Repair issues and fixes

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KiwiME said:
It's not going to save your gearbox, if that's what you mean by "is it worth it".
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Hi KiwiME,

Thank you for all your extensive testing and documentation over the years – it has proven invaluable as I did my research before buying a 2019 Hyundai Ioniq.

Now that I've got the vehicle (with only 25k km), I am planning to get the reduction gear oil replaced to be safe (though I understand this should have been done earlier in an ideal world, as with the Kona).

While I appreciate your investigations have been primarily targeting the Kona, am I right in confirming that I should be buying this drain plug and this Penrite oil for best performance? Hyundai wants to sell me their fluid for roughly double the price; I would happily spring for it if it was better, but I don't know if these are all much of a muchness or if the aftermarket options are actually superior. Given I've just bought the car, I'm more than happy to pay for the more expensive oil if it means a better result, but I also realize you are currently testing other viscosities and I don't want to be a guinea pig myself!

Appreciate all your help and advice!

-Simon
 
Those parts are correct. The Ioniq 38 seems to have fewer issues with gear reducers anyway. Perhaps a better place to ask maintenance questions would be the local FB group, NZ Hyundai & Kia EV's, as the content is localised.
Enjoy your new EV!
 
KiwiME said:
Those parts are correct. The Ioniq 38 seems to have fewer issues with gear reducers anyway. Perhaps a better place to ask maintenance questions would be the local FB group, NZ Hyundai & Kia EV's, as the content is localised.
Enjoy your new EV!
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Just following up to say my gear reduction fluid was replaced by my mechanic yesterday, for the first time in its life, at ~26k km. As expected, it was dark and thick and desperately needed changing. I ended up going with the Redline MT-LV. He was asking (given it was serviced every year beforehand by the Hyundai dealership) why it had never been done before, and was incredulous when I explained it’s supposed to be sealed for life, and never needs replacing. It’s shocking Hyundai have never acknowledged this isn’t true.

You’re doing god’s work keeping these cars going, KiwiME, thank you.
 
The 2024+ model years is a 100% completely new design from the ground-up and doesn’t have all the ingredients needed for the wheel of fortune noise. I wouldn’t say it was ‘solved’, just not included.
 
Hi KiwiME, thank you for all your work! Regarding the 'ingredients' for the Wheel of Fortune (WoF) noise, I was wondering if you see a significant difference in the frequency or intensity of reports between the Kia e-Niro and the Hyundai Kona (1st gen)?

While they share the same motor and GRU, some users suggest the Niro might be slightly less prone to catastrophic failure due to different torque mapping or QC standards. In your database of oil analyses and forum reports, is the e-Niro just as "at risk" as the Kona, or is there any evidence that it's a marginally safer bet for a used purchase? Thanks!
 
Comments about "torque mapping" could be confusing the 2nd-gen Niro as many had assumed it was the same underneath (when introduced in 2023) yet has significantly less specified maximum motor output torque. But not noticed is that it also has an exactly-proportionally-higher top RPM to end up with the same 150kW of power. The gearing to the the wheels was suitably shortened to maintain about 95% of the 1st-gen's acceleration.

I've not noticed any difference between 1st-gen wheel of fortune reports although at times I've felt slightly more were raised by Niro owners.

There's no technical basis for any difference as the motor and gear reducer are made in the same factories (respectively Mobis and Transys) as best as I understand. See the Transys catalog page below.

The reducer part numbers are the same, 44500-18EA1. The motor p/n is close but not identical. They range from 36500-0E700 to 36500-0E712. No one seems to know the differences.

There are already independent EV shops that can repair these in Europe (where warranties are short) and I wouldn't be surprised to eventually see refurbished powertrains being sold based on returning a repairable core.

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Hi KiwiME, many thanks for that deep dive!

