Clarity Issues

[David Towle]

I will try that next time. I tend not to use ACC around town. My guess is that ACC will provide more regen because the paddles were insufficient to prevent the car from picking up speed and I had to apply the brakes to avoid grossly exceeding the 50 mph speed limit long before I reached the stop light at the bottom of the hill.

I have been surprised at the lack of regen. I thought I was getting only 3 chevrons during the winter because it was cold and the battery couldn't take much, but today the temps were in the seventies and many times I felt a lack of regen and looked down to see only 3 chevrons (while in sport) and pulling the handle more didn't get me 4. This was while driving on the highway at 72 with a full range of SOC from full to 2 bars. Occasionally I did get 4 but not often. Why? Does anyone ever get 4 chevrons consistently?

 

[Groves Cooke]

"Does anyone ever get 4 chevrons consistently?"

I do every time unless the battery is completely charged.

 

[David Towle]

"Does anyone ever get 4 chevrons consistently?"

I do every time unless the battery is completely charged.

OK I guess there's clearly something wrong with my car then i'll have to bring up with the dealer. Not that they'll fix anything.

 

[PascoClarity]

I get 4 unless my speed is above about 45 mph, then it will only get 3. Protects the battery.

 

[RogerB]

I get 4 unless my speed is above about 45 mph, then it will only get 3. Protects the battery.

I noticed mine stopping at 3 the other day and was wondering what was up, but that would explain it. Thanks!

 

[Pegsie]

Page 391 of the owner's manual lists situations where it won't go to 4 chevrons. Doesn't say what speed that happens, but I've experienced it blinking/alarm @ 3 chevrons when I've been at highway speeds.

Edit: Just looked at the page again, it only says deceleration may be limited if vehicle speed is high and sport mode OFF.

 

[ClarityBill]

Kind of an old topic, but I ran my Clarity down to zero EV miles with OBDII recording. (AutoEnginuity)

Chart is attached. I started the drive with almost 90% battery. Started in EV mode to get down to my normal HV mode SOC. I ran HV mode until I got up the nerve to run to EV 0. At 11:36 I stopped at Wendy's for dinner and frosty to keep up my courage.

It displayed zero miles about 11% battery, and never came off zero for the half hour test.

Clarity operated as it normally would in HV mode. I did not select HV, but it went to that mode automatically. It was in ACC (cruise control), and never seemed to have trouble maintaining 72 mph. The interstate is a gradual incline. ICE started and rev'd to get some charge back. Then cycled on and off as it normally would in HV mode. Was in gear mode a couple times.

The weather was about 65F (first time in a long time), so there was no climate control load. For a further test, about 12:13 I turned on the heater full blast, going up a hill. The ICE rev'd higher, but maintained speed. SOC dropped to a low of 2.84%. I never saw it go to one bar on the battery GOM (stayed at two bars): I was trying to watch, but Frosty and laptop were fighting for my attention.

I ended the test because the interstate was heading into a significant down slope, and I thought it would just be shutting off the ICE. After I ended the test, I went to HV charge mode. Battery SOC came up, but EV range did not respond until it jumped from zero to 1.9. EV range continued to increase in jumps of 1 to 2 miles, display did not increase gradually.

The test section is a section of interstate that I have traveled several times in 'gear mode', but sometimes requires a double click to get into gear mode - This was not possible at zero battery, because the system had opted to HV automatically.

 

[Clarity_Newbie]

I've wondered, is it possible that the ACC can provide more regen than 4 chevrons of paddle? You could help answer that question. The next time you go down that 9% grade, set the ACC to see if it gains more regenerated battery power than you can recover with the paddles. Thanks.

I will try that next time. I tend not to use ACC around town. My guess is that ACC will provide more regen because the paddles were insufficient to prevent the car from picking up speed and I had to apply the brakes to avoid grossly exceeding the 50 mph speed limit long before I reached the stop light at the bottom of the hill.

I can vouch that ACC mode is very efficient in adding regen miles to the EV range. Instinct tells me it is safe to say ACC is equal to or greater than paddles during a long downgrade. I added 4 miles on a recent trip driving a route I hadn't completed in the Clarity.

