Charging Fun

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Puppethead said:
I've been following that discussion. My car has been sitting in the garage when it got down to 16ºF overnight, and I didn't drive or precondition for three days and I still had full power when I took it out.

That person did not set a departure time at least three hours in advance, so there was no battery preconditioning. Also I believe they were only doing Level 1 charging, which isn't enough power to precondition the battery.
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I see more comments like yours and others, and did see another reduction but it was like 20-25% IIRC. I wonder what happened to the poster on FB.

I know batteries hate the cold. Then again my F55S always feels a bit sluggish once we hit single digits and below. Shifting even just feels off until the car warms up. I kind of look forward to being able to precondition in the garage in the winter really. It's something I cannot do now.
 
Lainey said:
I kind of look forward to being able to precondition in the garage in the winter really. It's something I cannot do now.
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I've also been climatizing automatically for leaving work the last few days, and it's been nice! Even though my car isn't plugged in and sits in a lot, the cabin gets quite comfortable when it's time to drive home.
 
Puppethead said:
I've also been climatizing automatically for leaving work the last few days, and it's been nice! Even though my car isn't plugged in and sits in a lot, the cabin gets quite comfortable when it's time to drive home.
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Oh nice! Having a comfortable cabin in the winter right off sounds great!

I think it should be nice for summer days when we go out for a 2 or 3 hour hike or visit to a park/zoo. Set it to cool a little before you hop in. The opening of windows and sunroof as you walk is nice, but to schedule it for later would be better.
 
Fun experiment I did with the time-change: I set a one-time departure of 12:00 from my phone on Sunday morning at 09:00. I went out to my car just before 12:00 only to discover it still thought it was DST and almost 13:00. So, it had in-fact done the pre-conditioning and such, I was just an hour late. Dove in to the settings for time and date and found the option to auto set time and date based off location and turned that on. You may wish to do the same.
 
Yup, Berlin for mine too... and +1 on the time change... WA voted last year to stay on DST permanently and we're just waiting around for congress to get off their collective posteriors and 'allow it'
 
Thanks for that reminder, my current Mini is a manual time change. Looking forward to that being an auto setting again. Though I loathe DST and wish we'd just stay ST all the time. It was a rather stupid invention and unsafe for kids in the morning waiting for busses in the pitch black.
 
Puppethead said:
That person did not set a departure time at least three hours in advance
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Has anyone verified the Mini SE actually needs 3 hours to condition the battery? That seems extreme. And if you wanted to get around that, could you just warm up the battery by charging it during the half hour before you drive it?
 
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There is a lot of discussion going on about preconditioning on the Electric MINI facebook group (sorry you'll have to wrestle with the awful user interface). There's some doubt as to whether or not battery preconditioning is happening, but I'm not sure the testing is being done in climate conditions where it would be needed.

The "3 hour" target comes from BMW i3 behavior, I have not seen anything definitive on the SE.

Preconditioning isn't just warming, it's also cooling if needed. See InsideEVs Cold Weather Electric Car Tips article.
 
I've been following that discussion. I live in upstate NY, and winter temps occasionally dip below 0F. My car will live outside. I guess I won't have first hand experience until next winter, though, since my car isn't due to be built until week 5 (early February) 2021.
 
I was following it too. I hopefully will get to test it myself this year. I was told week 48 build. I've been watching other sites too to see if it pops up. I know everything feels sluggish in my ICE when cold too. I just plan to precondition.
 
Puppethead said:
The "3 hour" target comes from BMW i3 behavior, I have not seen anything definitive on the SE.
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Thanks Puppethead. It seems like the Mini uses a better heat pump than the i3, and CATL batteries that should perform better in cold weather, so I'm curious whether the preconditioning has changed. Or I wonder if you could change that with Bimmercode. My sense is that the Facebook preconditioning discussion is one person's experience...I'm hesitant to infer too much from it, but curious for sure!

Oh, and I get what you're saying that pre-conditioning is battery cooling as well as heating, thanks for that reminder. Mini's sales info on the car definitely suggests it should do both:
"Extreme cold and hot temperatures may impact the driving range. ... Impacts on range can be minimized by using the pre-conditioning function which brings the car and battery to operating temperatures before driving off, using power from the grid when plugged in."​
 
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GetOffYourGas said:
I've been following that discussion. I live in upstate NY, and winter temps occasionally dip below 0F. My car will live outside. I guess I won't have first hand experience until next winter, though, since my car isn't due to be built until week 5 (early February) 2021.
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Just to let you know, my car was scheduled for week 48 this year and it went into production with a VIN on the mygarage today. So 2 weeks early. I'd just keep watch. I asked the manager at my dealer why you'd be so much later since we ordered the same date and she had no idea. But maybe you'll get lucky too.
 
I will be contacting my dealer soon, once the dust settles on some personal situations, and see if there is any change to that build week. I don't mind terribly taking delivery of the car in the spring. We will be selling the CMax Energi once we get the SE. But I have snow tires for the Bolt and CMax, and would rather wait until next winter to buy snow tires for the SE (I hear the OEM tires are pretty terrible in snow). I did mention that to the dealer (that I wouldn't mind a spring delivery) so maybe he shuffled me around with other customers? He is in Rochester, NY with is a bit of a hipster city, and a relative hotspot for EVs in the region. I know he has an existing waiting list.

