2021 Hyundai Kona may have same battery issues as 2019-2020 models

Well this isn't comforting at all. It certainly looks like the start of yet another dumpster fire but without Kona's actually catching fire (thankfully). Still stinks to high heaven.

Still waiting to hear about my expedited battery....cheque is in the mail response from Hyundai Canada. My wife as well has already told me that it isn't allowed in the garage (Garage attached to the house). So, if it ever shows up, I will have to get the electrician back to re-wire the charger for outside the garage.

So...just had a thought. What happens to all of these "replaced" (assuming they ever get replaced) battery packs. I can't see them going into a landfill anywhere. Potentially 77,000 battery packs must have a huge environmental footprint to build let alone replace. Is this the right way to build a green vehicle?
No one seems to be talking about this aspect. Zero emissions and green was a huge factor in my original purchase thought process.
 
Once a line is tooled up to disassemble a given type of cell, I would think that recycling of the materials
to produce new cells would be relatively easy and safe. Easier than mining.

_H*
 
Sue said:
I turned my 2019 Ultimate in to avoid the wait for a battery replacement for a 2021 Ultimate and it is now at the dealer waiting for a battery replacement. I was duped and I am not happy about it. It’s been 3 weeks so far…
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I am in the exact same situation. It will be a month soon since I took the car back to the dealership. They said they ordered the equipment they need to replace the battery. Once they get it just then they will order the battery. Nobody can tell me how long t could take. I am pissed off about the whole thing. I will never ever even think about buying another Hyundai.
 
ColoradoKonaEV said:
Sue said:
I turned my 2019 Ultimate in to avoid the wait for a battery replacement for a 2021 Ultimate and it is now at the dealer waiting for a battery replacement. I was duped and I am not happy about it. It’s been 3 weeks so far…
Click to expand...
I am in the exact same situation. It will be a month soon since I took the car back to the dealership.
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You could do some saber-rattling using your state's lemon law. First open a case with Hyundai Motor America and get a case number. Then tell them you are planning to make a lemon law claim if they don't fix it fast. Usually 30 days out of service is enough to trigger the law.
 
raspeitia said:
I'm in the same boat now and not sure what to do. 2021 Ultimate bought 2 months ago only have 3000 miles on it and would not start. Been at the dealer for 2 weeks with no clear answer from anyone.

Before that when I picked it up and drove home, the tires were shaking horribly. 2 tire replacements, 4 road force and 3 alignments later it still shakes. Had to put in a complaint for that.

What are my options?
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I might check your state's Lemon Law.
 
NS KONA Elec said:
I am by no means a battery expert. But I have looked around for any info I can find on the battery issue.

