I replaced the spark plugs today on my Clarity PI

C

Casey Martin

Active Member
I have almost 145k miles on my Clarity PI. I decided to replace the plugs. I haven't tracked how many miles were electric and how many were ICE. I charge at my work everyday. My commute is about 80 miles a day. I average 50 weeks a year commuting to work. Over 6 years that is about 60k miles of electric driving if I average it to 40 miles per charge. I think 50k to 60k miles of electric driving is a decent rough estimate.

That all means I am estimating the plugs have between 85k - 95k miles on them. I am impressed how well the gaps have held up. They don't appear to have worn much at all. I replaced them with OEM plugs that cost about $30 a piece. I don't know if it was necessary to replace them yet. I haven't experienced any misfire codes or any other issues. I probably could have used the original plugs for a lot longer but I decided to replace them now.

Edit: I have a level 2 charger at home but since gas is cheaper than electricity here in RI I don't charge at home often. On average I pay around $.30 to $.35 per KWH. I average around 40 miles per 17 kwh charge depending on the time of year. Gas would have to be more than $5 a gallon for electricity to be cheaper since I believe the Clarity PI averages around 40 mpg on gasoline alone. Anyway, I don't charge at home often for that reason. Those are all just rough estimates of course but that sounds about right to me. I get to charge at work for free which is a nice benefit.
 

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NGK states that the Laser Series has a service life of 80-100K miles. So, if your estimates are accurate, you’re right on schedule. One thing to remember is that even in HV Mode the ICE doesn’t run all the time, so there are probably fewer actual miles on the engine than you’ve estimated.
 
Casey Martin said:
On average I pay around $.30 to $.35 per KWH. I average around 40 miles per 17 kwh charge depending on the time of year. Gas would have to be more than $5 a gallon for electricity to be cheaper since I believe the Clarity PI averages around 40 mpg on gasoline alone. Anyway, I don't charge at home often for that reason.
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People aren’t going to jump on the electric bus at those rates. Is that the total cost per kWh including the baseline charge, taxes and fees? The national average is about half that and with gas at about $3/gal it’s pretty much a wash as to which fuel is more affordable.
 
Landshark said:
People aren’t going to jump on the electric bus at those rates. Is that the total cost per kWh including the baseline charge, taxes and fees? The national average is about half that and with gas at about $3/gal it’s pretty much a wash as to which fuel is more affordable.
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That is the total cost per KWH I pay to my electric company. I simply divide the total KWH used by the total amount charged. It does vary but over the last year or so it has averaged between $.30 and .$35 per KWH including all delivery fees and taxes.

I know the national average is much lower electricity rates than what I am paying here in RI. I can only comment on what I am paying. I know there are many parts of the US that are paying significantly lower per KWH than I am here in RI.

I believe my math is sound based on what I am paying per KWH. I could be wrong of course.
 
TC1782 said:
Everything on this car is expensive. At least the spark plugs aren't a steaming pile of trash, unlike a vast majority of the car.
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It sounds like you have not had much good luck with your Clarity PI. I have had my share of issues but overall I have been very impressed with the quality of my Clarity PI. Especially considering we have all been basically beta testers of the platform. I honestly believe PI hybrid is the answer until the electrical charging infrastructure is viable for people like me that drive high mileage. I bought my wife a Prologue recently. Her commute is about 7 miles per day and I have a level 2 charger at home. The Prologue fits her driving habits perfectly. I drive about 25k miles a year. The DC fast charging infrastructure, at least here in New England, is terrible. Until the Infrastructure improves dramatically I will not own and electric only vehicle. That is why I believe PI hybrid is the best solution for the next decade or so. Unfortunately the additional cost to manufacture a PI Hybrid is cost prohibitive for manufacturers. Full electric is much cheaper to produce than a ICE hybrid that has an engine, complicated transmission, fuel tank, exhaust system, emission, etc.

That is obviously just my opinion but I have been overall very happy with my Clarity PI. I am sorry you have not had the same experience.
 
The plugs look good. No oil, no excessive carbon deposit. Looks like the engine can last another 100K miles. $.30-$.35 a KW is crazy. What's the point of charging when gas is cheaper! I pay about 28 cents a kw and kinda break even with gas at $2.90 a gallon.
 
At $.28/kw wouldn’t a full charge cost about $4 ($3.92)? Typically, a full charge provides about the same range as a gallon of gas. Maybe your EV range and mpg are significantly different from the norm.

Regardless, it takes low electricity rates and high gasoline prices to realize reduced fuel costs with a PHEV, if one chooses to operate primarily on electricity. Those conditions tend to be present in a few states such as Oregon, Washington, Idaho and Nevada.

megreyhair said:
Whats the point of charging when gas is cheaper! I pay about 28 cents a kw and kinda break even with gas at $2.90 a gallon.
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Full charge at about $4 and gas is less then $3 a gallon. Both go about the same distance. So it doesn't make sense to stay in EV all the time.
The only reason why you would want to drive in EV is to avoid waiting or driving to the gas station to fill

Landshark said:
At $.28/kw wouldn’t a full charge cost about $4 ($3.92)? Typically, a full charge provides about the same range as a gallon of gas. Maybe your EV range and mpg are significantly different from the norm.

