Toggle switch for pedestrian sound

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polyphonic said:
On my car this toggle deactivates the sound in both forward and reverse, for the duration of the drive only. Then it defaults to back on.
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I remember mine doing that too but only the first time I select deactivate. The "remember" setting only seems to remembers the choice to disable it when going forward so after one shutdown the reverse noise comes back but forward does not.

polyphonic said:
The car threw a bunch of warnings while it was coding the seatbelt changes, but they went away after restarting the car a couple times.
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Same here (I probably should have mentioned that). Any setting that reboots a safety system ECU makes the car panic and set a bunch of codes. Once you restart the car it realizes everything is fine and the errors go away.
 
I dusted off some info I gathered about "singing cars" 3 years ago and posted to another forum on this web site. A summation of that thread was that the pedestrian sound produced by EV's is actually a requirement of federal law in the US but is optional in Canada (and maybe other countries?) -- hence, some EVs sold in the Canadian market have a "silence" switch as OEM standard. The OBD that works in the USA on MINI SE cars is actually a hack of the vehicle OEM s/w and can allow a MINI SE owner anywhere to "see" the menu switch in the BimmerCode and on the vehicle settings display.

My understanding is that actual implementation of this 2010 law was delayed numerous times until it actually became effective in 2020. My earlier (not updated for the even further delays) post from 2018 was:

"More than you ever wanted to know about 'singing EV's':

"This pedestrian-oriented synthetic noise all started with a new politically correct federal law in 2010 that has cost car makers (read instead "car customers") an estimated $23 million and which took federal regulators some 6 years to implement. I remember this because I purchased a 2014 Accord Hybrid, that thankfully escaped this particular regulatory net when the rules were postponed "for more coordination." The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration even had a web site where one could listen to the proposed synthetic sounds and, according to one article, "The proposed sounds are posted on NHTSA’s website, and automakers will have to choose between 'pleasant sounding, brainwave, thought-stealing machine' sound or 'piercing-wail-that-will-drive-your-dog-batshit-in-the-morning' sound." https://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2015/11/feds-postpone-hybrid-ev-warning-noises-next-year/"
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GvilleGuy said:
I look forward to the day that the Jetson's spaceship sound is a menu option.
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Be careful what you wish for. If people are allowed to change their car's pedestrian warning sound, you may be besieged by many sounds you'd rather not hear. For example, boom-box cars will simply pump their boom-box noises outside, too. I dread the idea of someone making their car emit Scott Joplin's "The Entertainer" like every ice-cream truck in town. I used to like that tune, but no more.
 
Here's the shockingly detailed NHTSA guideline: https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/documents/812347-minimumsoundrequirements.pdf

My concern with the EV pedestrian sound is increased noise pollution. I recognize that it is a critical safety feature, but at the same time our two EVs are probably the loudest vehicles in the neighborhood right now. Luxury gasoline cars in comparison are eerily quiet these days. It would be cacophonous if everyone in my area had EVs. The VW group cars are among the louder ones, perhaps by choice.

It's also interesting that the European guideline has the sound cutoff around 12 mph, whereas it's 18 mph in the US.
 
Have any of you noticed that there are front and rear sound sources for the Mini SE? I happened to be standing next to my SE when my wife put in in reverse. I heard the pedestrian sound come from the rear. She then put it back in drive to avoid an obstacle and the sound shifted to the front of the car. I was like "wait, do that again!"
 
polyphonic said:
My concern with the EV pedestrian sound is increased noise pollution. I recognize that it is a critical safety feature, but at the same time our two EVs are probably the loudest vehicles in the neighborhood right now. Luxury gasoline cars in comparison are eerily quiet these days. It would be cacophonous if everyone in my area had EVs. The VW group cars are among the louder ones, perhaps by choice.
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Wholeheartedly agree with you. Plus, aside from the overall noise pollution, the varying noises put out by various EV's will (IMHO) just lead to pedestrians who will recognize nor heed any EV artificial sound whatsoever when presented with a cacophony of various noises. Besides, many, if not most, pedestrians wear earbuds or headsets anyway now days when walking and can't hear anything (even ICE cars) except the music or whatever their smartphone is playing anyhow.
 
GvilleGuy said:
Have any of you noticed that there are front and rear sound sources for the Mini SE?
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Yes! The first time I did a little forward/reverse shuffle in the garage with my windows rolled down, I noticed that the forward sound turned off and I could hear the sound emanating from the rear.
 
As a musician I find the sound design for the pedestrian warning to be kind of sad. Musically its a minor triad that changes pitch with the vehicle speed. It's a bit unsettling.... I wish I could choose something that more reflected spirit of the Mini, some that better reflects the style and whimsy of this amazing vehicle.
 
