Keep cars AC port locked after charging completed

[uNki]

Hey guys,

I'm working for an EVSE manufacturer and we recently came up with a question I can't find an answer for.

One thing for sure: the EVSE cannot control whether the car locks or unlocks the cars AC/DC port. The EVSE cannot sent a command "unlock your port" to the car. So whether the car unlocks the charging port after a charging session has been completed it up the the manufacturer of the car.

My Tesla Model 3 keeps the port locked until I manually unlock it. I think this is the right behaviour since (when AC charging with my own cable) I don't want by AC cable to be stolen.

One of our suppliers mentioned that the Mini electric always unlocks the cars port after a completed charging session.

1.) is this true for the Mini? Can't it be configured to only unlock the port when the driver opens the car with the key?

2.) are there any other EVs that behave this way, meaning unlocking the cars charge port after a completed session?

Thanks and BR!

 

[marshall]

My Tesla Model 3 keeps the port locked until I manually unlock it. I think this is the right behaviour since (when AC charging with my own cable) I don't want by AC cable to be stolen.

That's fine for a home setup, but maybe a public setup should unlock and stop charging after charging level drops below a certain point.

I guess if the charging stops and unlocks, folks may use the station at a parking spot. So maybe that doesn't work.

Anyhow, I think catalytic converters are more valuable now then wire. That seems to be the target around here.

 

[uNki]

That's fine for a home setup, but a public setup should unlock and stop charging after charging level drops below a certain point

I was talking about AC charging with your own cable that you connect to the charger and the EV. Why would any EV driver want his personal charging cable to be free to be taken away?
The charger should unlock its AC port, of course.
But the car should keep its port locked until the EV driver arrives and wants it to be unlocked.

 

[DucRider]

I was talking about AC charging with your own cable that you connect to the charger and the EV. Why would any EV driver want his personal charging cable to be free to be taken away?
The charger should unlock its AC port, of course.
But the car should keep its port locked until the EV driver arrives and wants it to be unlocked.

In the US, the EVSE has the cable attached permanently (there is no port on the charge - only on the vehicle). The user doesn't bring their own cable. In this scenario it is desirable for the car to unlock after the charge is complete to free up the station for another user.
On our Hyundai, the behavior is user selectable:
1) Always locked until user unlocks
2) Unlocks at completion of charge
3) Always unlocked

Option 1 is useful in the US if you are plugging in to an outlet (in public) using a portable charge cable (OEM or other). Where you always bring your own cable (UK, etc) this is also the setting that should be used.

Option 2 allows someone else to use the charging station when your charge is complete

Option 3 will allow someone to terminate your charge early and use the station themselves. Some people will leave a note that this is OK if they are opportunity charging

 

[uNki]

In the US, the EVSE has the cable attached permanently (there is no port on the charge - only on the vehicle).

Is this a general „thing“ across the US? Interesting!

Back to my first question: do you know any EV that always unlocks when the charging is completed?

thanks!

 

[bwilson4web]

I monitor charging when at a public EVSE:

• J1772, BMW i3 - unlock via App
• CCS-1, BMW i3 - unlock via App
• J1772, Tesla - uses adapter so the J1772 can be unplugged while adapter remains locked
• SuperCharger, Tesla - cable barely reaches car so no problem

Bob Wilson

 

[uNki]

Thanks!

So the BMW as well as the Tesla stay locked until the driver manually unlocks it. That's a behaviour that makes total sense in the EU where the users bring their own AC Type 2 cable.

Are there any people here from Europe whose EV always (not configurable) unlocks the cars port automatically when the AC session is completed / stopped?

 

[hobbit]

Whether there are or not, you're still bound by the fact that handle lock/unlock is not part of the
J1772 spec, and is entirely up to how the vehicle is set. This will only get more variable over time.

It may be possible to defeat locking by changing the shape of the hook so the car cannot move
the locking peg into place, but you risk not being able to charge if the car senses that as an error.

_H*

 

[Puppethead]

One of our suppliers mentioned that the Mini electric always unlocks the cars port after a completed charging session.

