Electrify Canada and America "Boost Plan"

electriceddy

electriceddy

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To double it's current infrastructure over the next 4 years to support the plans by major automakers and U.S. and Canadian governments to help the transformation to an electric mobility transportation system. Anticipated completion by end of 2025.
Here is a map showing today and future comparisons:
Large-732-ElectrifyAmericaAnnouncesitsBoostPlantoMorethanDoubleitsCurrentEVChargingNetworkbyEndof2025.png

Lots of holes filled in both countries, U.S.- mid west, central, Hawaii, Canada - basically from nothing between Ontario to BC to a decent amount including eastern Canada:)
Article source:
https://driveteslacanada.ca/news/el...more-than-double-ev-charging-network-by-2025/
 
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The good news, the build-out is coming. The bad news is that it will take 4 years to before there is a reasonable non-Tesla, DC charging network from Seattle to Minneapolis or Madison.

Better late then never!
 
Yawn. I've found "electrify Canada" to be pretty useless. Few chargers, and those I found were often out of service. I'm a Tesla owner now in part because of those types of issues. Too little, too late, in my opinion......I got better DCFC service from the gas companies (PetroCanada, Shell) and Flo.
 
marshall said:
The good news, the build-out is coming. The bad news is that it will take 4 years to before there is a reasonable non-Tesla, DC charging network from Seattle to Minneapolis or Madison.

Better late then never!
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Correct, however there is other companies like EVgo and Chargepoint that will also expand their networks. So there is more to come, not just what's on this EA map.

Also, if it was for EA, they probably would have that network today. The reason it doesn't exist it LOTs of red tape from local government that makes it extremely hard for companies like EA, EVGo, Chargepoint to get permission to build the charging locations. It literally takes months to just get approvals and every location has different applications and approval processes.
 
Esprit1st said:
Correct, however there is other companies like EVgo and Chargepoint that will also expand their networks. So there is more to come, not just what's on this EA map.

Also, if it was for EA, they probably would have that network today. The reason it doesn't exist it LOTs of red tape from local government that makes it extremely hard for companies like EA, EVGo, Chargepoint to get permission to build the charging locations. It literally takes months to just get approvals and every location has different applications and approval processes.
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I don't think its red tape to install chargers in Billings Mt. or Sioux Falls SD. I think it's just a money losing project to do so. All these companies, including Tesla, need plenty of urban chargers bringing in cash to subsidize these lightly used grass plains chargers. Two months for permits is nothing!

Heck, I don't think red tape is the issue at all, even in urban areas. I think it's all about finding cheap real estate, at a good location, with enough electric vehicles in the area to make it pencil out.

EVgo and Chargepoint business model seems to depend on local government and business support. I think it's going to be a while before we see much activity in between the two coasts.
 
@marshall I read an article about it a little while ago, it was very interesting. Unfortunately I can't remember where that was. And we're not talking about 2 months of permitting. We're talking half a year and even longer.

Reasons are that a lot of municipalities don't even have procedures for electric charging infrastructure. So they might have to go through city council meetings etc. to even consider permitting.

And then you only have a permit, now you need to plan on electricity availability. Even that sounds easier than it is. For a EA site with only 4 350kW chargers were talking a megawatt of power. That's not available in most places.

And finally you need to look into building the whole site with all those code issues.

It's definitely not an easy undertaking, especially without any standardized process.

I think they're should be a process layed out on a federal level that makes it easier on a state and local level. That would make things a lot easier.

And I'm sorry, I'm just trying to recall the information from memory, so it might not all be 100% accurate but I remember thinking: "what a total nightmare" after I read the article. And I tipped my hat to the people at EA.
 
Esprit1st said:
Reasons are that a lot of municipalities don't even have procedures for electric charging infrastructure. So they might have to go through city council meetings etc. to even consider permitting.
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And yet Tesla gets it done.

Billings MT. supercharger; Sheridan WY supercharger; Rapid City SD supercharger, Sioux Fall SD supercharger and so on

I don't think it's red tape. Its more like making enough cash to pencil out.
 
And then you don't know how long Tesla worked on that location. I used to be in a position where I had to deal with municipalities, nothing EV related, but it is a nightmare and totally wouldn't want to do this kind of super frustrating job.
 
Esprit1st said:
And then you don't know how long Tesla worked on that location. I used to be in a position where I had to deal with municipalities, nothing EV related, but it is a nightmare and totally wouldn't want to do this kind of super frustrating job.
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If nothing else, once Tesla gets in there, the next EV charging network will in theory have an easier time of it.