Since my absolute priority is long-term mechanical reliability (keeping the car well beyond 200,000 km), I’d like to ask your expert opinion on how the Transys G1F24 compares to two other contenders I'm considering:

Chevrolet Bolt (1ET25 unit): Both Professor John Kelly (Weber Auto) and Alex (Out of Spec Renew) speak very highly of the Bolt’s drive unit (1ET25). I’ve been looking at its technical specs, and it features a "Filter Plate" to catch debris and an auxiliary fluid pump that actively sprays oil onto the motor and bearings. From your experience, does this make the Bolt’s drivetrain fundamentally superior to the "passive" lubrication/magnet setup in the Gen-1 Kona/Niro?

Tesla Model 3 (HW3 vs HW4): Does Tesla’s drivetrain (specifically the gear reducers) share any of these "particle contamination" vulnerabilities, or is their engineering on a different level of maturity? Is there a significant mechanical difference between the 2021 (HW3) and the 2024+ (HW4/Highland) units, or has it remained consistently robust?

If you had to pick a winner for "Best Engineered Drivetrain for 200k+ km" between a Bolt (1ET25), a Tesla Model 3, and the New Gen-2 Hyundai/Kia, who takes the trophy? Is the Gen-2 shift enough to beat the Bolt's active filtration? Or is there another particular model/brand I'm not aware of.
 
The Bolt is overall a good design IMO. Since it has an oil-cooled motor it needs a pump to handle that, same as Tesla from the M3 onwards, Hyundai-Kia from the Ioniq 5 onwards and no-doubt many others.

I really can't spend the time to write out all that detail you're asking but history has shown that all the EVs you mention have more reliable powertrains than the 1st-gen Kona and Niro.
 
For those of us hypermilers who play efficiency games and spend a good percentage of our travel coasting (love that right paddle feature as well as two paddles) and maximizing our trip efficiency (a carryover from my Gen1 Honda Insight days), it's my understanding that the Bolt and its need to have the oil pump always running may not take kindly to coasting in neutral. Can anyone comment on that? The Tesla proved to be too awkward to play that game, but it does have FSD which nowadays, especially with HW4, is amazing! Different strokes for different folks, and so nice to have choices.
 
Current EVs with oil-cooled motors use electric oil pumps as best as I'm aware. Tesla originally used one driven off the gear reducer on the original M3. In any case, "neutral" doesn't disconnect the motor, rather it just forces motor current to be zero. The reason for going electric (I'd guess) is that motor cooling is not always needed, or sometimes needed when stopped.

There's a recent story here about one that failed in an Ioniq 6.
 
How I Filed a Successful Goodwill Claim for TSB ELE234 + SA512 on a 2019 Niro EV — Step by Step

If your 2019 Kia Niro EV has a rumble or growling noise at low speed (0–25 mph), especially in D range under light acceleration or regen braking — here's what I learned and what actually worked.

The Two Issues

1. TSB ELE234 (April 2021) — Drive Unit Motor Rumble
Kia issued a Technical Service Bulletin covering a known defect in the original 710-series traction motor bearing on all 2019MY Niro EVs produced from December 5, 2018. The fix involves replacing motor/roll mount brackets and, if necessary, the traction motor or reduction gear. Most owners don't know this TSB exists — and many dealers never applied it even during routine visits within the warranty window.

2. SA512 (April 2023) — Inverter Coolant Flush
A separate Kia Service Action requiring a specialized SST machine flush of the high-voltage cooling loop with updated low-conductivity BSC-2 coolant. Affects 2019–2022 Niro EVs produced May 10, 2019 through October 4, 2021. SA512's own language states out-of-warranty repairs require DPSM approval — meaning there's a documented internal path to get this covered even after warranty expiration.

What I Did

  1. Filed two NHTSA safety complaints at nhtsa.gov/report-a-safety-problem, citing ELE234 by name, the production date coverage, and the fact that the TSB was never applied despite dealer visits during the active warranty window. NHTSA complaint numbers are now public record.
  2. Sent a Kia Consumer Affairs letter citing:
    • Both TSB ELE234 and SA512 by name and issue number
    • CARFAX-documented dealer visits during the period both bulletins were active
    • The NHTSA complaint numbers (leverage)
    • SA512's explicit DPSM approval pathway for out-of-warranty repairs
    • The fact that Transmission/Drivetrain complaints are the #1 reported issue category for 2019 Niro EVs in NHTSA's database, with average failure at ~5,150 miles
  3. Kia opened a case same day.
Key Facts to Know