Regarding cold weather performance, I have noticed reduced power in the Bolt EV when it has cold-soaked unplugged. But it isn't prominently advertised like in the SE. If I precondition for 30 minutes, I do get full power even in sub-zero temps. But I rarely use it. That's a lot of power for what is certain to be slick roads.
 
MiniNorth said:
Extreme cold and hot temperatures
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I'm not sure what MINI's definition of "extreme" is, but where I live anything above 0ºF or below 90ºF is not considered extreme. I do know fueling stations have switched to winter diesel, and we're getting down under 32ºF again.
 
GetOffYourGas said:
I will be contacting my dealer soon, once the dust settles on some personal situations, and see if there is any change to that build week. I don't mind terribly taking delivery of the car in the spring. We will be selling the CMax Energi once we get the SE. But I have snow tires for the Bolt and CMax, and would rather wait until next winter to buy snow tires for the SE (I hear the OEM tires are pretty terrible in snow). I did mention that to the dealer (that I wouldn't mind a spring delivery) so maybe he shuffled me around with other customers? He is in Rochester, NY with is a bit of a hipster city, and a relative hotspot for EVs in the region. I know he has an existing waiting list.

Regarding cold weather performance, I have noticed reduced power in the Bolt EV when it has cold-soaked unplugged. But it isn't prominently advertised like in the SE. If I precondition for 30 minutes, I do get full power even in sub-zero temps. But I rarely use it. That's a lot of power for what is certain to be slick roads.
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The difference in clientele could be the reason. I only hope to squeeze in just before year end for tax purposes only. Snow is not usually an issue for me. We get it but my city clears asap. Only one volunteer work I do in the actual city of Cbus can be problematic but I can move days if the snow is too much. So if I don't get snow tires it is not the end of the world.

I was about to ask some loved ones about their Bolt in the cold. I have a feeling Mini just showed it where others didn't advertise it. Cold days make me go slower anyway off the line until I know there is ice or not

Puppethead said:
I'm not sure what MINI's definition of "extreme" is, but where I live anything above 0ºF or below 90ºF is not considered extreme. I do know fueling stations have switched to winter diesel, and we're getting down under 32ºF again.
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I'm truly not sure either, but I know here it's about the same. We don't get touchy until -10 or so. About 95 is when people start to whine. Thiugh I'm sure to some both extremes are indeed extreme
 
MiniNorth said:
Has anyone verified the Mini SE actually needs 3 hours to condition the battery? That seems extreme. And if you wanted to get around that, could you just warm up the battery by charging it during the half hour before you drive it?
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A poster on the BMW i3 Owner website wrote:
If a time of departure has been set at least three hours in advance, the high voltage battery will also be preconditioned. If immediate preconditioning has been initiated or the departure time is less than three hours away the HV battery will not be preconditioned at all. Also, the car has to be plugged in for the HV battery to be preconditioned (but it can be to a normal 120V or 240V).


So what happens in a BMW i3 in cold weather 3 hours before the scheduled departure time? Does the i3 have heater coils specifically dedicated to warming the battery? The 3-hour lead-time suggests there must be a separate low-level warming system for the battery because I assume the preconditioning for the cabin cuts off long before 3 hours have passed. Another possibility is that the cabin preconditioning operates for 3 hours to achieve a lower than human-comfortable temperature, hoping some of that cabin heat is absorbed by the battery below. Then, when the departure time approaches, the cabin warming is stepped up to make the interior comfortable for the occupants.

The MINI Cooper SE Owners Manual doesn't say anything about preconditioning the HV battery. Page 185 of the MINI Cooper SE Owners Manual reads:
Different departure times can be set to ensure a comfortable interior temperature in the vehicle at the time of departure.
The activation time is automatically determined based on the temperature.
The system promptly switches on before the selected departure time.

Evidently, the MINI Cooper SE starts the preconditioning longer before the set departure time when the ambient temperature is further from what they deem comfortable. I would expect that if there is a battery-warming capability, it, too, would be activated longer before a scheduled departure time when the temperature was colder.

Somebody with a smart EVSE needs to plot the SE's energy usage on a cold day when a departure time with preconditioning has been set.
 
I don't know the answer, but according to the article:

"According to the Electrify America's press release, the Plug&Charge launch was done "in advance of the arrival of Plug&Charge-capable electric vehicles including 2021 models of the Porsche Taycan, Ford Mustang Mach-E and Lucid Air", which suggest that there is no EVs ready for it yet."

I'm a little disappointed in IEVs for not following through on that detail, but instead simply stating the obvious (that the quoted press release suggests none are available).
 
GetOffYourGas said:
I don't know the answer, but according to the article:

"According to the Electrify America's press release, the Plug&Charge launch was done "in advance of the arrival of Plug&Charge-capable electric vehicles including 2021 models of the Porsche Taycan, Ford Mustang Mach-E and Lucid Air", which suggest that there is no EVs ready for it yet."

I'm a little disappointed in IEVs for not following through on that detail, but instead simply stating the obvious (that the quoted press release suggests none are available).
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That's my understanding as well. I personally don't mind not having this technology in part because skipping one step is not huge to me (and with a kid driving maybe not bad at all to have a non plug and charge so they don't waste money using things we don't need) and also because there are so few Electrify America stations here. One in my city and 10 total in my state. There are more options for charging in my zip than the entire state for EA.
 
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