Honda Has No PHEV Plans

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Steven B

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I had been holding out for a Passport or Pilot PHEV, but sadly, this may be the final straw that pushes me to another Mfr.

"There's one thing that Honda isn't including in its plans, and that's plug-in hybrids. When asked why, American Honda's executive Vice President of National Operations Dave Gardner noted that public and governmental feelings have moved from just reducing emissions to eliminating them entirely. As such, the time and effort to develop plug-in hybrids doesn't make sense when that could be applied to fully electric cars."
From:
https://www.autoblog.com/2022/01/13/honda-hrv-product-plans-no-phevs/

Some of us have limited vacation time and can't afford to spend an extra two days on a five day vacation because we have to build in long stops to and from. Hurry up with those quick-charge solid state batteries please!
 
They must only be looking at CA’s situation. The reality here in the Midwest is “fast charging” stations barely exist even for Teslas and are located mainly along Interstates. ICE vehicles frequently park in the EV spots. In the Cleveland area, Plug Share app shows two chargers over 50kw and both are Electrify America.


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So the positive way to put this is PHEV is a nice option for folks. Since a PHEV covers most peoples day-to-day commute, it has the potential to really help ease gasoline use (and importantly the lackthereof).

For me, I'd love to see EV's make sense, but I'm practical. I think nothing of driving 2000 miles (once a year in the rural west) and EV's aren't going to be viable for some time in that space. So PHEV is the smart choice. It also means I don't have to maintain and insure two or more vehicles. i.e. if one has a BEV, they likely also have a gas backup.

My daily drive is all-electric. My annual 2000 mile trip burns gas (so be it, and at 40mpg). I think the average American would be just fine with PHEV with 40 mile range; that's the beauty of Clarity which can do such.
 
Mad_River said:
They must only be looking at CA’s situation. The reality here in the Midwest is “fast charging” stations barely exist even for Teslas and are located mainly along Interstates. ICE vehicles frequently park in the EV spots. In the Cleveland area, Plug Share app shows two chargers over 50kw and both are Electrify America.


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Well your state is going to receive 100 million dollars of federal money to install DC chargers over the next 5 years.
 
California's regulations have not been written as 100% electric. They are allowing 20% PHEV. A long distance trip is not fully workable on an electric, and there is also no current solution for apartment dwellers.
Has anyone noticed how expensive some of the public chargers are?
 
Of the EV chargers I've encountered when away from home, I've never seen one priced cheaper than gas. I presume there's an assumption that folks do all their charging at home. There seems to be a 'we know we've got you' price at charging stations away from home.

No issue with PHEV. I check the price, do the math, and then buy gas.
 
Steven B said:
I had been holding out for a Passport or Pilot PHEV, but sadly, this may be the final straw that pushes me to another Mfr.

"There's one thing that Honda isn't including in its plans, and that's plug-in hybrids. When asked why, American Honda's executive Vice President of National Operations Dave Gardner noted that public and governmental feelings have moved from just reducing emissions to eliminating them entirely. As such, the time and effort to develop plug-in hybrids doesn't make sense when that could be applied to fully electric cars."
From:
https://www.autoblog.com/2022/01/13/honda-hrv-product-plans-no-phevs/

Some of us have limited vacation time and can't afford to spend an extra two days on a five day vacation because we have to build in long stops to and from. Hurry up with those quick-charge solid state batteries please!
Click to expand...

Public feelings?? Have they done a referendum, or even a poll about it? Or maybe it's just governmental "feelings"?
Sorry, I hate to wade into the stinky swamp of politics, but the argument of this Mr. Gardner simply exposes the talibanic "all or nothing" mentality of many of the current crop of corporate bosses graduated from the same school as some zealots in positions of power. It's all ideology/feelings driven, not market-driven, common-sense driven, data-driven or even less consumer convenience driven.
It explains why they "canceled" excellent cars like the Chevy Volt, and our Clarity. They refuse to see the current limitations of EV technology and just want to pursue the "perfect" while refusing to consider the "good".
They don't care a bit about your limited vacation time, the scarcity of chargers in my area, or people living in apartments (I only bought my Clarity after moving to a home with garage). They just want to feel good witht their merits in the fight against climate change. Never mind if you get stranded with a wheeled brick, or you have to shorten your vacations and frustrate your kids. Vacationing also hurts the environment, did you know?
Fortunately, not all car companies are ruled by mullahs like this Dave Gardner. I already decided a while ago I'm leaving Honda for good. When I feel the need to replace my Clarity, I would look for a Lexus PHEV, a RAV4 prime or any other PHEV which is not not tiny, and with an electric range greater than 30 miles, and and cheaper than $60K.
I would only stick to a BEV when there are as many chargers as gas pumps and I can charge my car in 15 minutes. I suspect the solid state quick charge batteries will not be coming from Honda. Maybe Tesla, maybe Toyota, GM or some European. If PHEVs are no more, I'd switch back to gas cars while available. Horses are not an option either, because they f*rt.
Sorry for the rant. Or maybe I can get canceled now?
 