Regardless, it takes low electricity rates and high gasoline prices to realize reduced fuel costs with a PHEV, if one chooses to operate primarily on electricity. Those conditions tend to be present in a few states such as Oregon, Washington, Idaho and Nevada.
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megreyhair said:
Full charge at about $4 and gas is less then $3 a gallon. Both go about the same distance.
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Wouldn’t you be doing better than breaking even with gas costing 25% less than electricity, or even better yet, with electricity costing 33% more than gas?
 
In Chicago my all in rate is .16/kw so full charge is $1.80ish. I would hate to seem elec bil at .33
 
Here in northern California, our current PGE rate is .44 per kw (off-peak) and .48 (peak). However, we have a net-zero roof-top solar system (actually with a yearly 800 kw surplus), so we run in EV mode as much as possible (67% of miles since purchased). Obviously our solar system wasn't free but, based on my calculations, it will take less than 7 years to hit the break-even point (assuming no additional rate increases, which is a laughable assumption based on recent history). Gas is $4.70 right now but, regardless of the price, it's cheaper for us to charge the car.
 
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This is one of the many reasons why I feel PI Hybrid is the best answer for most consumers for the foreseeable future. The electricity rates and gas rates vary dramatically across our great country. Using what is the most cost efficient is the benefit of having a PI Hybrid. Oh well. It appears PI Hybrid is not going to be that common going forward unfortunately. I honestly believe that if manufacturers could make a PI Hybrid that could average roughly 100 miles on pure electric that would be the best solution for most people for the next ten years. I know full electric is the ultimate answer but the DC charging infrastructure as of now is absolutely terrible and I don't see it being fixed anytime soon. I am going to enjoy my Clarity PI for as along as I can. Hopefully it last me another 100k miles or more. Fingers crossed!
 
Casey Martin said:
Oh well. It appears PI Hybrid is not going to be that common going forward unfortunately. I honestly believe that if manufacturers could make a PI Hybrid that could average roughly 100 miles on pure electric that would be the best solution for most people for the next ten years.
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The future of PHEV’s may not be as bleak as you imagine. There are about 3 dozen PHEV models available in the US and more are in the works. Currently, the EV range of these vehicles is between about 25-45 miles. That range is sufficient to cover the average commute in the US. Anecdotally, we rarely needed more than the 45ish EV miles from the Clarity for daily commuting or errands and the car reduced our fossil fuel consumption by about 90%.

My understanding is that California has imposed a new regulation that requires PHEV’s to have at least 50 miles of EV range, starting in 2025 or 2026. That would suggest that nearly all PHEV’s sold in the US will have more EV range than they do now. It could also deter manufacturers from producing such vehicles if they can’t meet the requirement. On rare occasions the great minds that make decisions on our behalf create conditions that are detrimental to achieving the stated goal.

As far as complicated drivetrains, the platform on which the Ramcharger is built eliminates those complexities in the same way as in the BMW Rex and Karma models. A larger battery benefits such a platform, so perhaps the 50+ mile goal can be achieved in combination with a simplified drivetrain.
 
Landshark said:
Regardless, it takes low electricity rates and high gasoline prices to realize reduced fuel costs with a PHEV, if one chooses to operate primarily on electricity. Those conditions tend to be present in a few states such as Oregon, Washington, Idaho and Nevada.
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Actually, electric rates are significantly cheaper than gas about everywhere outside of the northeast, California, Alaska and Hawaii.
https://www.eia.gov/electricity/monthly/epm_table_grapher.php?t=epmt_5_6_a
 
David Towle said:
Actually, electric rates are significantly cheaper than gas about everywhere outside of the northeast, California, Alaska and Hawaii.
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Wouldn’t we need to look at gas prices in each state and compare those to the corresponding electricity rates in order to reach an informed decision?

A number of states with electricity rates at +/- $.15/kw also have low gas prices, at $2.35-2.65/gal. That has us at about $2.10 for a full charge, or $2.25 in Chicago when we correctly multiply $.16 by 14kw’s. So there is some cost advantage using electricity over gas when we get 40 miles from either source at the prices mentioned above. Whether or not that is “significantly cheaper” is a matter of opinion. We don’t all live in Florida where flat terrain and warm temperatures yield 40+ miles of EV range through the winter months. Some of us are going to see 30-35 miles from that full charge for the next 4-5 months, so the scales tip a bit for a good portion of the year which minimizes the benefit of using electricity.

In the big picture, electricity that costs 10-20% less than gasoline might yield an annual savings of $100-200. It’s a relatively minor expense for many folks, but could be significant for some.
 
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