I suspect they have to put lots of irons in the fire and just assume there is going to be a long lead time. Some will come in sooner than others.
 
We can agree to disagree.
I experienced it first hand and just because one company "gets in" and it might have taken them years to get in, it won't get easier for the next one.

You're also assuming that the local government wants to adopt EV growth.

I don't believe it.

Here is an article that goes in that direction, it's not the one I read and it focuses more on the cost itself but you'll get an idea:
https://www.greentechmedia.com/articles/read/ev-charging-infrastructure-has-a-soft-costs-problem

Also, if it was as easy as you're saying, why did it take EA so long to build the network that they have now? Or Tesla for that matter?

Tesla has been working on their network for what? 10 years? EA for maybe 4 or 5?
 
Esprit1st said:
Also, if it was as easy as you're saying, why did it take EA so long to build the network that they have now? Or Tesla for that matter?
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One, Money, money! Two, lack of long range BEVs to use the chargers.


Esprit1st said:
You're also assuming that the local government wants to adopt EV growth.
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I can't speak to your neck of the woods, but Washington state and the city of Seattle has spent millions of dollars on EV charging.

https://wsdot.wa.gov/business/innov...-emission-vehicle-infrastructure-partnerships

https://powerlines.seattle.gov/2020...ew-electric-vehicle-fast-chargers-in-seattle/


https://www.bellingham.org/port-of-bellingham-adds-six-new-electric-vehicle-charging-stations
 
bwilson4web said:
Tesla needed SuperChargers to sell their EVs. The others, not so much.
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I would put it differently. Tesla really had no choice, because nobody else was going to do it for them, and without it, they would probably have never been successful.

Other automakers had a choice. They may choose to wait for the market. But the charging networks are constrained by the huge capitol costs, so rollout is a lot slower. If the only EVs were compliance cars, they might not care.

Or an automaker may choose to make a big investment. In theory they could form their own network, but that would be foolish. They could invest in one of the existing ones.

VW gives you 3 free years of charging at EA. For them, it solves the sales issue - they can point a potential customer at this, and use it to overcome concerns. But I believe that in order to make this happen, they had to pay EA an undisclosed sum of some sort. There was a comment that Dustin Krause made about what they had to do to make this happen which makes me think this:



So from the VW perspective, it helps to sell cars, and from an EA perspective, it would be another source of income to help fund the rollout.
 
ericy said:
Or an automaker may choose to make a big investment. In theory they could form their own network, but that would be foolish. They could invest in one of the existing ones.
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They should also actively manage the CCS-1 network(s) by making sure an operations manager is part of the team. They should never have a repeat of EA shutting down 500 miles of all chargers for a hardware upgrade like they did last year: https://insideevs.com/news/443006/electrify-america-charging-corridor-shut-down-labor-day/

Bob Wilson
 
marshall said:
One, Money, money! Two, lack of long range BEVs to use the chargers.


I can't speak to your neck of the woods, but Washington state and the city of Seattle has spent millions of dollars on EV charging.

https://wsdot.wa.gov/business/innov...-emission-vehicle-infrastructure-partnerships

https://powerlines.seattle.gov/2020...ew-electric-vehicle-fast-chargers-in-seattle/


https://www.bellingham.org/port-of-bellingham-adds-six-new-electric-vehicle-charging-stations
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Well, they had a few billion dollars to spend (dieselgate) so no. Money definitely wasn't an issue.

My neck of the woods: I can count the amount of DC quick chargers in the whole state on a couple of hands (NM).

The state has some kind of electric highway thing going on for a few years and they managed to put up a couple of DC quick chargers in that time. One right next to a EA site. That's telling you either of two things: they are dumb or the permitting process takes so long that they didn't know where others are planning on building sites.

Not holding my breath on them.
 
Esprit1st said:
My neck of the woods: I can count the amount of DC quick chargers in the whole state on a couple of hands (NM).
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I've been keeping an eye on the route from the Twin Cities to Albuquerque, and I've seen the charging options improve quite a bit in the last year. It looks like Electrify America has been adding fast chargers along bother I-40 and I-25. If things keep improving the way they have, in about two years charging will be convenient even in remoter parts of the western US.
 
Puppethead said:
I've been keeping an eye on the route from the Twin Cities to Albuquerque, and I've seen the charging options improve quite a bit in the last year. It looks like Electrify America has been adding fast chargers along bother I-40 and I-25. If things keep improving the way they have, in about two years charging will be convenient even in remoter parts of the western US.
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I40 had been great for a long time, and I24 north of Albuquerque as well. Unfortunately those are the only areas.
 
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