Here is some sort of a timeline so that others can form their own thoughts on whether or not they think this is related to the previous issues:
1. March – August 2019. Hyundai received reports of vehicle fires (Korea, Canada and Europe).
2. September 2019. Joint investigation with HMC and KATRI. the Korean safety authority.
3. March 2020. Hyundai releases update for the Battery Management System. BMS software updated to detect early abnormalities in the battery state while the vehicle is parked. Software update developed jointly with LG chem. Hyundai starts collecting and analysing battery packs collected during the campaign.
4. March 3, 2020. LG Chem has “remedied” the folded anode issue by adding extra insulation. google report "RCLRPT-21V127-1095" This date is important as it is the cut off for all of the recalls. Essentially the safety authorities say the "fire issue" has been solved if you battery is manufactured after this date.
5. April – October 2020. Additional reports of fires (7). HMC continues review and study with KATRI. Looking like electrical shorts. Confirmed that previous software update was successful in early detection of internal short and disable vehicle. This seems to be what happened to my 2021 Kona.
6. June 11, 2020. The battery management system is upgraded and applied to older konas and all new production? https://insideevs.com/news/428159/hyundai-updates-battery-monitoring-system-fire/
7. October 8, 2020. Hyundai voluntarily recalls 25000 Kona’s in Korea. https://www.electrive.com/2020/10/08/hyundai-recalls-25000-kona-models-in-korea/
8. October 2020. US mandatory recall to update BMS software and inspection of battery packs. Advisory to park outdoors. Affects 77000 vehicles manufactured up to March of 2020?
9. October 9, 2020. Hyundai QC admission? https://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/tech/2020/10/129_297311.html
View attachment 13320
10. October 13, 2020. Business details about Hyundai, Mobis and HL Green power over the recall. http://www.businesskorea.co.kr/news/articleView.html?idxno=53040
11. November 2020. My 2021 KONA Battery was made. Has HL GreenPower on the label. H stands for Hyundai and L for LG. Hyundai is still making the batteries for Konas with the same LG cells (although perhaps mods to catch production issues and a better BMS to stop fires before they start?).
12. November 16, 2020. Some info on Hyundai’s plan for Mobis and HL Green Power. https://english.etnews.com/20201116200003
13. Jan-Feb 2021. A Kona with updated BMS caught fire at 100% charge. Found internal short. Folded Anode in cell.
14. February 12, 2020. Rumor from electrek. https://electrek.co/2021/02/12/cause-of-lg-battery-fires-rumored-to-be-found/
View attachment 13321
15. February 23, 2021. LG Chem separator cell issue was discovered? (world wide? Except canada) North American recall of all potentially affected vehicles. Only includes 2019 and 2020. This is the battery replacement recall. But does NOT include 2021 and later model years. http://www.thelec.net/news/articleView.html?idxno=2420 This article and the excerpt form the ministry of transport in Korea seems to place the blame on the battery anodes. LGChem denies this as it had corrected that problem long ago and tried to replicate the problem but was unable to start a fire.
16. April 21, 2021. Hyundai to stop making Kona’s in Korea. https://www.theverge.com/2021/4/21/22396480/hyundai-discontinue-kona-ev-korea-battery-fire-recall
17. May 28, 2021. Closes July 2021. Hyundai Mobis buys all of HL green power. View attachment 13322
18. LG Chem buys battery separator company. https://www.econotimes.com/LG-Chem-...ng-LG-Electronics-CEM-for-525-billion-1614001
19. August 3, 2021. Looks like a KONA in korea caught fire after having the recall updates and a replacement battery. https://www.carindigo.com/news/hyun...ter-getting-back-from-official-company-recall
20. August 20, 2021. GM recalls ALL Chevy BOLTS for battery replacement. They also use LG Chem cells, different, but similiar manufacturing process?. Found 2 issues, but don’t specify (folded anode and separator?) https://my.chevrolet.com/how-to-support/safety/boltevrecallView attachment 13323Looks like GM is upfront that they may be providing "refurbished batteries" to bolt owners...
21. LG Chem just lost 8 billion dollars of share price. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-lg-gm-recall-idTRNIKBN2FO00H
22. Did GM just find the problem with their batteries. Folded separator? https://arstechnica.com/cars/2021/0...ot-may-have-sparked-chevy-bolt-battery-fires/
23. Here is a great story of why GM suddenly had to do something about the bolts. https://verticallobby.com/chevy-bolt-ev-catches-on-fire-after-receiving-both-of-gms-software-fixes/


Here is something posted on June 2020...
View attachment 13324
So. The "fix" seems to be to disable the vehicle before it starts a fire. This is what the transport authorities want to prevent and why there are safety related recalls. So, lets assume the BMS has fixed the fires...now the only issue is a disable Kona which becomes a owner issue and a warrantee issue NOT a safety issue. There will be no recalls unless more of these replacement batteries with updated BMS start to catch fire. See previous point 19.
Hyundai seems to have cancelled the Kona in Korea and then "re-distributed" them around the planet...Not dangerous...just potentially inconvenient when they shut down to prevent a fire and the owner has to wait months to get a replacement or make noise to force the company to do what is right.
This looks like the "not perfect solution". See point 9 above.
Presumably, all of us Kona Electric owners currently have warrantee coverage on our batteries. How will you feel when the warrantee runs out? Seems to me that these batteries cost $30K plus install...
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Lets hope this doesn't evolve to include Kona EV:
Bolt-EV-ban.jpg

