So that's what the Angry Bees sound like!!

[insightman]

Clarity has the same engine as Insight (1.5l 105 hp), but weighs 1,100 lbs more.

Honda lists 103 hp for the Clarity's 1498 cc engine, but 107 hp for the Insight's 1498 cc engine so they're not exactly the same. Almost every reviewer complained about the Insight's loud engine. Those reviewers haven't made the mental readjustment required to accept that the disconnection of the accelerator pedal from the engine speed is what enables the i-MMD system to provide such great fuel economy.

 

[Agzand]

Honda lists 103 hp for the Clarity's 1498 cc engine, but 107 hp for the Insight's 1498 cc engine so they're not exactly the same. Almost every reviewer complained about the Insight's loud engine. Those reviewers haven't made the mental readjustment required to accept that the disconnection of the accelerator pedal from the engine speed is what enables the i-MMD system to provide such great fuel economy.

Minor difference in HP could be due to different exhaust system. Clarity exhaust could be more restricted, it is routed through the right flank of the car next to the battery. Insight probably has a more traditional exhaust like the regular Civic. The comment about accelerator pedal is valid. You need to get used to the engine behavior.

 

[barnesgj]

I reported on the high revs (before the term 'angry bees' was coined) when I first picked up my car last Jan. And, I have been annoyed by and have complained about the sound since. I hear it every time the ICE comes on, and it's especially loud when there is no highway noise to drown it out (such as slow speeds on residential streets). That said, I have come to believe that the sound is relative to what we're used to. I agree that it sounds like a car stuck in 1st gear; however, I have been driving a Nissan Versa while my Clarity is getting body work done and immediately upon driving it off the rental lot, I gained a new appreciation for just how loud a small engine can rev. I no longer think my Clarity bees are actually 'angry.' Maybe, a bit 'annoyed' or just 'overly excited.' One thing is certain. When I get my car back, I will never complain about them again.

 

[ClarityBill]

I still don't like the high rpms (over 4000), but mine seems to be very predictable. If the battery drops too much during engine warmup, the engine has to make up too much SOC when it first engages the generator. I can control my angry bees by just switching to HV at a better time: I need to switch when I am not getting ready to accelerate more than 50 mph. I still get high 3K's on some hills, but avoiding my worst is reasonable.

 

[Annai1]

Sounds good but why? Does anyone understand what is going on in the brain of the car to warrant the ICE revving to redline, flat terrain, 50% EV charge, in HV mode not HV Charge?
Nearly every reply to my original post had little to do with the issue. But rather turned into a thread about modes. I drive the car every day and think I have a good understanding of the mode options.

The question remains why the heck does the ICE behave like that? If someone has some knowledge about the engineering plan here please share...thanks!

Dave I share your frustration (if I may call it). I bought Clarity with great expectations. But it has NOT lived up so far. Angry Bees is a terrible thing. I drive about 80 miles a day in Los Angeles area which is in 70's for most of the year. Battery only lasts for about 40 to 45 miles (which is lower than advertised range!), and the Angry Bees kick in everyday for the last 30 miles or so. It almost makes me feel I am driving a big SEMI TRUCK. Even my 10 year old corolla with 120k miles on it DOES NOT sound so loud! HOW can Honda design a PHEV with such loud ICE (or HV) engine mode!! totally disappointed. When I bought 6 months ago, I was so impressed with the quiet EV mode, never cared to test the ICE performance. I almost feel the dealer & Honda tricked me into buying this. Hindsight, I should have leased it. For people who are saying they have not heard the angry bees, please turn off your radio and turn on HV mode with 50% charge remaining. If you still don't hear it, I would get your ears checked... it is a DESIGN FLAW GUYS.

 

[Annai1]

I noticed that when in HV mode the transition between un-clutched and direct-drive mode at about 45 MPH quiets the engine noise/harshness significantly.
It makes me wonder if Honda reduced flywheel weight and consequently clutching to the drive motor adds mass to smooth the engine feel.
I don't think I ever got the engine past 3500 RPM in HV recharge, but at that speed it was not silky smooth, more like a roar.
Not sure I want to hear it at 5000 RPM.
If something were wrong, like a rotor coming apart in the generator or motor (or parts loose in the case) you'd probably hear noise all the time.

To me a 2019 Model year car should be technologically advanced enough that a driver should not worry about when and what RPM to drive or which mode to select or figuring out the internal workings of a motor or ICE. Paying so much $$ for a PHEV, I expect it to run quiet and smooth. period. nether is happening with Clarity. feeling stuck w this junk.

 

[Sandroad]

To me a 2019 Model year car should be technologically advanced enough that a driver should not worry about when and what RPM to drive or which mode to select or figuring out the internal workings of a motor or ICE. Paying so much $$ for a PHEV, I expect it to run quiet and smooth. period. nether is happening with Clarity. feeling stuck w this junk.

Bummer about your frustrations. Since all of your posts have been complaints and you're obviously unhappy with the car, it's probably good you didn't lease, because you can just sell/trade it and get something you like. I had a similar experience a few years ago when I bought a new pickup truck that it turned out I really didn't like after only a short time. I decided life was too short to be stuck with something that didn't work for me, so I just took the loss and moved on. I'm really glad I did, because otherwise I would have been unhappy every day I drove it. Check with your dealer and see if they will help you with a trade for something like an Accord that operates like you expect it to and takes no driver involvement.

