My Clarity rear ended

If you did $0 down you may want to take a look at current value of the car. You’ll find that the gap is more than what you are stating.

I’m ok not taking the gap so I didn’t. I got $12.5 back on the car from the fed and the great state of Colorado. I’m upside down on the loan but it’s more than covered.

I’ve never had gap so I don’t know how much it is, but guessing by your strong response it must be pretty spendy.
 
LR door jamb being closed up like that means definite structural damage (as did the crushed rear body panel in the first photos), but that doesn't mean it's totaled in and of itself. Qualified shop can fix all that no problem. But still maybe totaled depending on price. Total loss is a financial calculation period. Insurance company compares the cost of repairs, with the cost of buying the car and getting money back by selling the salvage. So for example if they decide the car is worth $29K, and salvage value as-is is about $10K, they will total the car ONLY if cost of repair is predicted to exceed $19K. (Obviously I am making up all these numbers for illustration purposes only.)

That is a gross simplification also...much goes into those calculations including predicted hidden damage, loss of value, sales taxes, rental/loss of use costs, etc. but it is still a simple math formula to the insurance company...generally all estimated numbers get spit into a computer and the computer tells the adjuster whether they will proceed with total loss or repair. And this decision could change later, after tear-down. An initial estimate is written, which is usually missing 20% to 50% of the damages. Then tear-down exposes more, then as repairs progress they find yet more. Normal and expected. At any point in the game the insurance company may stop the supplementals and declare it a total loss. Keep in touch with the shop periodically, and the insurance company, to keep yourself informed. But beware this will be a slower process than you want it to be. One month minimum for repairs, and if parts can't be obtained (very likely being a Clarity), many months could go by...and this ongoing loss of use/rental expense may help push the total loss decision also.

You can use Progressive if you want to...sounds like they are the other person's carrier and they are OK, but not great. That company is well-known in the industry for very overworked and somewhat underqualified adjusters, but generalizations do not always describe the person handling YOUR claim, so give that person a chance. Or you can use your own insurance company for repairs and just ask Progressive to forward your deductible and your company will subrogate Progressive after all is said and done -- no charge to you and no claim counted against your policy either way. Both methods are commonly done and acceptable. Also don't sweat the aftermarket parts issue -- for Clarity they don't exist, so the only part alternative for this car is going to be Honda...or salvage, and salvage will also be mostly made of unobtanium because of how rare this car is, plus most insurance companies don't even bother attempting to find salvage parts within the first year of a car's life.

Also be aware that your own policy will have an exclusion for loss of value...you will get zero from your own on that front. So your only hope on loss of value is to make a claim to the claimant carrier (Progressive) and in most states they legally owe it to you, if you can prove loss of value...which is pretty easy in today's world of CarFax, etc. Also keep this in mind if you choose to go thru your own carrier for repairs -- they do not pay loss of value, therefore your own insurance company is LESS likely to total this car than Progressive will be, because your own company will ignore loss of value in their calculations for sure, whereas Progressive is more likely to include it. Something to consider.

So feel free to handle exclusively thru Progressive beginning to end. If they tick you off, call your own carrier and tell them to take over repairs and they will. Then when all is said and done you are on your own go for loss of value directly thru Progressive. That figure can't be calculated until car is fixed and all damage is known/calculated, so that is the last payment you will receive and not something to concern yourself with immediately. Get a repair vs total loss decision nailed down first. DO verbalize you intend to make a loss of value claim after repairs are done...if you have a smart adjuster he/she will consider this in their total loss calculations...dumb ones will not. Remember there's a human aspect to everything. Including insurance calculations and dealing with adjusters...they're humans too, some are better than others at their job, and sometimes they can override what the computer tells them to do within reason.

And remember you, like EVERY SINGLE OTHER CAR OWNER, feels their car should be totaled after a wreck like this. I assure you that no matter what he/she says to you, that insurance adjuster simply doesn't care or consider what you want, nor does their computer. They deal in facts and figures. So if you can help them find and consider facts and figures that support YOUR position, this is your only way to "push" them to total the car. So you want to try to get them to find HIGH salvage value figures, HIGH repair costs, HIGH loss of use/rental costs, HIGH loss of value costs. And as counter-intuitive as this sounds...a LOW value for your car. That combo will get them to mathematically total the car. But your feelings, desires, and opinions will not. Especially with Progressive, as you are a non-paying customer to them that they do not need to retain or please, and they only owe you what they owe you according to state law.

