InsideEVs Podcast episodes

Discussion in 'General' started by Domenick, Apr 25, 2020.

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  3. rcarter3636

    rcarter3636 Member

    Good for Kyle going off on VW for the disastrous software rollout of the so called every 12 week software updates. Not a single update has been brought here to the US for the I.D4 since the car’s inception over a year ago.
    More journalists need to do the same!
    Domenick likes this.
  4. teslarati97

    teslarati97 Well-Known Member

    I thought Martyn was going to jump in about how the rest of the world uses 3-phase electricity for 11kW+ charging before his internet connection dropped. 40A single phase (Level 2) charging is still plenty!
    Domenick likes this.
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  6. teslarati97

    teslarati97 Well-Known Member

    For 2021, the estimated lithium carbonate production was 100,000 tons and Goldman Sachs in 2016 estimated that a 70kWh battery in a Tesla Model S takes about 138lbs (0.069 tons) of lithium carbonate. If all of the lithium carbonate was devoted to lithium ion batteries for EVs (assume 138lbs per EV) then that would only be able to make 1.449M EV annually.

    Tesla manufactured 305,840 vehicles in 2021, and Toyota manufactured about 10.5M in 2021.
  7. Domenick

    Domenick Administrator Staff Member

    I think you're trying to say we need more lithium, which is true. However, the data you start with is not. An average battery today holds about 13 pounds (5.9 kg) of lithium.
  8. teslarati97

    teslarati97 Well-Known Member

    Yes 13 pounds of pure lithium ion (Li+), but 138 lbs of unrefined mined lithium carbonate (Li2CO3 equivalent). There is sufficient worldwide reserves available, but mining is not fast enough on an annual basis.
    Last edited: May 14, 2022
  9. Domenick

    Domenick Administrator Staff Member

    There are a lot (a lot!) of lithium projects going on around the world that aren't really producing yet that should come online over the next five years. I think the big choke point might be 2027, but it's a moving target that depends on speed of adoption and production capacity/plans of automakers.

    The silver lining here is that one some point, a large part of the lithium we need will come from recycled batteries and mining will substantially subside.
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  10. teslarati97

    teslarati97 Well-Known Member

    Ironically mining spodumene takes diesel fuel. I believe the Piedmont BFS operation in NC has an annual production (2021 FORM 10-KT) of 242,000 metric tons. At a conversion rate of 92% and 5.8% Li2O in spodumene, that would produce 12,913 metric tons of lithium oxide available to be converted to lithium hydroxide.

    As for recycling, it's really only cost effective to recover the lithium carbonate from NCA/NCM batteries via hydrometallurgy or pyrometallurgy. Recovery of lithium in LFP is still cost prohibitive.
  11. What kind of mining does not cost diesel fuel?
    teslarati97 likes this.
  12. teslarati97

    teslarati97 Well-Known Member

    Cryptocurrency with hydropower and/or solar? "Artisanal" cobalt mining in the Republic of Congo?
  13. DJP

    DJP Active Member

    Last edited: May 17, 2022
    teslarati97 and electriceddy like this.
  14. Yeah, I have seen that before. And how the trucks gets charged up on the way down. Good start.

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