 

[Annai1]

Bummer about your frustrations. Since all of your posts have been complaints and you're obviously unhappy with the car, it's probably good you didn't lease, because you can just sell/trade it and get something you like. I had a similar experience a few years ago when I bought a new pickup truck that it turned out I really didn't like after only a short time. I decided life was too short to be stuck with something that didn't work for me, so I just took the loss and moved on. I'm really glad I did, because otherwise I would have been unhappy every day I drove it. Check with your dealer and see if they will help you with a trade for something like an Accord that operates like you expect it to and takes no driver involvement.

Yea. I am thinking about it. never a Honda again! lol.

 

[KentuckyKen]

To me a 2019 Model year car should be technologically advanced enough that a driver should not worry about when and what RPM to drive or which mode to select or figuring out the internal workings of a motor or ICE. Paying so much $$ for a PHEV, I expect it to run quiet and smooth. period. nether is happening with Clarity. feeling stuck w this junk.

Sorry to hear about your experience with low range (no cold weather) and high reving. That would frustrate me too.
I do not think your high reving/ angry bees is a universal design flaw since many of us have never experienced it. My ICE has never gotten above an idle like speed except on a long steep hill when it only increased to a pleasant mid speed kind of like my old gasmobile down shifting from high gear/over drive on a hill.
May I suggest you try a hard reset by disconnecting the 12v battery for a few minutes. At least one person got inprovement by doing this. You will get multiple warning messages afterwards but they will go away after some driving. Then the range will reset itself also after it accumulates some trip history. No guarantee it will help, but it’s worth a shot since it increased range and decreased high reving for one poster.
As to your EV range being less than the EPA 47 miles, what was your speed and was there an elevation increase?
Speeds over 65 will dramatically decrease EV range. High speed and cold weather (battery physics and heater use) reducing EV range are the dirty little secrets of all electric vehicles.
Pleas let us know if you try a hard reset and if it changes anything.

 

[ClarityBill]

So, I thought I had the RPM's figured out... I just drove I88 backwards, and had higher RPM's: It never settled into the stable RPM's. When the RPM's went over 4000, the cabin noise seemed loud, so I turned on my sound analyzer. Cabin was up around 80 dB.

 

[JimW]

My experience is that there is a big difference in need for higher revving ICE between fully loaded car and driver only, and between going 60-65 and 75-85. With just me, no luggage, and interstate speeds in 60-65 range, the 4-banger noise is not objectionable (Kentucky Ken mode). With 4 adults, trunk full of luggage, and 75+ highway speeds in northern VA on Christmas trip, the ICE seemed to be in 3000-3500 RPM range, with family members asking if car was OK. But was perfectly logical as the energy has to come from somewhere.

I took back roads across the mountains yesterday coming home from NC, and used paddles and sport mode. Was not at all like the fun of driving a sport sedan where engine sound is tied to torque and acceleration through turns, but the car handles surprisingly well for a 4000 lb family sedan (while getting 40+ MPG) and I just turned up the radio to mask the CVT-style engine sound.

As stated in above posts, the engine sound is really dependent on your driving mode.

 

[Annai1]

Sorry to hear about your experience with low range (no cold weather) and high reving. That would frustrate me too.
I do not think your high reving/ angry bees is a universal design flaw since many of us have never experienced it. My ICE has never gotten above an idle like speed except on a long steep hill when it only increased to a pleasant mid speed kind of like my old gasmobile down shifting from high gear/over drive on a hill.
May I suggest you try a hard reset by disconnecting the 12v battery for a few minutes. At least one person got inprovement by doing this. You will get multiple warning messages afterwards but they will go away after some driving. Then the range will reset itself also after it accumulates some trip history. No guarantee it will help, but it’s worth a shot since it increased range and decreased high reving for one poster.
As to your EV range being less than the EPA 47 miles, what was your speed and was there an elevation increase?
Speeds over 65 will dramatically decrease EV range. High speed and cold weather (battery physics and heater use) reducing EV range are the dirty little secrets of all electric vehicles.
Pleas let us know if you try a hard reset and if it changes anything.

Can you help me how do hard reset by disconnecting the 12v battery? are you talking about the small battery under the hood?

 

[KentuckyKen]

Can you help me how do hard reset by disconnecting the 12v battery? are you talking about the small battery under the hood?

Yes. The 12v battery at passenger side front of engine bay. Just disconnect at the negative post for a few minutes.

 

[MrFixit]

how many tens of thousands are out on the road now?

18,602 to be exact !!! (well, that's the total for 2018... There were also a few in 2017?).
In case you haven't seen it, Domenick has an EXCELLENT section on this site that tracks Plug-in EV sales.

You can see all the details here:
https://insideevs.com/monthly-plug-in-sales-scorecard/

The 2018 results are very interesting. The Clarity landed at #5... Who beat us out?
#1 Tesla Model 3 - 139,782
#2 Prius Prime - 27,595
#3 Tesla Model X - 26,100
#4 Tesla Model S - 25,745
#5 Clarity - 18,602
#6 Chevy Volt - 18,306
#7 Chevy Bolt - 18,019

We beat both the Volt and the Bolt !!! (and the Leaf)
Quite a milestone (although sadly, the Volt is coming to an end).

 

[Atkinson]

Kudos to Honda engineers for the no compromise "running the engine in the sweet spot" for efficiency.
Unfortunately, the disconnect between driving behavior and engine RPM can be tedious in some situations.