drive. I drove in eco mode and kept it in the "green".

Outside air temperature on the drive home was 37°C (98.6°F) which was after sunset.

So it seems to work great.
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Esprit1st said:
So today I had the battery care system come on for the first time (that I can tell at least).

The car sat for about 8 hours in the sun here in Vegas while I was at work. After work I remotely started the AC and drove home. Only about a 9 mile drive. I drove in eco mode and kept it in the "green".

Outside air temperature on the drive home was 37°C (98.6°F) which was after sunset.

So it seems to work great.
38a77f08a6c124135dcd41defaf8c903.jpg


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Click to expand...
FINALLY! great to see, I am so glad it cuts in before 100F , now no worries on long haul travel w/ multiple DCFCs. Thanks for the report:D
 
But how does the "Battery Care" kW reading know what portion of the heat pump HV power was being used for that purpose over "Climate"? Perhaps it is only, or additionally, 12V coolant pump power. I was under the impression that the Battery Care heading was for the battery heater, which I have but will never get used in our mild climate.
 
KiwiME said:
But how does the "Battery Care" kW reading know what portion of the heat pump HV power was being used for that purpose over "Climate"? Perhaps it is only, or additionally, 12V coolant pump power. I was under the impression that the Battery Care heading was for the battery heater, which I have but will never get used in our mild climate.
Click to expand...
Only way to prove is no AC, I don't know if Esprit1st is willing to undergo such agony just to confirm:eek:
 
I assume they are separate systems, so that's how the system would display the separate power readings. But I'm happy to check what happens if I turn off the AC. At least I have a sunroof [emoji1787].
And it's only a 15-20 minute drive home. If you see a headline on the news that a driver died of heat stroke but his car was nice and cool then that's me [emoji1787][emoji1787]

It's pretty warm again today, so I'll check on it later on the drive back home from work.

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The battery cooling can use the AC compressor instead of the coolant radiator, so that's why I'm unclear as to how it would know how much power is going where in the case of cabin AC being enabled. It's really a trivial question in the big picture but Konas in very hot environments have not been common in any of the Kona forums. I would interested in what miles your GoM reads at 100% charge as well?
Will keep an eye on LV news just in case but all going well looking forward to the results! battery temp range.webp
 
So, I drove home today without the AC (not happening again [emoji3062]). Attached is the screenshot when I got home. Just before I reached home the battery care system turned off, that's why it's showing 0kW. So I guess by the time I got home the battery was cool enough again. But throughout the drive it was right around 0.6 kW.

The climate usage was zero throughout the drive (actually it was 0.01-0.02kW). That's not even a lightbulb worth of power, so not sure what was using that little power.

After I got home I picked up my wife and getting groceries and turned on the AC. She wouldn't have liked to go without AC. However when I turned it on the climate showed about 1.5 kW usage! That was almost full fan and AC.

It would be interesting to see the difference on the GOM. But some sharp mind could probably calculate by assuming ~.6kW usage over a drive. I believe that should only be around 10-15 miles worth on the GOM for a full charge.
6c8db4faa1de661af7e853f96c2c6a52.jpg


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Hmm, so Battery Care didn't change significantly with cabin AC off.
Given the ability to discern cabin v.s. battery cooling power used on the trip with cabin AC, I wonder if the refrigeration loop cycles between the the cabin evaporator circuit and battery 'chiller' circuit rather than having both on at the same time. Noting in the elecricrevs.com article the two valves controlling those two paths. It might instead estimate the power split between those two areas if they are able to operate concurrently.
Thanks for taking a bullet for that test! Could use a bit of that heat here in NZ as we head into winter.
 
Esprit1st said:
So, I drove home today without the AC (not happening again [emoji3062]). Attached is the screenshot when I got home. Just before I reached home the battery care system turned off, that's why it's showing 0kW. So I guess by the time I got home the battery was cool enough again. But throughout the drive it was right around 0.6 kW.

The climate usage was zero throughout the drive (actually it was 0.01-0.02kW). That's not even a lightbulb worth of power, so not sure what was using that little power.

After I got home I picked up my wife and getting groceries and turned on the AC. She wouldn't have liked to go without AC. However when I turned it on the climate showed about 1.5 kW usage! That was almost full fan and AC.

It would be interesting to see the difference on the GOM. But some sharp mind could probably calculate by assuming ~.6kW usage over a drive. I believe that should only be around 10-15 miles worth on the GOM for a full charge.
6c8db4faa1de661af7e853f96c2c6a52.jpg


Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Thanks for that, glad you made it home without any help from the paramedics
 
KiwiME said:
Hmm, so Battery Care didn't change significantly with cabin AC off.
Given the ability to discern cabin v.s. battery cooling power used on the trip with cabin AC, I wonder if the refrigeration loop cycles between the the cabin evaporator circuit and battery 'chiller' circuit rather than having both on at the same time. Noting in the elecricrevs.com article the two valves controlling those two paths. It might instead estimate the power split between those two areas if they are able to operate concurrently.
Thanks for taking a bullet for that test! Could use a bit of that heat here in NZ as we head into winter.
Click to expand...
Also note that the U.S. cars have an A.C. unit not the reversing heat pump like the rest of Kona's, and may be more efficient in this TMS cooling process.
 
Just to give you guys an update:
Over the last days it was consistently around 36+°C (100+°F). With today's max at 43°C (110°F) here in Vegas. TMS working fine (haven't seen it pull more than 0.6kW) and AC working strong. I even still get about 300 miles on the gom (mostly city driving).

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Its kinda ironic, how the EV gets better range with city driving.
I was doing some research on electric motorcycles, and the difference between highway and city is almost double. It must do huge brake regen, which makes sense, cuz i find on the bike, hardly hitting the brake often at highway speed.
 
Not particularly unexpected as wind resistance is proportional to velocity squared. Motorcycles typically have poor aerodynamics and the drag component is relatively large compared to frictional losses.
ICE petrol cars have an economy sweet spot at medium speeds primarily because the engine is inefficient when throttled. EVs of course have about the same power conversion efficiency at any power level so aerodynamics is the dominant loss factor at anything but low speeds.
 
Today was the first time since I got the Kona that Battery Care/Cooling kicked in while driving..
95 degrees F and it came on during city driving.
Pulled 0.56 kw..

20190715_165743.webp
 
KiwiME said:
35°C, just about the hottest we saw the last summer in NZ but have never seen that come on.
Click to expand...
It ia 34 to 34 C around here almost every day from June to September... Winters are more comfortable with average high around 23 C.. It's not quite as hot closer to the coast but I'm about 80 km from the closest beaches..
 
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