Are there Level 1 EVSE's that are faster than the OEM one?

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Another question relating to the wiring work that will be done (6 gage wire, 40 amp breaker, 240V). The electrician said that he was not going to pull a permit for this. His explanation was:

"no matter what you install... you need a permit for it. But we always leave that to the customer to decide weather they want to or not.. our end we do all work according to the code. If you do with the permit than they won't let us run it by that panel because on paper the load calculation works different than in the real world."

Not sure if I understand this or if it's concerning? Should I do this without a permit? He also gave me a second option ($400) which would involve combining two breakers at the panel, installing a 240V receptacle at the 20amp outlet and completely disabling all the other receptacles in the garage. This would allow for 240V charging at 16 amps. The advantage of this is that it is easily reversible if I ever had an inspector in the house for other work or a sale. The bigger job would not be easy to hide because there is new wire, conduit runs etc. I'm OK with the smaller option because it would charge the car in 4 hours which is still perfectly OK. Since I have no need for the other outlets I also don't really care if he disables them. I just want to make sure that that option is perfectly safe with no possibility of burning down my nice house or harming my Clarity.
 
I would like to thank ozy, Mr. Fixit and all the other members who contributed to this discussion. I have a 120V plugin at work. Using the Honda charge cable is fine in the warm weather. I live 40km (25 miles) from work and most days I have a 10km detour on the way in. As a result, if I use preheating and set the temperature low - sometimes off - I can make it to work and home again without using gas. Some days it is just too cold and the battery heater uses too much juice so I end up burning some gas.

I did not know I could purchase a 16Amp charge cable. Reading this discussion forum was great. I checked the outlets I plug into and they have the T slot on one of the prongs for the plugs - so they are 20Amp. 25% more (free) charging will mean warmer drives on the coldest days and in the summer - saving a few dollars.

Thank you for sharing your knowledge.
 
I completed the work for my new charger and it went well. They installed a 240V 16 amp charger using my regular 120V 20amp receptacles in the garage. I am using the Amazing e charger which is a Clipper Creek product. There was an interesting development in this installation which I think is worthwhile mentioning: There was a lot of talk on this thread of disabling all of the other 120V receptacles in the garage. However, we did not have to do this and all of the other 120V receptacles are working just fine. Apparently the electrician found that in one of the 120V receptacles in the garage there were "2 wires" and they had been put there for the express purpose of providing a 240V outlet for garage tool use eg: welder, compressor etc. The only way he found this was by physically removing the covers of each receptacle in the garage and looking inside. Apparently the other electricians who quoted me had not bothered to do this and were not aware that the problem was solved before even starting. This receptacle, however, was on the other side of the garage from where it was needed so he made the connections and passed the wires through a conduit to exactly where I wanted it. It works fine and I'm happy that I retained all of my 120V outlets. So far I'm a happy camper.
 
For anyone that is interested: I can confirm that the charging time for a 16amp 240V charger is indeed 4 hours (as expected). Installation required no additional wiring and inexpensive. The charger was $219 (Amazing e from Clipper Creek). This has worked out very nicely and is clearly a great option for plug in vehicles. May not have been a great option for a full EV.
 
L1 faster charger update:
I just picked up a used portable charger on Craigslist for $100: Duosida 240/120 dual voltage EV charger
https://www.amazon.com/Duosida-Port...e=UTF8&qid=1549463801&sr=8-1&keywords=duosida

Used the 240V plug to 120V plug pigtail adapter and used it as L1 charger.
Compared to the Honda OEM L1 charger, this Duosida L1 charger charges about 25% faster than the OEM!

Best $100 spent on the car so far!
Love it more as getting a full charge takes less than 9 hours compared to 12 hours.
Now I can put the Honda OEM charger away in the trunk for travel use only!

This site is such a great wealth of useful info!
 
ozy said:
I completed the work for my new charger and it went well. They installed a 240V 16 amp charger using my regular 120V 20amp receptacles in the garage. I am using the Amazing e charger which is a Clipper Creek product. There was an interesting development in this installation which I think is worthwhile mentioning: There was a lot of talk on this thread of disabling all of the other 120V receptacles in the garage. However, we did not have to do this and all of the other 120V receptacles are working just fine. Apparently the electrician found that in one of the 120V receptacles in the garage there were "2 wires" and they had been put there for the express purpose of providing a 240V outlet for garage tool use eg: welder, compressor etc. The only way he found this was by physically removing the covers of each receptacle in the garage and looking inside. Apparently the other electricians who quoted me had not bothered to do this and were not aware that the problem was solved before even starting. This receptacle, however, was on the other side of the garage from where it was needed so he made the connections and passed the wires through a conduit to exactly where I wanted it. It works fine and I'm happy that I retained all of my 120V outlets. So far I'm a happy camper.
Click to expand...
That was great to find a receptacle with the extra wire needed for regular 240. I sure wish the builder of my garage had done that!
 
