I’m one of those December buyers. I’d been thinking of a new car for several months and I thought I was well informed about the market. I was familiar with the Clarity, at least I thought I was. I thought it was just the hydrogen fuel cell so I was ignoring it. I found out about the plug in model by accident, but once I looked into it I thought it was the perfect combination of size, efficiency, and especially price.
Clarity Plug-In Hybrid becoming more popular
- Thread starter Domenick
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neal adkins
Active Member
I just checked and GM does sometimes partner with honda. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.wa...engineering-challenge-new-autonomous-vehicle/
neal adkins
Active Member
They do sometimes partner together in engineering. Honda is investing about 2.75 billion in GM for developing an autonomous vehicle. Either way lots of similarities in the concept.
Yes, the GM and Honda are working together on autonomous vehicles, and before that they were supposed to be developing batteries together. However, GM was curiously absent from the reports about Honda teaming up with NASA and Caltech to develop a new Fluoride-Ion battery technology.
My claim is that there has never been any hint that GM provided technology to Honda for the Clarity Plug-In Hybrid. Here's how Green Car Reports describes the operation of the 1st and 2nd gen Volts, neither of which operates like the Clarity PHEV:
But while GM hasn't explicitly said so, [the 2016 Volt is] no longer as much of a range-extended electric car (or "series hybrid").
The new 2016 Volt should be viewed as a more conventional plug-in hybrid, with engine torque now being sent to the wheels through a mechanical connection whenever the engine is on.
The 2011-2015 Volt has one motor that powers the wheels, and a second that acts as an engine-driven generator to produce electricity when battery capacity is depleted.
The 2016 Volt, on the other hand, has a pair of motors that are roughly the same size, one or both of which can power the car.
It still operates exclusively in all-electric mode up to its range of 50 miles or so (except in very cold weather) before the engine switches on.
But once the battery is down to its "depleted" level, the engine switches on--and it contributes torque to drive the wheels far more often now than it did in the first Volt, when it would clutch into the drivetrain only in a limited set of high-speed driving circumstances.
Robert_Alabama
Well-Known Member
The Volt won't start the ICE due to additional acceleration needs. It does run the ICE every few weeks for "engine maintenance" if no gasoline has been burned over that time. The amount of gas burned is usually miniscule, less than a quart, in this mode. It will also run the engine if the temperature drops too low (25 deg F for the 2012 model). In this mode it will burn more fuel, but I see it rarely in Alabama. However that said, I do have one observation.
I love the Volt, but I have always hated how noisy the 1st generation Volt engine can be (and the car is just a little too small for me). The Clarity ICE is much quieter. I had always driven the Volt until the battery was exhausted and then let the car switch to ICE. So in 5 years, it had not dawned on me that the engine might behave better if I had used the ICE with some battery in reserve whenever I was on trips and knew I would exhaust the battery. The 2011-2012 Volt has a "mountain mode" which holds approx 30% of the battery (2013 forward picked up a true "Hold" mode). Anyway, my 2012 does seem to behave significantly better (less angry bees) when battery isn't exhausted (by using Mountain mode) before starting ICE.
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neal adkins
Active Member
Ok......i still see striking similarities while there are also technical differences on how the cars are engineered. From my understanding the Clarity's ice is connected via a complex cluch system that allows it to act as a generator that supplys power to the electric traction motor and sometimes a direct drive to the wheels. Both functions were also mentioned in the artical you quoted. But i am not a technical expert on it either.
The Clarity's ICE is always connected to the starter motor/generator. The traction motor is always connected to the differential. The clutch simply connects the engine to the differential, meaning that everything's connected mechanically to the wheels: ICE, traction motor, and starter motor/generator. This clutched connection only occurs at speeds greater than 41 mph (in my experience). The Volt's ICE, however, has to cope with propelling the car at low speeds, so a more complex transmission is required. The simplicity of Honda's i-MMD plug-in hybrid system is beautiful IMHO.
iluvscuba
Active Member
I thought the Buick Velite is just a rebadge Volt/Bolt so I doubt it will come to NA. For whatever reason, Chinese prefer the Buick badge over Chevy so GM just rebadge and re-skin the Volt and Bolt to be the Velite 5 and 6 but with Chinese battery instead of LG Chem. Looks like the Chinese battery is not quite up to the task as the 6 is only getting a realistic range of under 150 miles, no where near the 236 miles of the Bolt
Pushmi-Pullyu
Well-Known Member
No, it's not an either/or situation. If my understanding is correct, the Volt always uses one or both its electric motors, and only engages the clutch for the ICE when (a) the battery is mostly depleted, and (b) the powertrain is called upon for a surge of power, such as when accelerating sharply or climbing a hill.