Not to get your hopes up but I see a high likelihood of total loss in a situation like this -- the frame tech will likely have a discussion with manager/insurance about the dangers of pulling/cutting/welding the structure of this car that is likely strained/buckled close to the battery pack in the trunk. And Honda certainly has clear procedures on how to proceed with the process and they will NOT be simple nor cheap!! Might need to remove entire battery pack (which is essentially the floor of this car) before any repairs can be done to the car. I have no earthly idea if/how that is done. I assure you this will be the FIRST Clarity they've seen, so the shop AND the insurance company will be learning along with you and I. And a manager of an insurance company may override everything the computer says and simply say "we ain't taking the liability of fixing this experimental vehicle..." And this is probably what you want to happen...so Godspeed.

Keep us informed. I personally made the repair vs total loss decision on probably 30,000+ different wrecked cars during my career, yet I can't begin to predict this one, so I am genuinely curious how it will work out. Cars like this one frankly contributed to me choosing to end that career--the technology in new vehicles was starting to overwhelm me from the repair and training side, as well as dealing with shops on these types of things. Field appraisers/adjusters like me serve as the intermediary between out-of-touch old-school insurance managers who think everything can be fixed dirt cheap with bubble-gum and bailing wire, state-of-the art repair facilities who think it costs $80 per screwdriver revolution (because you need to be "certified" to hold a screwdriver)...and owners who frankly have zero knowledge of the whole process and usually just get in the way -- yet are our precious paying customers who must be retained and pleased. And the gap between the 3 parties over time has become a wide chasm...so I burned out. I LOVED it for 18 years, tolerated it for 4, and HATED it for 3. Then finally declared career over, blissfully.

FWIW, my $8K to $12K estimate stated earlier is based on all my recent experience with NON-electric cars rear-ended similar to this one. All bets are off with this one due to the battery pack possibly being in the way of necessary repairs. I admittedly have no idea what the final repair cost will be...

And next time anyone wants to complain about the cost of insurance -- keep some of these numbers in mind. This routine rear-ender could have been fixed for $4K about 10 years ago. Today that number triples and/or totals out the entire car, due to the technology in electronics and construction materials/methods in these cars. And rear-end impacts are cheap compared to frontal impacts...collision repair costs are positively skyrocketing like our health care costs are right now. Insurance rate increases follow.

Very sorry you became the crash test dummy for the group...I very much wish you an acceptable outcome.

I just want to thank you for this post. Probably one of the most educational reads in this forum. I hope I don’t find myself in this situation, but because of this post I’d be better suited to handle it. Cheers!
 
If you did $0 down you may want to take a look at current value of the car. You’ll find that the gap is more than what you are stating.
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Eh...I figure insurance based on my resources would agree mine is worth about $26,500, plus they’d pay me sales tax in Indiana. And I owe about $34,000. So I’m short about $6500ish....

And I could be wrong. That’s the risk. But I think I’m pretty close.

And as a former insider, it wouldn’t surprise me one bit if the insurance company asks for the state and federal rebates before they calculate the true gap they will pay....buyer beware. Customers definition of gap is often far different from the insurance companies definition of gap....trust me on that one.
 
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If you did $0 down you may want to take a look at current value of the car. You’ll find that the gap is more than what you are stating.

I’m ok not taking the gap so I didn’t. I got $12.5 back on the car from the fed and the great state of Colorado. I’m upside down on the loan but it’s more than covered.

I’ve never had gap so I don’t know how much it is, but guessing by your strong response it must be pretty spendy.

I appreciate everything I just learned as well from all these posts.

However, I fail to see how Gap insurance is a rip off at the cost of $400? I thought that was cheap insurance, relatively speaking.

-Skip


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It's interesting that the dealer asking price on the very few used Claritys I could find on edmunds / KBB were more expensive than the cost of the equivalent new vehicle (counting incentives). I saw some 2018 Base with ca. 10K miles on them at asking prices in excess of $28K. I don't know how that might factor into your claim although the one time I had a car totaled, I was able to get a substantial increase in the offered settlement on the basis of how much was being asked for comparable cars on edmunds.
 