4sallypat said:
L1 faster charger update:
I just picked up a used portable charger on Craigslist for $100: Duosida 240/120 dual voltage EV charger
https://www.amazon.com/Duosida-Port...e=UTF8&qid=1549463801&sr=8-1&keywords=duosida

Used the 240V plug to 120V plug pigtail adapter and used it as L1 charger.
Compared to the Honda OEM L1 charger, this Duosida L1 charger charges about 25% faster than the OEM!

Best $100 spent on the car so far!
Love it more as getting a full charge takes less than 9 hours compared to 12 hours.
Now I can put the Honda OEM charger away in the trunk for travel use only!

This site is such a great wealth of useful info!
Click to expand...
Great that you had a 20A 120V circuit you could use.
A caution for those that don't - this unit will allow the car to pull 16A and requires a dedicated 20A circuit (or at least one with nothing else plugged in). this is from the Quick Charge Power site that sells this unit as the "Go-Cable"

Works with all common voltages, and requires a 20 amp minimum electric circuit, however it will work with all electrical circuits between 20 and 60 amps. Consult with a qualified, licensed electrician to determine if your electrical circuit is properly configured.

Adaptor "M" for household 120 volt / 15 amp (NEMA 5-15)***

***NOTE: any 15 amp circuit, like a NEMA 6-15 or 5-15, is NOT recommended for use with Go-Cable, as the 16 amp load can overload the 15 amp electrical circuit.
​
Some vehicles restrict the draw and/or allow the user to adjust the amperage (Chevy, BMW, etc). The Clarity will happily pull whatever amperage the EVSE "advertises" - in this case 16A for 9 hours. You DO NOT want to plug this in to a 15A circuit, even though it comes with an adapter to make it possible (some 20A circuits do have NEMA 5-15 receptacles installed)

Tony Williams and Quick Charge Power are very respected in the industry and build many of their own charging products. He has designed and produced kits to add DCFC to vehicles like the Toyota RAV 4 EV and Mercedes B250e (both use Tesla internals).
 
4sallypat said:
L1 faster charger update:
I just picked up a used portable charger on Craigslist for $100: Duosida 240/120 dual voltage EV charger
https://www.amazon.com/Duosida-Port...e=UTF8&qid=1549463801&sr=8-1&keywords=duosida

Used the 240V plug to 120V plug pigtail adapter and used it as L1 charger.
Compared to the Honda OEM L1 charger, this Duosida L1 charger charges about 25% faster than the OEM!

Best $100 spent on the car so far!
Love it more as getting a full charge takes less than 9 hours compared to 12 hours.
Now I can put the Honda OEM charger away in the trunk for travel use only!

This site is such a great wealth of useful info!
Click to expand...
4sallypat,
Your Duosida is charging at 16 amps. I assume that you are using a 20amp receptacle that is wired to a 20amp circuit breaker in the panel? If so, then it's not surprising that your charging time improved by 25% (since your amperage increased from 12 to 16).
 
ozy said:
4sallypat,
Your Duosida is charging at 16 amps. I assume that you are using a 20amp receptacle that is wired to a 20amp circuit breaker in the panel? If so, then it's not surprising that your charging time improved by 25% (since your amperage increased from 12 to 16).
Click to expand...

Yes, it's on a dedicated circuit in the garage.
Actual current measurements between the L1 chargers:
Honda OEM = 9-10 Amps
Duosida dual voltage = 12-13 Amps
 
Hi Everyone. I have learned so much from this forum and this thread. I have a question.

We just bought a 2018 base clarity. My wife’s job has 10 nema 15-50 plugs available for ev charging. Since I don’t want to buy a $200+ on a level 2 charger, I have been looking for a way to utilize her OEM cable. I found this:

Conntek Y1450520S NEMA 14-50 50-Amp 125/250-volt RV/Generator Y-Adapter Plug to U.S. 15/20-Amp Female Connectors https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00BHGXYRC/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_lL.6CbQY89MY8

Would this work? I think it might even give a slightly faster charge. Any advice would be appreciated.
 
rah rah said:
Hi Everyone. I have learned so much from this forum and this thread. I have a question.