Hope this helps

 

[Clarity_Newbie]

Kind of an old topic, but I ran my Clarity down to zero EV miles with OBDII recording. (AutoEnginuity)

Chart is attached. I started the drive with almost 90% battery. Started in EV mode to get down to my normal HV mode SOC. I ran HV mode until I got up the nerve to run to EV 0. At 11:36 I stopped at Wendy's for dinner and frosty to keep up my courage.

It displayed zero miles about 11% battery, and never came off zero for the half hour test.

Clarity operated as it normally would in HV mode. I did not select HV, but it went to that mode automatically. It was in ACC (cruise control), and never seemed to have trouble maintaining 72 mph. The interstate is a gradual incline. ICE started and rev'd to get some charge back. Then cycled on and off as it normally would in HV mode. Was in gear mode a couple times.

The weather was about 65F (first time in a long time), so there was no climate control load. For a further test, about 12:13 I turned on the heater full blast, going up a hill. The ICE rev'd higher, but maintained speed. SOC dropped to a low of 2.84%. I never saw it go to one bar on the battery GOM (stayed at two bars): I was trying to watch, but Frosty and laptop were fighting for my attention.

I ended the test because the interstate was heading into a significant down slope, and I thought it would just be shutting off the ICE. After I ended the test, I went to HV charge mode. Battery SOC came up, but EV range did not respond until it jumped from zero to 1.9. EV range continued to increase in jumps of 1 to 2 miles, display did not increase gradually.

The test section is a section of interstate that I have traveled several times in 'gear mode', but sometimes requires a double click to get into gear mode - This was not possible at zero battery, because the system had opted to HV automatically.

ClarityBill

Seems like the data you collected at SoC = 10% EV = 0 is similar to mine. Good to have more data points.

The one observation which sticks out is SoC = ~2.5. The lowest I have recorded is ~6.25. Very interesting the SoC bar didn't go to one bar at ~5.0.

My SoC = ~10% EV = 0 tests have been at high speeds of 65 mph versus your top speed of ~70 mph...explanation for the ~2.5 SoC versus ~6.25? One wouldn't think 5 mph would make that much difference.

More data needed.

 

[ClarityBill]

Clarity_Newbie

I was also surprised that SoC meter did not go to one bar, but it may just have a slow response time: I was not below 5% for that long. The EV range responded slowly when coming back up.

I only experienced the ~2.5 SoC when I turned the heater to HI with full fan speed (cabin got very hot,, but would have been normal operation for the last 3 months). I was 6-8% before I turned on the heater. Seems like my SoC at 72 mph was similar to yours at 65 mph, when I had the heater on auto during a 65F day (first warm day in months).

 

[Clarity_Newbie]

For sure, the Clarity should run normally through low SOC 2 bars into HV, after all that was the premise of their national TV ad campaign. For a month or so last year, the ads ran non-stop. "The end of your battery charge isn't the end of the world. It runs and electric, and has gas if you need it ... "


On the other hand, if I read your take away correctly, perceived "sudden high revving" at EV battery 2 bars is actually a repeatable about 30% increase in engine RPM at 2 bars. (TBD, I understand your most interesting study is ongoing.)

Therefore, those intentionally keeping some SOC above 2 bars can enjoy a somewhat quieter ride? Or maybe not, because you are going to get charging revs at any SOC.

Maybe your point is that on those longer drives, it matters less where you choose to leave SOC about a previous number of EV bars when HV is intentionally turned on because you are going to eventually experience the higher RPMs one way or the other (either to hold 2 bars, or to hold some higher number of EV bars). Which begs the question, would there by any advantage, short of actual mountains (or, disadvantage) to running at a higher SOC, or even in HV charge mode ("mountain mode") vs. just running at 2 bars? (I'm guessing the preliminary is answer is no, thus the the BS comment.)

So, I for one, like having some EV reserve, at least to use on local roads, when I get "there". But, maybe the point is, that's okay and nice, but don't expect any relation to angry bees.

edited still more

sniwallof

There are two take-a-way's I offer for this SoC = ~10 EV =0 test...As far as I can tell...the car should operate just fine after transitioning to HV mode automatically.