Many people do not qualify to get anything, or much, from the federal tax credit, yet might want a Clarity. Depends on your personal tax situation. Thus there is some maket for higher priced/lower mileage used Clarities.
 
I appreciate everything I just learned as well from all these posts.

However, I fail to see how Gap insurance is a rip off at the cost of $400? I thought that was cheap insurance, relatively speaking.

-Skip


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You assume gap covers the whole gap. It often does not. Lots and lots of fine print in gap policies. If you financed sales taxes or any dealer add ons they are usually not covered. The tax credits and rebates may not be covered, I’m not sure. If you had a trade in at time of purchase the value of the trade and any financing her might have been on that car all plays into the calculations. Extended warranty rolled into loan is not covered. So you may be paying only $400 for gap coverage that actually pays out $350 or $450 at time of a claim, and still leaves you with a $6,000 gap...

NO lay person understands the full workings of gap coverage. Heck Most professional insurance adjusters don’t understand it and refer gap claims to management or gap specialists to handle. In my 25 year Insurance claims career I have only occasionally seen gap coverage payouts that exceeded the amount of paid premium, and often a gap still remains after gap pays what it owes. That’s why I largely feel it’s a ripoff. There are exceptions to every claim and it might be a good purchase for some.
 
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It dawns on me that the weight of the Clarity is a driver in the amount of structural damage you see in a rear-end event like this. Instead of transferring much of the the energy into change in momentum of the Clarity (whiplash for passengers), the weight (mass) of the car causes more structural damage to dissipate the energy. Makes the car much safer for the passengers, though.
 
It dawns on me that the weight of the Clarity is a driver in the amount of structural damage you see in a rear-end event like this. Instead of transferring much of the the energy into change in momentum of the Clarity (whiplash for passengers), the weight (mass) of the car causes more structural damage to dissipate the energy. Makes the car much safer for the passengers, though.

Yes, this is true.
Modern automobiles are designed to have the car take on more of the crush and impact forces than the occupants face in terms of injury.

So it's natural that the cost of repairs do skyrocket compared to the ancient cars that were made like a tank and caused more human soft tissue damage.
 
Yes, but I wasn't just talking about modern cars. The higher mass (weight) of the Clarity makes similarly designed crumple zones work better, making it less likely to deploy airbags, stress occupants, etc from collisions. Of course, the crumple zones take the hit and the wreck looks worse at the impact site.
 
Thank you for all the posts. It has been very helpful to me in this time. I hate having to drive an All GAS car. But at least no one was injured in the accident. I am still waiting to hear from someone at the insurance, auto body regarding what they are going to do. The adjuster was supposed to look at it today.
 
Yes, but I wasn't just talking about modern cars. The higher mass (weight) of the Clarity makes similarly designed crumple zones work better, making it less likely to deploy airbags, stress occupants, etc from collisions. Of course, the crumple zones take the hit and the wreck looks worse at the impact site.


The vehicle that hit me, a 2005 Chevy Tahoe never braked but it stopped when it hit me. Even with this big vehicle, the Clarity held it’s own, though the backend crumpled up significantly. My tires didn’t roll forward (I was braking at the light). After going through this accident, I think having 4000 lbs Clairty helped to protect us, along with modern designs. It wasn’t as jarring as you would think.
 
Thank you for all the posts. It has been very helpful to me in this time. I hate having to drive an All GAS car. But at least no one was injured in the accident. I am still waiting to hear from someone at the insurance, auto body regarding what they are going to do. The adjuster was supposed to look at it today.

Good luck to you on this and hopefully you get the best possible outcome!
Keep us updated.
 
