Preconditioning Use Cases

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DC1 said:
I might be wrong about the L2 time. Might be closer to 10 mins than 20 mins. I think the unplugged time is closer to 20 mins though.
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I regularly do unplugged preconditioning from freezing temperature to room temperature and it only takes about 5 minutes roughly.
 
Preheating on L1 isn't a waste since it's going to warm up the fluids at least and get the heater going faster. It also most like is warming up the battery some as well.
 
V8Power said:
I regularly do unplugged preconditioning from freezing temperature to room temperature and it only takes about 5 minutes roughly.
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This is easily explained.
Fastest preconditioning is either by a Level 2 EVSE or by the car’s 17 kW battery since these 2 options have way more power than the OEM Level 1 EVSE. The only significant difference will be that preconditioning off the battery will reduce the SOC and subsequently EV range.

Let’s do the math.
Preconditioning can draw up to 5 to 6 kW at its peak and then tapers off.
The Level 1 EVSE is rated at 12 Amps on 120 v or (12x120) 1.44 kWs max. It can’t charge and precondition at the same time and even when just preconditioning alone can’t provide the same energy as a Level 2 EVSE rated at 32 Amps on 240 v or (32x240) 7.68 kWs max.
So the Level 2 EVSE is ~ (7.68/1.44) 5.33 times stronger than the Level 1. This also explains why Level 1 charging takes ~12 hours and Level 2 takes about 2.25 hours (2.25hrx5.33=~12hr).

So bottom line is that Level 1 EVSE can precondition but at its max 1.44kWh rate, it’s going to be about 5 times less powerful than a Level 2 EVSE that can deliver up to 7.68 kWhs. And it needs every bit of that puny 1.44 kWh to precondition so it can’t charge at the same time. (However, in the interests of accuracy, the most that’s been reported is about 7.2 kWh sustained rate and the Level 1 has to be likewise a little less than 1.44 kWh. And those numbers are slightly reduced I’d you dont have the full 120 or 240 v at your outlet. But the principle and ratios still hold. Entropy reigns supreme and you can’t fight the Laws of Thermodynamics.)

Therefore don’t expect your Level 1 EVSE to get your Clarity as toasty warm as a Level 2 or the unplugged battery on a very cold day. It’s just not got the power. It is better than nothing and as posted above can help a little with the cabin temp and gets the heater throwing out hot air much quicker at start up.

I’ve found that a Level 2 EVSE and a garage make a world of difference in comfort and range in the wintertime.
So upgrading to a Level 2 EVSE (if possible) is not just for the odd time you need a second charge in the middle of the day, but it’s also for comfort. And of course the nicer and more expensive models with tracking apps let you monitor your consumption and cost easier.

PS: I’m a Bio guy so you EEs out there please correct anything I got wrong. Im still trying to figure out a 3 way light switch!!
 
KentuckyKen said:
I’ve found that a Level 2 EVSE and a garage make a world of difference in comfort and range in the wintertime.
So upgrading to a Level 2 EVSE (if possible) is not just for the odd time you need a second charge in the middle of the day, but it’s also for comfort. And of course the nicer and more expensive models with tracking apps let you monitor your consumption and cost easier.

PS: I’m a Bio guy so you EEs out there please correct anything I got wrong. Im still trying to figure out a 3 way light switch!!
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EE speaking: You have it exactly right. I had decided that I couldn't justify a L2 charger because almost always an overnight charge fits my driving patterns just fine. But the ability to do effective preconditioning has added another parameter to that decision.
 
DC1 said:
Based on the informative responses, here is my new understanding of how this works.

Plugged into L1:
Modes Supported: Scheduled and On-Demand
Notes:
Slow cabin temp change. Seems to take about 50-60 mins from 32F -> 70F cabin temp.
Still useful as "strict preconditioning" -- since heater / AC comes on as soon as you start the car.

Plugged into L2:
Modes Supported: Scheduled and On-Demand
Notes: Goes from 32F -> 70F in about 20 minutes

Unplugged:
Modes Supported: Only On-Demand
Notes: Goes from 32F -> 70F in about 20 minutes, but uses up to 10% of battery charge
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I find I don't need the car to be 70 when I enter in the morning. In fact since I will be wearing a coat this is too hot. If the temp is 40 or more that really takes care of most of the neg effect of starting a trip on a cold morning.
 
LAF said:
I find I don't need the car to be 70 when I enter in the morning. In fact since I will be wearing a coat this is too hot. If the temp is 40 or more that really takes care of most of the neg effect of starting a trip on a cold morning.
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Completely agree. But with a L1 charger, getting it up to 40 is not an option when it starts at 20.
 
MNSteve said:
EE speaking: You have it exactly right. I had decided that I couldn't justify a L2 charger because almost always an overnight charge fits my driving patterns just fine. But the ability to do effective preconditioning has added another parameter to that decision.
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This is why I'm thinking of getting one TBH, I rarely need the charge during the day but preconditioning is important as I park outside and have to reverse near a blind corner when leaving my house. So when the level 1 runs for 30 minutes and the cabin is still cold / rear window still hard to see through.... kind of a problem :(
 
LAF said:
that hasn't been my experience- takes about 25 min.
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I have not yet reprogrammed my mindset that I need to think that far ahead, so I've not actually let it run that long.

I stopped by a public level-2 charger today, plugged in, got in the car, and used the HondaLink app to turn on pre-conditioning. The difference was dramatic. With level-1, it's very anemic. With level-2, it's quite capable.
 
I think I understand but want to make sure.

I schedule charging via the app at 2AM every day via a Level 2 charger.

If I manually start or schedule pre-conditioning while it is still plugged in, it will start charging again automatically?
 
SThomas219 said:
I think I understand but want to make sure.

I schedule charging via the app at 2AM every day via a Level 2 charger.

If I manually start or schedule pre-conditioning while it is still plugged in, it will start charging again automatically?
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On my L1, I'm pretty sure the scheduled preconditioning doesn't start if it is not fully charged. Paraphrasing, it says something about another operation/action is currently underway. When I get that message in the morning, I manually stop charging with the app and then start PC. When I do it that way, charging starts back up automatically when the PC starts.
 
Confirmed....when turning on Climate from the app, charging restarts using a L2 charger. Nice to get into a warm car on a cold morning.
 
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