The noise level/tolerance is subjective. The Clarity I drive experienced an increase of RPM's ~30% to ~3100. That noise level is very tolerable to me. If someone else reaches the same levels and they consider it "extreme noise"...then by all means do not allow the Clarity to drop below EV=10 (or whatever measure they use). No harm no foul.

However, iF during SoC = ~10 EV = 0 the RPMs greatly exceed say 4000 for no apparent reason...then perhaps the Clarity should be looked at. The issue is not how the noise is perceived...but rather...how high is the Clarity actually revving? And why?

Normal revving may be up to 4000 rpms but if it goes to 5000...perhaps it is not operating correctly. Therefore...if owners have questions of "how high" and "why"...they should collect some data. Personally I would be concerned if the Clarity I drive routinely exceeds 4000 rpms...as of now it is a rarity...or definitely if it breaches 5000.

The other take-a-way is the lack of performance issues...in other words...at SoC = ~10 EV = 0...the Clarity I drive exhibits the exact same performance as when fully charged. No drop off what-so-ever in performance.

So if a person thinks/actually has experienced a performance issue during low SoC..then perhaps Honda should investigate these vehicles.

Ultimately, folks should feel 100% confident that the Clarity they drive will perform as advertised with no loss of anything...period...regardless of SoC...and the RPM range will be within "normal". I firmly believe if an owner is managing the Clarity because they are "nervous or afraid or anxious" about the Clarity when it reaches low SoC...that is the BS I am talking about.

I actually state in the OP reference this video...I rarely allow my clarity to drop below EV=10/SoC ~25%. The reason is 100% related to battery health...nothing to do with noise or performance issues.

All statements should be viewed in context. Usual caveats...driving habits, terrain, speed, etc. etc. etc.

The goal remains to give Clarity owners with an inquiring mind at least one point of reference.

Hope this helps.

 

[tom kirshbaum]

I think all ev's should have the charge port in the front on the nose of the car.

Given how my garage is arranged, I would then be unable to charge the car in my garage.

 

[insightman]

Enter your reply text after the /QUOTE tag, please.

 

[tom kirshbaum]

Given the following: The car had automatically shifted from EV to HV as designed, when suddenly the ICE revved up and speed declined...

Suppose one has been operating the car in HV at two bars of battery and for whatever reason — a long, imperceptibly gradual uphill, a series of them in the recent past, a headwind, sudden temperature change, heavily loaded car, the driver steps on the accelerator leading the computer to predict a higher speed — the battery has drained to a dangerous level... supposing any or all of these, wouldn’t this constitute “normal” performance of the vehicle? If the battery is done and the puny engine can’t keep up the speed, what else could the car do but slow down?

Dangerous, to be sure. But what are the alternatives? I’d propose a very large, very bright, warning, along with buzzer or bell. The car IS GOING TO SLOW DOWN SO GET OFF THE ROAD WITHIN THE NEXT FIVE MILES AND CHARGE YOUR BATTERY etc.

What else is there? Increase the buffer, decreasing ev miles? Tubocharge the engine? Bigger engine?

 

[Mark W]

Given the following: The car had automatically shifted from EV to HV as designed, when suddenly the ICE revved up and speed declined...

Suppose one has been operating the car in HV at two bars of battery and for whatever reason — a long, imperceptibly gradual uphill, a series of them in the recent past, a headwind, sudden temperature change, heavily loaded car, the driver steps on the accelerator leading the computer to predict a higher speed — the battery has drained to a dangerous level... supposing any or all of these, wouldn’t this constitute “normal” performance of the vehicle? If the battery is done and the puny engine can’t keep up the speed, what else could the car do but slow down?

Dangerous, to be sure. But what are the alternatives? I’d propose a very large, very bright, warning, along with buzzer or bell. The car IS GOING TO SLOW DOWN SO GET OFF THE ROAD WITHIN THE NEXT FIVE MILES AND CHARGE YOUR BATTERY etc.

What else is there? Increase the buffer, decreasing ev miles? Tubocharge the engine? Bigger engine?