another:
SP-parking-Bolt.jpg

Source:
https://driveteslacanada.ca/news/sa...bolt-evs-following-recall-over-fire-concerns/
Bolt is definitely getting a bad public reputation.
A 4 unit DC Charging facility I was at the other day, it was unusually busy, two sets of chargers paired next to one another in separate lots. Normally there might be one or two but that day there was actually a waiting line. The units I was charging at (the slower of the group - 30kW) I like to charge at, had a Leaf and myself, while a Tesla pulled up and waited behind. Before I reached 80% I mentioned to the owner about the available one in the other lot which was actually a faster rate (50kW). She mentioned that was her preferred charging spot, but declined to pull in beside the Bolt that was all by it's lonesome, and wait out for the slower rate charger instead.
Before I left, a Mach-E did the same thing, I declined to mention Kona EVs were experiencing a similar fate:confused:
 
Toolworker said:
You could do some saber-rattling using your state's lemon law. First open a case with Hyundai Motor America and get a case number. Then tell them you are planning to make a lemon law claim if they don't fix it fast. Usually 30 days out of service is enough to trigger the law.
Click to expand...

That’s not true in NYS. I was denied a lemon law claim while we waited and waited for a battery (4 months now). Lemon Laws don’t cover recall parts. NHTSA person told me the same. Said they knew of no state that allows a recalled part to qualify under lemon law. However threatening one does seem to make Hyundai jump a bit. Or at least someone would call us back after the threat and then communication would cease for the next few weeks


Sent from my iPhone using Inside EVs
 
ColoradoKonaEV said:
I am in the exact same situation. It will be a month soon since I took the car back to the dealership. They said they ordered the equipment they need to replace the battery. Once they get it just then they will order the battery. Nobody can tell me how long t could take. I am pissed off about the whole thing. I will never ever even think about buying another Hyundai.
Click to expand...
Hi ColoradoKonaEV, when you say that you are in the same situation as Sue, can you elaborate? Do you own a 2021 Kona that was disabled by the BMS and is waiting for a battery replacement?
I own a 2021 Kona that disabled itself 8 weeks ago and is awaiting a battery replacement. I am trying to collect information of how many of these 2021's have the similar issue.
Thanks and take care.
 
hobbit said:
Once a line is tooled up to disassemble a given type of cell, I would think that recycling of the materials
to produce new cells would be relatively easy and safe. Easier than mining.

_H*
Click to expand...
I agree with your thoughts in "theory". Please correct me if I am wrong, but nothing like this currently exists. If it does, please provide a link to your information on how hyundai is recycling these batteries.
Practically speaking, I don't see any company gearing up this "line" in a time frame that will recycle 77,000+ batteries in a fashion quick enough to provide "new" batteries to all affected Konas. I believe that most electric car companies weren't expecting to have to face the battery recycling issue for another decade or so...plenty of time to build your theoretical line. A line like this would require extreme safety provisions (lots of hazards here) and would likely be very manual and slow.
 
mikeselectricstuff said:
For such a large quantity of identical batteries, it would be well worth the effort for someone to use them to build a few grid-level storage units, built in a way that takes into account the potential fire/failure risk.
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Agreed. Another theoretical use that hasn't been built yet. Load shifting for grid is one of the future plans for batteries that have reduced charge, not necessarily batteries that are defective. My point was and still is that these 77,000+ batteries returning well before their designed life is ended is a HUGE problem for Hyundai and LG. None of this has been worked out yet. The issue is practicality. Where do you put 77,000+ batteries in the short to long term while you are working out these details? Especially since concentrating them means that hopefully only a few of them has a potential fire starting issue. One spark in a fireworks factory is devastating.