The last accident I suffered was in my wife's Kia Soul a couple of years ago. I was driving it down the freeway (the car was six months old) and everybody stopped to look at an accident except the guy in the Camry behind me. When he noticed everyone slowing or stopping he hit the brakes but it was too late for the Kia. At 45-50MPH he nailed the back end. It looked similar to the Clarity hit.
I took down his insurance information and took pictures of his license and headed home. Police would not stop unless it caused a traffic hazard or if someone was hurt.
When I got home I did not even think to call my insurance company but instead called the Camry's. I told them that the next day I was going to drop off the Kia at their body shop and I need a rental. They too reported an adjuster needed to inspect but I told them I needed a rental the next day. They agreed and asked me to take pictures of the damage to them for their records.
Next day went to the other insurance body shop (well named franchise) and it took about 20 minutes to assess the damage and come up with an estimate.
By the time they were done the rental was in the parking lot.
The driver's insurance called me and told me that the max they would pay, based on the driver's coverage, was $5K. I laughed and said it's not my problem but their's if the damage and rental would exceed. The insurance agent had the worst attitude.
The day I was suppose to pick up the Kia, after it was fixed, I inspected and found all kinds of issues and debris in the trunk. I told the famous body shop that "act like I never inspected and call me when the car is 100% ready. When I left, the other insurance called me and reported the costs exceed the policy. I again told the agent, it was not my problem and we should not have this conversation and I was going to pick up the car the next day. He threatened not to pay for the damage and I laughed again and reported if I go through my insurance they would ensure the damage was paid for and they would have to dole out the money sooner than later.
The next day I picked up the car, the original body shop adjuster was there, apologized for the stuff that was missed or left in the trunk and walked me through the car. I noticed a couple of things and he had them fixed on the spot. I left and the other insurance called me and reported that the total bill came out to be $4.995 and I was lucky. I responded, you guys were lucky. I then went home and sent a email to the insurance company's leadership (with the agent's name) describing my experience. I did get a nice response back.

A couple of years later that damn Kia was hit again, but their insurance company was awesome and I even got a brand new BMW X3 as a loaner. But again I took the imitative to drop off and get a loaner at my convenience and not the other insurance company. Luckily, my wife decided to get rid of the Kia for a better SUV.

So long story longer, when you get in accident and its not your fault take the matter in your own hands.
A young girl (single mother) who worked in my firm was hit (a few years ago) and the air bags deployed, the insurance company tried to fix the car and told her she could not right it off. When she reported that to me I got a bit angry and asked if I can call her insurance company to get their reasoning why the car did not fall under the right off threshold. I told the insurance company that the extensive damage negatively affected the car's integrity and if fixed would but the single mother and child at risk. I also asked if they where going to pay extra since the car lost value because of the accident (helps being in California to claim). They person on the phone got a bit confused and had me talk with the manager. Anyway, I found out that the single mother had the option but was never asked if she wanted the car back or they buy back. The good news she did not take the car and the better news they gave her above market price for it. But the sad news she ended up getting a new California PT Cruiser for a replacement.
 
The vehicle that hit me, a 2005 Chevy Tahoe never braked but it stopped when it hit me. Even with this big vehicle, the Clarity held it’s own, though the backend crumpled up significantly. My tires didn’t roll forward (I was braking at the light). After going through this accident, I think having 4000 lbs Clairty helped to protect us, along with modern designs. It wasn’t as jarring as you would think.

Glad to hear no one was seriously injured.

Make sure you do NOT sign off any insurance docs releasing them of liability in the future.

Case in point:
My wife was in a rear ender accident but a few days later, she could not lie down because there was soft tissue damage to her neck and spine. Interestingly, their insurance company had mailed us a "settled in full" check of $2,500 for the "cosmetic repairs" and a liability release claims later which I promptly declined and told them that repairs and medical were going to cost a lot more.


The total costs were actually about $25,000:
  • $12,000 body shop
  • $1,500 car rental for a month
  • $7,500 medical reimbursement (MD & DC)
  • $3,500 Diminished value claim check (my attorney had to help)
 
I want to thank everyone for post their experience here...This post is awesome in that it helps Clarity owner know what to expect when getting in an accident.

I just got rear ended last night on my 2 month old Clarity. :(

Wondering if anyone know if this look serious or not... the right side (see picture with Red cycle) seem to have bent/warp a bit.
IMG_0965.webp IMG_0966.webp IMG_0967.webp IMG_0969.webp IMG_0970.webp IMG_0971.webp IMG_0972.webp IMG_0974.webp IMG_0975.webp
 
Oh, dear. I am going to have to stop reading this thread. It makes me sad.

What Honda sensing really needs is a force field. Where is Dr Who when you need him.

Hope everyone is OK.
 
Make sure the body shop is one that can work with aluminum and follow the temperature and time limits baking in the paint booth or your battery will be damage. A shop that is certified for Teslas would have the knowledge and skills to deal with both aluminum and the temperature limits on the traction batteries.
 
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