For my MINI SE, if you lock the car while charging the cable is locked but I can't say if it stays locked once finished charging, now that I think about it. I have never charged to 100% in public, where I'd need to lock the car. If the car is unlocked the cable can be removed during charging. The car can be remotely locked/unlocked with the app.

 

[uNki]

If the car is unlocked the cable can be removed during charging.

Interesting - you could pull the plug from the car while charging? This would not be possible in the EU afaik. It's always locked when charging, even for AC.

It may be possible to defeat locking by changing the shape of the hook so the car cannot move
the locking peg into place, but you risk not being able to charge if the car senses that as an error

We don't want to mess with the locking. We want to know how most of the EVs react when the car gets a "charging completed" signal from the EVSE. Most of the cars we tested keep the car port locked. This is something we can understand, since in the EU you could bring your own cable which should not be free to take away without the EV driver actively unlocking it. For cables attached to the EVSE it's totally ok to release it.

 

[hobbit]

What is a "charging completed" signal? To my knowledge it's the car's decision, to simply stop
drawing the current that the EVSE is offering. Unless the EVSE is one with scheduling smarts,
that would simply drop the pilot signal whether charging had been "completed" or not.

The user can "pull the plug" if the latch-lock is open; as soon as the hook is raised the
proximity line opens up, the car is supposed to stop drawing current immediately so the
main electrical disconnect doesn't happen under load. The contact lengths in the plug
are also supposed to support this. Maybe type 2 is different / deficient somehow?

_H*

 

[uNki]

Maybe the US standard is different than the ones we use in the EU, idk.
For us the IEC 62196-1 "Electric vehicle conductive charging system" regulates the communication between EV and EVSE.
For AC charging the general communication is done using PWM (pulse width modulation) on the CP (control pilot). Both the EV as well as the EVSE can trigger a stop of the charging process.

In the case I mentioned, the EVSE would trigger the stop (voltage change on the control pilot) of the AC charging session and the EV would react accordingly.

I understood that the US market is not relevant for my question since you don't have AC sockets in your charging stations but permanently attached cables.

I want to know if EVs exists outside of the US or Germany that inevitably unlock the cars port (even when the car is locked!) after a charging session has been stopped.

Maybe this is the wrong forum, since it seems to be US focused - which is totally ok, ofc.

 

[Puppethead]

Interesting - you could pull the plug from the car while charging? This would not be possible in the EU afaik. It's always locked when charging, even for AC.

From the MINI Cooper SE manual (online version, I think it covers all countries):

The charging process can be stopped at any time by removing the charging cable and continued at a later time by connecting the charging cable.​

Also from the manual (referring to a locked charging cable by locking the vehicle):

When the charging process is completed, the charging cable is automatically unlocked.​

 

[OzKona]

Maybe the US standard is different than the ones we use in the EU, idk.
For us the IEC 62196-1 "Electric vehicle conductive charging system" regulates the communication between EV and EVSE.
For AC charging the general communication is done using PWM (pulse width modulation) on the CP (control pilot). Both the EV as well as the EVSE can trigger a stop of the charging process.

In the case I mentioned, the EVSE would trigger the stop (voltage change on the control pilot) of the AC charging session and the EV would react accordingly.

I understood that the US market is not relevant for my question since you don't have AC sockets in your charging stations but permanently attached cables.

I want to know if EVs exists outside of the US or Germany that inevitably unlock the cars port (even when the car is locked!) after a charging session has been stopped.

Maybe this is the wrong forum, since it seems to be US focused - which is totally ok, ofc.

I'm in Australia. Most EVSEs are tethered, but there are some that are not (ie, bring your own (Type 2 to Type 2) cable). Other public charge points may be a simple (Australian) standard 3 phase socket for a portable EVSE or a standard household socket for a granny charger. So we have the same possibility of cable or portable EVSE theft.

I have an Australian model Kona. The charge port stays locked until the owner unlocks it. There is also a switch that, when selected to "Auto", unlocks the port on completion of charging. You would use that at a public tethered EVSE for the convenience of the next person.