Roughly 2 yrs from the original post, I finally succeeded in acquiring a RAV4 Prime without a market adjustment. Since 99% of them seem to be allocated to ZEV states, it was a long drive home.

Haven't had time to figure out all the deficiencies yet, but first one appears to be no walk-away auto lock. My theory is that Toyota was onto the subscription game before Honda was. Having walk away auto lock would make Toyota's remote connected service subscription (which has a lock/unlock feature via the app) just that little bit less compelling. Managing charging via the app also requires this subscription.
 
Thanks for the info Steven B. My sister just bought a RAV4 but went the hybrid route due to cost. The Prime is more money and isn't off-set by the $7500 rebate like it once was. The other detail I noticed is that I could get HondaCare (the official Honda warranty) for $1550 for 8 years, 120K miles. I don't remember the Toyota cost but could not find a low cost option for it.
 
Now I hear that Honda is coming with a new PHEV called Prelude. It looks like the 2013 Civic coupe I just sold, but a bit prettier. Shown in Japan, will be soon start to be sold in Europe. Of course, America last...
 
coutinpe said:
Now I hear that Honda is coming with a new PHEV called Prelude. It looks like the 2013 Civic coupe I just sold, but a bit prettier. Shown in Japan, will be soon start to be sold in Europe. Of course, America last...
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Unfortunately, the upcoming Prelude is not a PHEV, but just another one of Honda's 2-motor hybrids. It appears Honda's trying to create a sporty replacement for the 3rd-gen Insight and the Civic Coupe.

Honda must feel burned by its experience with their Clarity PHEV (I love mine) because they are offering their CR-V PHEV only in China. I don't know why Honda is ignoring the strong demand for the Toyota RAV4 Prime PHEV.

Honda fumbled the introduction of the new Prelude, leaving many to believe it would be their first BEV sports car. Soon, Honda issued an addendum to their Prelude press release to indicate it's a hybrid. Hopefully, the Prelude's promised 207 HP will be accompanied by lots of torque to compensate for that small, not very sporty, number.
 
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Steven B said:
The CR-V plugin is available in the UK. I saw one on the road there recently.
https://www.honda.co.uk/cars/new/cr-v-hybrid-suv/overview.html
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I didn't know that--thanks for the correction.

So Honda's willing to make a right-hand driver for the UK, but not one for the US! Well, with the massive new tariff on Chinese vehicles imported to the US, Honda made the right decision. However, why they don't make a CR-V PHEV in East Liberty, Ohio; Greensburg, Indiana; or Alliston, Ontario?
 
insightman said:
I didn't know that--thanks for the correction.

So Honda's willing to make a right-hand driver for the UK, but not one for the US! Well, with the massive new tariff on Chinese vehicles imported to the US, Honda made the right decision. However, why they don't make a CR-V PHEV in East Liberty, Ohio; Greensburg, Indiana; or Alliston, Ontario?
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With the majority of Honda sales in the US being in California, and California still outright banning new Petrol cars by 2035, it makes sense that they would put their eggs in the EV basket here in the states. Capitalism suggests invest in what sells now and later. Gas sells now. EVs are required to sell later. PHEVs, as has been stated here, is absolutely a stepping stone to the potential EV adopter, but NOT for the EV infrastructure. And the reason most people aren’t buying EVs is because.. of the lack of infrastructure. Honda (along with a lot of other mfgs) are investing in a large charging network to fix that.

So… why spend the tens of millions of dollars to develop PHEVS that meet IHS standards when they will be basically obsoleted in few years in their largest market? That money could be spent to expand the infrastructure helping you sell EVs later.

Makes sense to me.

As an aside, we have a Mini SE BEV with a paltry 114mi range, and here in the Midwest, I haven’t found anywhere we cannot drive to with the infrastructure as it is. And it’s only getting bigger.

Now, down where my folks are in AR, that’s a different story, but still, I can get most places.
The time due to charging, that’s where those bigger batteries help. Fewer stops. We just drove down (granted, in our gas car, because the minis range is indeed paltry and we have a 2yr old) and in any other BEV, the number of stops and time we spent stopped is pretty much equivalent or more than what we would have if we had used a “normal” range EV.


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DisgruntledSanta said:
So… why spend the tens of millions of dollars to develop PHEVS that meet IHS standards when they will be basically obsoleted in few years in their largest market?
Click to expand...

Appears to me that the 2035 deadline is for all new Cali sales to be EVs, PHEVs, or hydrogen powered. At this point, Honda would not be developing a new PHEV, they'd be tweaking what is available overseas only to meet US standards (assuming any tweaks are required besides putting the steering wheel on the left).
 
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