Safety feature or danger?

[ashmtl]

I had a big surprise when the front car stopped and I changed my lane to the right and my vehicle (2020 Clarity) hit the brakes in emergency. I heard the warning beep of collision prevention system when I was almost in the right lane and it was all clear in front of me. I was lucky the vehicle behind me had a good distance to stop too. I had to get out and apologize for my car's behaviour, but the other vehicle's driver looked at me like I was saying crazy things.
After that incident I set the collision safety distance to the minimum possible. I think the Honda should work on it's system to eliminate the lag and set the correction fast when the radar gets an "all clear" reading. Imagine if there would be ice on the road and the vehicle decides to hit the brakes? I would lose control completely, because stepping on the gas pedal changes nothing. Maybe I should keep this feature off in winters.

 

[JFon101231]

Hmm I'll have to look into that setting too. I have also had similar issues, though mine generally happen at speeds under 25 mph when a car in front of me is turning right into a driveway etc. I can visually confirm I have plenty of clearance but car isn't "smart" enough to know they are moving out of the lane in a perpendicular direction... has scared my kids and I've had similar concerns someone will rear end me.

 

[Landshark]

I find those features to be annoying to the point that I’ve disabled them. Whether they are a safety feature or a danger would probably depend on the particular circumstances surrounding the incident.

The ABS should allay fears of losing control. You have, however, surrendered some control by allowing these features to be functional.

As far as rear ending goes, the rear ender is almost always found to be at fault for failing to be in control of their vehicle.

 

[JFon101231]

As far as rear ending goes, the rear ender is almost always found to be at fault for failing to be in control of their vehicle.

Don't disagree, but have better things to do than deal with a damaged car and everything that goes with it for something that would be "artificially" closed. I'm gonna adjust settings and should be good enough for me

 

[Recoil45]

I had a big surprise when the front car stopped and I changed my lane to the right and my vehicle (2020 Clarity) hit the brakes in emergency. I heard the warning beep of collision prevention system when I was almost in the right lane and it was all clear in front of me. I was lucky the vehicle behind me had a good distance to stop too. I had to get out and apologize for my car's behaviour, but the other vehicle's driver looked at me like I was saying crazy things.
After that incident I set the collision safety distance to the minimum possible. I think the Honda should work on it's system to eliminate the lag and set the correction fast when the radar gets an "all clear" reading. Imagine if there would be ice on the road and the vehicle decides to hit the brakes? I would lose control completely, because stepping on the gas pedal changes nothing. Maybe I should keep this feature off in winters.

There is a reason most people disable these systems.


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[Landshark]

but have better things to do than deal with a damaged car and everything that goes with it for something that would be "artificially" closed.

Agree, dealing with a car accident is no fun. It’s just my personal preference to have control of the car, other than ABS, rather than rely, depend on or expect the car to behave in a manner that saves my cheese.

Would you clarify what you mean by something that would be “artificially” closed? Thanks.

 

[PHEVDave]

I had a big surprise when the front car stopped and I changed my lane to the right and my vehicle (2020 Clarity) hit the brakes in emergency. I heard the warning beep of collision prevention system when I was almost in the right lane and it was all clear in front of me. I was lucky the vehicle behind me had a good distance to stop too. I had to get out and apologize for my car's behaviour, but the other vehicle's driver looked at me like I was saying crazy things.
After that incident I set the collision safety distance to the minimum possible. I think the Honda should work on it's system to eliminate the lag and set the correction fast when the radar gets an "all clear" reading. Imagine if there would be ice on the road and the vehicle decides to hit the brakes? I would lose control completely, because stepping on the gas pedal changes nothing. Maybe I should keep this feature off in winters.

Hopefully you wouldn’t completely lose control as the ABS should mitigate that. In fact, for many of us old timers it may be a little difficult just to mash the brake pedal in rain, snow, or ice since that goes completely against the way we were taught.
But I do appreciate your concern with the automatic braking system. It seems to be a bit of a two-edged sword.

 

[turtleturtle]

I grew up driving in the snow and regularly turn off the VSC if the roads are snowed or iced; I like to feel when it slips or grips. Can relate.

I do wonder about liability. If you turn off the auto brake and someone is injured, I’m sure a lawyer could use it to show intentional recklessness.

 

[ralfalfa]

Unfortunately I have this problem repeatedly, and the inability to turn the automatic braking system off completely is my single biggest beef with the car. I have a daily commute of 30+ miles round trip and at least once a month someone cuts me off on a 4-lane city road while I'm being tailgated in turn. Safest thing for me to do is quickly shift lanes, but the Clarity makes me stop dead. The system is in effect not allowing a forward recovery and removing any option beyond a possible rear-end collision at relatively lower speed. I set the autobrake limit to the lowest possible setting within the first week of owning the car as a result.
Being objective about this, I haven't been hit yet; so can I honestly prove it's put me or my car in danger? No, and maybe for those whose responses are slow or whose driving instincts are conservative, the auto-braking as implements is statistically the safest bet. But son of a b---- does it makes me angry that I don't get to use my own judgement on how best to avoid a driver in front of me.

 

[Landshark]

Unfortunately I have this problem repeatedly, and the inability to turn the automatic braking system off completely is my single biggest beef with the car.