We just bought a 2018 base clarity. My wife’s job has 10 nema 15-50 plugs available for ev charging. Since I don’t want to buy a $200+ on a level 2 charger, I have been looking for a way to utilize her OEM cable. I found this:

Conntek Y1450520S NEMA 14-50 50-Amp 125/250-volt RV/Generator Y-Adapter Plug to U.S. 15/20-Amp Female Connectors https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00BHGXYRC/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_lL.6CbQY89MY8

Would this work? I think it might even give a slightly faster charge. Any advice would be appreciated.
Click to expand...

That.looks good.if you want a 120v source for your OEM cable (12h full charge)i you want a 240v source (6h full charge) take a look at the adaptor in this post and read the entire thread if you are considering using the OEM cable on 240v.

https://www.insideevsforum.com/comm...evel-2-charging-for-under-20.5602/#post-61317
 
rah rah said:
Sorry. I meant 10 charging stations with a Nema 14-50 plug.
Click to expand...
Might raise some eyebrows at her job when people see that adapter. Maybe it would be better to spend an extra $150 and get a dedicated Level 2 cable with a Nema 14-50 plug like the one below. No raised eyebrows, you would get Level 2 charging, and you could still use the Level 1 cable at home and keep the Level 2 cable in the trunk.

https://www.amazon.com/Zencar-100-240V-Portable-Electric-Compatible/dp/B07J56WF9K
 
For some reason, I never see 16amp EVSE's for less than $200 with a NEMA 14-50 plug. The cheap ones usually have the NEMA 6-20 plug. Not a big deal, but you end up spending as much once you get a NEMA 14-50p to 6-20r adapter.
 
ozy said:
The 12 hours that it takes to achieve a 100% charge is often too long for my needs. I find myself needing to unplug it before it has fully charged. A more efficient level one evse may fit my needs without my having to go the level 2 route. My home situation is such that it would be very costly to install a 240V outlet in my garage.
Click to expand...
A couple of local college kids came up with this solution to avoid costly 240 V upgrades if you have an electric dryer outlet in your garage. It might apply in some cases. Heres the link. https://www.getneocharge.com
 
Hi all, this is my first post to this forum. Thanks to all the people who've shared their knowledge in this thread, I found it illuminating!

I ran across an eBay ad with the following text: "16A CHARGING WITH NEMA 5-15 PLUG: The EV charging stations need no assembly - just plug in to your existing NEMA5-15 or 5-20 receptacle or install a 5-15R or 5-20 socket, plug in and start charging. Plug into the NEMA5-20R, the working current will be 16A and plug into the NEMA 5-15R, it will be 15A due to outlet current limited."

Is it likely that it truly is using all 15A of a 15A plug? And would that be recommended if so? Some of the comments here suggest that anything above 12A in a 15A plug might not be ideal.
 
MassDeduction said:
Hi all, this is my first post to this forum. Thanks to all the people who've shared their knowledge in this thread, I found it illuminating!

I ran across an eBay ad with the following text: "16A CHARGING WITH NEMA 5-15 PLUG: The EV charging stations need no assembly - just plug in to your existing NEMA5-15 or 5-20 receptacle or install a 5-15R or 5-20 socket, plug in and start charging. Plug into the NEMA5-20R, the working current will be 16A and plug into the NEMA 5-15R, it will be 15A due to outlet current limited."

Is it likely that it truly is using all 15A of a 15A plug? And would that be recommended if so? Some of the comments here suggest that anything above 12A in a 15A plug might not be ideal.
Click to expand...
Anything above 12A on a 15A circuit is not safe and violates the NEC (and all other electrical codes). And 12A is only allowed if it is a circuit dedicated for the EVSE with nothing else plugged in (preferable the only outlet on the circuit is the one used for the EVSE).
 
Electrical code usually requires de-rating the maximum specifications of the wire/receptacle worst case to 80% of specified rating for continuous loads over three hours. So with the 5-15 with 14 gauge it would be 80% of 15A or 12A, and for 5-20 with 12 gauge it would be 80% of 20A or 16A

Of course your charging station needs a switch to set the amperage limit, as it can't sense what receptacle it has been plugged into.
 
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