The battery should never drain to a dangerous level. The two bars should provide enough buffer for the car to rev as high as it needs to to keep enough battery/engine power to power the car adequately.

 

[gp2003gt]

Ok I was finally able to duplicate the high revs and other issues (up to 16 now) and make videos.
I put 3 examples below, check the other videos on my you tube channel, it is pretty crazy to have so many issues and Honda does not do anything.
High vs:

Engine turning on by itself when barely accelerating an battery full:

HV only and battery starts charging:


To shed light on the issue: 1) Dealerships and Honda will never admit that something is wrong with the car because the minute they do, if they cannot fix it we can go after them through lemon law or class action. This is why we (group of people having High revs issues or other electronic problems) have been told that nothing is wrong with the car or that they cannot fix because they cannot duplicate.

2) Arbitration does not work, went through that, lots of stress and waste of time. Honda lied through their teeth to save their butt + whatever the arbitrator said, they are not following (fix car and have specialist come inspect vehicle).

3) Per Lemon law expert I hired, Honda has changed the way they handle claims, they prefers to go to court and drain you of all your money and time + bring an outside engineer that will say: I did not build the car but I do not see anything wrong with it. If you don't have deep pocket you are guaranteed to lose.

So after 8 months of battling and sending over 20 videos and photos to the dealership to show the issues I got to a point were Honda sent me a letter saying that they were done and the dealer refused that I drop the car off. Yes I am not kidding!

I finally sent the dealership a nasty email telling them that I had contacted all the news channels, my insurance company (do this if you have the high revs), with the you tube link to the high revs and if they didn't fix my car immediately I would sue them. Well, I received a phone call yesterday and they are sending a specialist. Now I am not sure if it will work but we might have some progress and maybe a fix down the road.

PS: Has anyone seen on carcomplaint.com that 2 people got stuck wide open and totaled their car? One got injured. Very scary when your car has over 15 different electronic issue and Honda doesn't give a crap about you!

I responded to most of your videos, take a look, you do not know how this car works, most salesman don't know how it works, look at my responses.

 

[Yannick]

I responded to most of your videos, take a look, you do not know how this car works, most salesman don't know how it works, look at my responses.

Don't tell me that I don't know how the car works, I have 18 different issues with the car and Honda doesn't do crap about it. How can you say something like that when the car goes up to 5200 RPM and not even on HV charge or when it stays stuck in high revs for over 7 miles even on flat on decline and at low speed until I gave up and turned it off. You want to test drive your car and then mine to compare?

 

[petteyg359]

Don't tell me that I don't know how the car works

You turned on HV, the engine comes on to warm up. You're stopped. Of course it's going to start charging. Where else do you think that power is going to go?

"It's obviously revving pretty high" you say. No, actually it obviously isn't. Low pitch = low RPM. As you say yourself, "we can hear it".

You're blatantly ignoring the blue bar. You have a full battery. Of course it isn't going to engage the engine until it actually needs the power or has somewhere to store the excess.

You may (assuming you're not trolling, given the control obviously works later in the same video) have an issue with the directional buttons, but your other videos ain't helping your case.

 

[RickSE]

You turned on HV, the engine comes on to warm up. You're stopped. Of course it's going to start charging. Where else do you think that power is going to go?

"It's obviously revving pretty high" you say. No, actually it obviously isn't. Low pitch = low RPM. As you say yourself, "we can hear it".

You're blatantly ignoring the blue bar. You have a full battery. Of course it isn't going to engage the engine until it actually needs the power or has somewhere to store the excess.

You may (assuming you're not trolling, given the control obviously works later in the same video) have an issue with the directional buttons, but your other videos ain't helping your case.

Yannick - I agree with petteyg. You don’t know how the car works. I watched the three videos and what you are seeing looks pretty normal to me after the six months I’ve driven my Clarity.

 

[Fast Eddie B]

Addressing the first video, the when you put the car in HV, it will do it’s best to maintain the 8 miles of EV you had when you pushed the button. That algorithm will use the ICE to do so when required, albeit in a way that’s difficult to predict.

Perfectly normal, and not “crazy” at all.