If you’re referring to the Collision Mitigation Braking System, CMBS, aka: Car May Brake Suddenly, there is a switch/button near the drivers left knee that will disable the feature. At least on the US models. It must be disabled each time the car is started.

 

[ashmtl]

Don't disagree, but have better things to do than deal with a damaged car and everything that goes with it for something that would be "artificially" closed. I'm gonna adjust settings and should be good enough for me

If you’re referring to the Collision Mitigation Braking System, CMBS, aka: Car May Brake Suddenly, there is a switch/button near the drivers left knee that will disable the feature. At least on the US models. It must be disabled each time the car is started.

I know about the button and yes it is present in Canadian models too. But will you disagree that it is better to have a permanent setting in the driver preferences section? To me it is more important than the color of my screen or how many times my car will chirp when the doors are closed...

 

[Landshark]

I would prefer to have a feature remain off once I turn it off.

Revisiting this thread has me wondering again about the phrase: “artificially” closed. No idea what that means.

 

[ashmtl]

I find those features to be annoying to the point that I’ve disabled them. Whether they are a safety feature or a danger would probably depend on the particular circumstances surrounding the incident.

The ABS should allay fears of losing control. You have, however, surrendered some control by allowing these features to be functional.

As far as rear ending goes, the rear ender is almost always found to be at fault for failing to be in control of their vehicle.

If we are talking wet asphalt or packed snow, no problem, the ABS works. Slush and ice, no help from ABS. I had that situation three times in a month two winters back with my Audi Q3. The only way to avoid collision was to change the lanes (twice) and squeeze between two parked cars on the right (once), fortunately there was enough distance. Imagine now doing the steering wheel adjustment when your front wheel are in breaking mode, similar to having pushed the break pedal to the floor!
I live in Quebec and we have a no fault insurance here, which means that every insurance company pays for it's own clients and can not request the damages to be paid by the in-fault party's insurance. This results in premium raising for both sides, fault or no fault. If I get a claim with my insurance, I will be penalised for that.

 

[MrFixit]

Slush and ice, no help from ABS. I had that situation three times in a month two winters back with my Audi Q3. The only way to avoid collision was to change the lanes (twice) and squeeze between two parked cars on the right (once), fortunately there was enough distance.

You stated 'no help' from ABS for this scenario, but don't you think it was the ABS that enabled you to do these meneuvers to avoid a collision? The ABS doesn't just help you to stop, but rather, it helps to maintain some steering capability while traction is poor.

 

[ashmtl]

You stated 'no help' from ABS for this scenario, but don't you think it was the ABS that enabled you to do these meneuvers to avoid a collision? The ABS doesn't just help you to stop, but rather, it helps to maintain some steering capability while traction is poor.

Not at all. When I hit the brakes, all four wheels locked and the car started to slide towards the front vehicle as if going in neutral. I released the brakes and steered out of the way. And keep in mind that with front wheel drive, even the release of accelerator pedal will create the front wheel lock.

 

[MrFixit]

When I hit the brakes, all four wheels locked and the car started to slide towards the front vehicle as if going in neutral

I can't dispute your experience, but this is exactly what ABS is designed to prevent. Your wheels should never 'lock' even when on glare ice. The brakes should modulate (alternating on / off) allowing the wheels to still rotate some in order to maintain some steering. It is not perfect, but usually quite good at this.

 

[Landshark]

I had that situation three times in a month two winters back with my Audi Q3. The only way to avoid collision was to change the lanes (twice) and squeeze between two parked cars on the right (once), fortunately there was enough distance. Imagine now doing the steering wheel adjustment when your front wheel are in breaking mode, similar to having pushed the break pedal to the floor!
I live in Quebec and we have a no fault insurance here, which means that every insurance company pays for it's own clients and can not request the damages to be paid by the in-fault party's insurance. This results in premium raising for both sides, fault or no fault. If I get a claim with my insurance, I will be penalised for that.

Maybe you should consider slowing down based on the road conditions, or moving from Quebec to an area that doesn’t have no-fault insurance.

If your wheels “locked” the ABS was not functioning properly.

 

[ashmtl]

I can't dispute your experience, but this is exactly what ABS is designed to prevent. Your wheels should never 'lock' even when on glare ice. The brakes should modulate (alternating on / off) allowing the wheels to still rotate some in order to maintain some steering. It is not perfect, but usually quite good at this.

Yes and you are right. But there is a condition, if at least one of the wheels has different traction then the others. If all four are on ice and stopped turning, the ABS will decide that you are stopped. You can try this if you find an abandoned parking lot that is covered with ice. You will eventually stop, but that will take time and distance that you do not usually have in a city traffic.

 

[ashmtl]

Maybe you should consider slowing down based on the road conditions, or moving from Quebec to an area that doesn’t have no-fault insurance.

If your wheels “locked” the ABS was not functioning properly.

I like the idea about moving out of the province. I am working on passing my winters in France for the start.

 

[MrFixit]

Yes and you are right. But there is a condition, if at least one of the wheels has different traction then the others. If all four are on ice and stopped turning, the ABS will decide that you are stopped.

Yes, this may be true...
However if you do encounter this, then it is likely so slippery that you will be unable to maneuver even if you release the brake,