Watch the video below and then you'll know about as much about it as I. Caveat: This is for Voltec 1.0; I understand Voltec 2.0 works a bit differently and is even more complex:
su_A_ve
Active Member
Well, we drove south from NJ to FL (about 1100 miles) and then to NOLA and back to NJ (about 2300 miles). I did not spot a SINGLE Clarity past Virginia on the way south (I-95), and not ONE until we got back to DC area. I see one at least daily here in NJ (in addition to my neighbor's and my coworker's)
With gas prices in NOLA as low as $1.75, who needs a hybrid?
PS: road trip was done in our 18' Ody and got up to 30 mpg (gasp!)
With gas prices in NOLA as low as $1.75, who needs a hybrid?
PS: road trip was done in our 18' Ody and got up to 30 mpg (gasp!)
Fast Eddie B
Well-Known Member
Karen and I have yet to see a single Clarity “in the wild” in N GA or E TN.
And Lordy, we sure are looking!
And Lordy, we sure are looking!
Pushmi-Pullyu
Well-Known Member
As long as I'm posting videos about the operating modes of PHEVs, here's one on the Honda Accord Plug-in Hybrid which I found enlightening. If my somewhat limited understanding is correct, the Clarity PHEV works in a similar manner. That is, the explanation appears to apply just as well to the Clarity PHEV as it does to the Accord Plug-in Hybrid.
This video eschews the high-tech animation in the Voltec video I posted earlier, in favor of some very crude whiteboard drawings. But the guy doing the explanation does a remarkably good job, and I think his few crude diagrams are sufficient.
I wish I could thank the forum member who first posted this, some months or perhaps (by now) years ago, but I don't remember who it was.
This video eschews the high-tech animation in the Voltec video I posted earlier, in favor of some very crude whiteboard drawings. But the guy doing the explanation does a remarkably good job, and I think his few crude diagrams are sufficient.
I wish I could thank the forum member who first posted this, some months or perhaps (by now) years ago, but I don't remember who it was.
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Pushmi-Pullyu
Well-Known Member
JulianClarity
Active Member
It is almost a perfect car, except I don't like the wipers, the infortainment system does not bother me at all, because I always listen to the same radio station.
The operation of the Accord Hybrid and the Clarity Plug-In Hybrid differs in one major way: How each car dissipates regenerated electricity when the battery is fully charged. The Accord Hybrid kills the engine while the Clarity starts it up. I hope Honda or Alex will someday provide complete details about how the Clarity dissipates excess electricity by burning gasoline.
Pushmi-Pullyu
Well-Known Member
There are actually three versions. The third is the Clarity Electric, which is a BEV. From reports, it's available only in CARB states and only in small numbers... in other words, Honda is treating it as just another compliance car.
Nearly all the discussion on this forum about the Clarity refers to the Clarity PHEV only, altho I think there is a least one thread about the Clarity Fuel Cell.
The Honda system is probably the only one that doesn't use a planetary gear to connect the different inputs and outputs. It's literally a direct drive like a manual transmission gearing. Either the EV motor is directing the output gear or the clutched ICE. It makes it easy to create different versions, want only the EV, just remove the ICE/generator and clutch gear. They are not "intertwined." This reduces development cost and improves design commonality.
Honda says their Engine Drive mechanism is more efficient, too.
MPower
Well-Known Member
Had a 2012 Prius Plugin (first generation PHEV), when I needed a new car, I was just going to go buy another Prius PHEV. Turned out IT ONLY HAS 4 SEATS! Totally unacceptable. Then discovered that I could get a car with more EV mileage, 5 seats, and fancy smancy smooth for less total outlay because of the tax credit (if the IRS ever comes back into business so they can issue refunds).
WindsorBoy
New Member
Before I bought my Clarity I looked seriously at the Prius Prime and even took it out for a test drive but in the end I thought the Clarity was a better investment. I also didn't like the way the back seat of the Prime was designed, limiting it to a maximum of two backseat passengers.