California to Stop Sales of new Gas and Diesel Cars by 2035

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R P said:
Got this from my ICE car forum (also a hot topic there). Needless to say, they take a different view. But some good points, and would make 2025 esp challenging. In particular, the grid upgrade requirements, and the effect of no sun at night (for solar), and variability of wind, too. Would need to buy a lot of home batteries, and given that availability for car manufacturers is a major issue, not to mention expense, it would mean quite an additional home battery cost (for those that can even do it), to store electricity when it is available.

In BC, we have a graduated plan, and not 100% ICE free until 2040, which I think is more reasonable.
https://electricenergyonline.com/ar...s-for-100-electric-vehicle-sales-by-2040.html

But here is the excerpt from the ICE forum:
FB - The problem will be that the infrastructure needed to support the migration of MILLIONS of gas powered vehicles will require significant additions to the electric grid.
Unlike many states, the entire transportation system in CA is based on the automobile.
The geniuses behind this decision probably think that solar will provide for this.
It can't - At least not reliably.
Having worked for SoCalEdison for quite a few years, every engineer I talked to was scared poopless about major service disruptions related to having 25% or more of generation capacity via variable resources (wind and sun) because they are not scaleable by demand.
Hot and cloudy? Generation capacity of a solar plant can easily drop 90% to 95% of rated capacity while demand soars.
Not a recipe for a great outcome, and this very situation just occurred without a massive requirement for new capacity this edict would entail.
Unlike fueled generators, you can't turn the sun up or down, or make the wind blow because you want to.
The other big hurdle will be that a good deal of demand by electric car charging will occur without any solar generation capability being available...
At night, when people come home from work.
The grid will need some serious upgrades just to support the additional volume of kilowatts, and car chargers are heavy hitters on load demand.
If everyone in California had an electric car tonight, no one would be able to charge a car tomorrow as the demand would literally kill the grid.
Of course all of this capacity and significant enhancement needs to the grid can be easily overcome in a state facing bankruptcy.
I think an additional question should be asked.
Is this "mandate" likely to happen.
My vote -- Nope.
Click to expand...
To be perfectly frank, the guy does have a point. Ensuring that there's generating capacity to meet the demand of EVs is a difficult problem. Is it a problem that can't be overcome? No. It can be addressed. But it's not a problem that should be minimized. Unfortunately, there are many EV advocates who push rhetoric that either oversimplify, minimize, mischaracterize, or ignore certain issues, which slows down the rate of EV adoption. I should probably do a thread on these topics.
 
Well, one question is, how much energy does it actually take to get the oil into a cars gas tank?

Refineries, pumps, etc. That energy instead of going there going into electric cars reduces the need for more power plants. I'm not sure of the rate, but that's definitely a point as well.

And it's one that big oil doesn't want us to think about. There is definitely a complex problem.
 
Esprit1st said:
Well, one question is, how much energy does it actually take to get the oil into a cars gas tank?

Refineries, pumps, etc. That energy instead of going there going into electric cars reduces the need for more power plants. I'm not sure of the rate, but that's definitely a point as well.

And it's one that big oil doesn't want us to think about. There is definitely a complex problem.
Click to expand...

It really depends. Many oil rigs uses on site generators for their operations. While that uses electric energy, it doesn't actually impact the grid at all.

I highly doubt that there will be any major reductions to electricity use on the grid over all when switching from ICE to EVs. There will be a reduction in total energy use, but not necessarily electric energy use.

"Big oil" doesn't have nearly as much power as people attribute to it. I actually think "Big oil" is more of a myth than a reality.
 
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