  • The NHTSA database currently shows very few formal complaints for ELE234 specifically — which means Kia has quietly handled these under TSB without the public paper trail that could trigger a mandatory recall. Every complaint filed adds pressure.
  • If your vehicle visited any authorized Kia dealer while ELE234 or SA512 were active (ELE234: April 2021+, SA512: April 2023+) and neither was applied, that's a strong goodwill argument.
  • Out-of-warranty doesn't mean out of options. SA512 explicitly has a dealer escalation path.
Resources

  • NHTSA complaint portal: nhtsa.gov/report-a-safety-problem
  • Kia Consumer Affairs: 1-800-333-4542
  • TSB ELE234 PDF: searchable at nhtsa.gov (MC-10193244)
  • SA512 PDF: searchable at nhtsa.gov (MC-10235407)
Happy to answer questions. The more owners who file formally with NHTSA, the more likely this becomes a mandatory recall rather than a quiet TSB.
 
Of course this opportunity applies only to US residents but big kudos for documenting that! Clearly consumers can't take control unless they use all the tools made available.

Many owners affected by these problems disappear into the ether once their situation is resolved, leaving all following having to start from scratch. Somehow the concept of how an owner's community works didn't get through.

We have consumer protection laws here in NZ that says a product must last for a reasonable period of time and a few have managed to get Hyundai-Kia to cover at least part of the expense out of our very-short warranty period. However, it's recently been revealed that Hyundai in turn have required them to not publicly disclose the relevant details.
 
KiwiME said:
Of course this opportunity applies only to US residents but big kudos for documenting that! Clearly consumers can't take control unless they use all the tools made available.

Many owners affected by these problems disappear into the ether once their situation is resolved, leaving all following having to start from scratch. Somehow the concept of how an owner's community works didn't get through.

We have consumer protection laws here in NZ that says a product must last for a reasonable period of time and a few have managed to get Hyundai-Kia to cover at least part of the expense out of our very-short warranty period. However, it's recently been revealed that Hyundai in turn have required them to not publicly disclose the relevant details.
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Really appreciate this perspective, and you’re absolutely right about owners disappearing once their car is fixed. That’s exactly what lets manufacturers treat each case as an isolated “goodwill” favor instead of a pattern they’re responsible for.

On the NZ side, what you’re describing lines up with what I’ve been able to find:

  • Under the Consumer Guarantees Act 1993, a vehicle has to be of “acceptable quality,” which explicitly includes being durable and safe for a reasonable period of time, even well outside any written warranty.
  • If that guarantee isn’t met, the buyer can insist the dealer/manufacturer remedy it, and if the problem is serious or not fixed in a reasonable time, the remedies can escalate to refund, replacement, or compensation for the loss in value, not just a repair.
  • When dealers or distributors refuse to play ball, NZ owners can go to the Motor Vehicle Disputes Tribunal (MVDT), which can order repairs, refunds, or compensation up to $100k.
So in theory, a failed reduction gear / motor bearing on a relatively young EV is exactly the kind of “not durable for a reasonable time” defect the CGA was written for, and it should be arguable even if the formal Hyundai‑Kia warranty has expired.

The part you mention about Hyundai only paying out on the condition that owners don’t share the details fits a pattern I’ve seen elsewhere: they frame it as a “confidential goodwill gesture” rather than an admission of a systemic defect. That keeps each case siloed and makes it much harder for other owners (or regulators) to see that there’s a common problem and push for a broader remedy.

From my side, I’m trying to push in the opposite direction:
  • document everything publicly (TSB numbers, dates, mileages, complaint IDs),
  • connect it to the regulatory/consumer‑law tools in each country, and
  • leave a clear trail that the next owner can pick up instead of starting from zero.
If you’re comfortable sharing in general terms (without naming individuals), I think even anonymised NZ examples would help other owners understand how to actually use the CGA/MVDT path rather than just assume “out of warranty = out of luck.”
 
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