I will propose another theoretical use for 77,000+ identical Kona batteries is the following. Take each one back one at a time in a slow roll out of a recall. As each comes back, dismantle the pack and check each of the five modules. Don't get down to the cell level. If 4 out of five modules are deemed good, put them back into the pack with a fifth module from another recalled pack. Then package them up and send them back out the door to a waiting disabled Kona. From a practical standpoint, this is easier. Time consuming and keeps lots of Kona owners waiting and unhappy. Also, doesn't necessarily solve the problem. As a Kona owner, I wouldn't be happy with a recycled battery which has a mismatched set of battery modules with varying use on them.
GM has been upfront with their plan. They are recalling all bolts and here is the fine print on the batteries...GM warrants new OR REFURBISHED advance propulsion batteries...
upload_2021-9-9_7-33-27.webp
 
How can I check the battery type on the 2021 Ultimate I bought in June to replace my bought-back 2020? This one was built in December 2020. I assumed it would have an updated battery, but from this thread, maybe not.

(On the good side, the infotainment system has the old firmware from before Hyundai trashed the UI on the radio screen. I won't be "updating" it.)
 
R P said:
Why is that surprising? Pretty common in the industry as a model ages esp if it is going to be discontinued and replaced by brand new models....
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I might disagree with this assertion. This _IS_ the new model/facelift we are talking about. What manufacturer thinks it is a good idea to undercut the value of the current userbase by intentionally -devaluing- their investments? There is another thread about this on this site. The decrease in price is pretty stark and I'd call it a slap to those who bought in early to help the idea along. But that's just me, YMMV.
 
NS KONA Elec said:
Hi ColoradoKonaEV, when you say that you are in the same situation as Sue, can you elaborate? Do you own a 2021 Kona that was disabled by the BMS and is waiting for a battery replacement?
I own a 2021 Kona that disabled itself 8 weeks ago and is awaiting a battery replacement. I am trying to collect information of how many of these 2021's have the similar issue.
Thanks and take care.
Click to expand...
Yes, I have 2021 Kona EV which when charged to 100% at home with Level2 charger would not go into Drive. Attaching OBDII scanner and clearing the error codes would fix it until the next charging. I did this 3 or 4 times and took the car to the dealership, hoping it is a matter of software update to fix the problem. They kept the car for few days and talked to Hyundai for consultation. They were told the entire battery have to be replaced but was backordered at that time. This was exactly 1 month ago. The car is still at the dealership awaiting the equipment they need to swap the battery first to arrive. When they have it they would order the actual battery. This is what I know so far.
 
Not surprised at all as the Hyundai group ( Hyundai & Kia ) has never been known for quality products foe ICE products, do not expect any different for their EV products.
 
ColoradoKonaEV said:
Yes, I have 2021 Kona EV which when charged to 100% at home with Level2 charger would not go into Drive. Attaching OBDII scanner and clearing the error codes would fix it until the next charging. I did this 3 or 4 times and took the car to the dealership, hoping it is a matter of software update to fix the problem ... The car is still at the dealership ...
Click to expand...
"Doctor, it hurts when I do this."

"Don't do that."

Can you demand your car back, set the charge limit to 80% or 90%, and tell the dealer they can have it back when they are ready to replace the battery?
 
ColoradoKonaEV said:
Yes, I have 2021 Kona EV which when charged to 100% at home with Level2 charger would not go into Drive
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Exactly the reason I limit to 85% max, how many others (21 MY) in particular have had the bricked car experience also charged to 100%- I will start a poll.
If this starts happening to 22MY as well, perhaps a software update should be applied to limit the charge level (adding more top end buffer to avoid stress/expansion of the E66A cells), and reduce the EPA mileage at the same time. Of course a MSRP price adjustment would be in conjunction with this as well.
Could not find spec sheet on E66A or E78 cells, E63 should be close (see previous thread) , if one happens to find one, please post in forum.;)
 
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