Darrell Smith said:
As a musician I find the sound design for the pedestrian warning to be kind of sad. Musically its a minor triad that changes pitch with the vehicle speed. It's a bit unsettling.... I wish I could choose something that more reflected spirit of the Mini, some that better reflects the style and whimsy of this amazing vehicle.
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BMW/MINI are very proud of their sound designer, Renzo Vitale, an Italian pianist, composer, sound designer, acoustic engineer and artist. Read all about MINI's physical/music design collaboration here. I like the sound better than other EVs I've heard (caveat: I'm the only forum member who wished it was possible to sometimes turn up the volume).
 
The guidelines are very strict. I think ultimately it's going to take an approach that generates sound design on the fly based on circumstances like other vehicles in the area. Some cars have very distinct harmonies (Zoe) that would quickly clash if there were other EVs in the same location. The Amazon delivery van is the worst example of this. It's a nice little ambient track on its own, but imagine every vehicle in a city making that sound.

Elon Musk said something along the lines of it's important for them to play the right sounds at the right times, but not all the time. Just spitballing, heat sensing night vision is used in some cars already. If an animal or human is spotted it sounds a "ping" to the driver and displays it on the front screen. Maybe that sort of technology could be used to protect pedestrians, the blind, children, animals, etc. when present, while turning down the volume other times to reduce noise pollution? You could also send the pedestrian noise out directionally towards the other road user.
 
insightman said:
BMW/MINI are very proud of their sound designer, Renzo Vitale, an Italian pianist, composer, sound designer, acoustic engineer and artist. Read all about MINI's physical/music design collaboration here. I like the sound better than other EVs I've heard (caveat: I'm the only forum member who wished it was possible to sometimes turn up the volume).
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Thanks for the details on Renzo. That's totally fascinating. I'm such a fanboy of the car, and I hesitate to knock any feature of the SE. Its just been a bit unsettling for my choral directing wife and I. Perhaps that was the intent...
 
J.Dubs said:
Do you have to turn it off every time you drive? I enabled to option but I have to select it every time
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There's a "hidden" option to remember it. Basically when you first connect BimmerCode, tell it your car is an i3. According to the BimmerCode documentation it should be called "Remember acoustic pedestrian protection" under the VSG01 control unit.

As I noted above somewhere, this only remembers the setting for drive. The noise in reverse returns after the car is restarted.
 
Darrell Smith said:
Thanks for the details on Renzo. That's totally fascinating. I'm such a fanboy of the car, and I hesitate to knock any feature of the SE. Its just been a bit unsettling for my choral directing wife and I. Perhaps that was the intent...
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More on Vitale's "sound genetics" method for developing EV sounds for BMW & MINI can be read at "There are two schools of thought emerging when it comes to electric vehicle sounds"

Personally, I am on the fence about this whole topic.

If the reason for these mandated sounds is to warn pedestrians about the presence of a moving nearby EV, they seem to be nearly pointless in today's modern, urban world where many (if not most) pedestrians are using bluetooth ear plugs or headphones when walking or jogging and couldn't hear a nearby locomotive anyway. If the main reason for the sounds is artistic and part of the "soul" of a vehicle, OK, but give drivers a way to turn these "singing cars" off to potentially save us all from even more noise in our lives. Silence can be beautiful too.
 
Texas22Step said:
in today's modern, urban world where many (if not most) pedestrians are using bluetooth ear plugs or headphones
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One group of pedestrians that is almost certainly not voluntarily blocking their hearing and can benefit from EVs' artificial low-speed sounds are the visually impaired.

That said, most ICE cars are quieter than the MINI Cooper SE at parking-lot speeds, so the visually impaired face more jeopardy from ICE cars and most in that group are likely used to dealing with that jeopardy.

It follows that the EPA's case for pedestrian warning sounds for EVs could logically be extended to all vehicles. Can you imagine the vehement reaction if the EPA's pedestrian warning-sound mandate was extended to all vehicles? The word "nanny" would become even more prevalent in online discussions. Few of those discussions would consider the number of injuries and deaths prevented and, indeed, that number would very difficult to quantify.
 
insightman said:
Can you imagine the vehement reaction if the EPA's pedestrian warning-sound mandate was extended to all vehicles?
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Like the backup beeping on trucks, which I get is a safety feature. But if you happen to have construction going on near you it can drive you crazy. At least (most) EVs are creating more pleasant sounds for pedestrian warning.
 
Puppethead said:
Like the backup beeping on trucks, which I get is a safety feature. But if you happen to have construction going on near you it can drive you crazy. At least (most) EVs are creating more pleasant sounds for pedestrian warning.
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For my Kodiak, Washington may require me to update my backup beeper to a white-noise emitter... we'll see. (I may do this before I am required to because I hate the beep)
 
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