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Who will have more advantages in the transition of EV era? Mainstream or Start-up?

Discussion in 'General' started by Reyes Mary, Feb 21, 2022.

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  1. Feb 21, 2022 #1
    Reyes Mary

    Reyes Mary New Member

    New Haven, CT
    While mainstream manufacturers like Toyota and Mercedes-Benz will need 5-10 years to completely switch to electric cars due to having to deal with massive factories and technology, small electric car manufacturers like BYD, Nio or VinFast have more time when having the game in hands from this year.

    I think both mainstream manufacturers and start up companies will have advantages in the transition to the electric car era. Mainstream manufacturers have a lot of experience and know how to make high quality cars, while start up companies are often more innovative and have new ideas about how to make electric cars. So both types of companies will be important in the transition to electric cars.
     

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  2. Feb 21, 2022 #2
    Jim Matthews

    Jim Matthews Active Member

    Taxachusetts, USA
    I expect more absorption of start ups by legacy makers preferring to own intellectual property, rather than license it.

    As VW has shown, it's faster to retool a plant that's already built than to scrape together raw materials for a fresh start.

    I think the real advantage will tip to Chinese legacy makers which have direct support from Government bank guarantees.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/04/business/china-electric-cars.html
     
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  3. Feb 21, 2022 #3
    bwilson4web

    bwilson4web Well-Known Member Subscriber

    Huntsville, AL
    Kind of a Sophie's choice:
    • startup - free to blank-sheet design but no corporate culture, yet. Examples: Lucid, Rivian, Nikola, Tesla, Lordstown.
    • legacy - lessons learn about building chassis but no history of electric drivetrain. Examples: GM, Ford, VW, KIA, Nissan, Hyundai
    My guide star is the new companies tend to have more efficient vehicles, kWh/mi and usable space, compared to the legacy companies. I suspect the relatively high engine energy output led legacy makers to become lazy about efficiency.

    Bob Wilson
     
  4. Feb 22, 2022 #4
    bwilson4web

    bwilson4web Well-Known Member Subscriber

    Huntsville, AL
    Using the Power Search in www.fueleconomy.gov:
    • 24 kWh/100 mi - 1 Tesla
    • 25 kWh/100 mi - 2 Tesla, 1 Hyundai
    • 26 kWh/100 mi - 3 Tesla, 1 Lucid,
    • 27 kWh/100 mi - 1 Tesla, 1 Lucid, 1 Hyundai
    • 28 kWh/100 mi - 3 Tesla, 2 Hyundai, 1 Lucid, 1 GM
    So adding these up:
    • 10 Tesla - no ICE (Internal Combustion Engine)
    • 4 Hyundai - has ICE
    • 3 Lucid - no ICE
    • 1 GM - has ICE
    Tesla has the largest number of high efficiency models. Hyundai, a legacy maker, comes next. Then Lucid followed by GM. But I am convinced that GM outsourced their EV drivetrain to Hyundai who simply copied and installed the EV drivetrain in their own chassis.

    Bob Wilson
     
  5. Feb 26, 2022 #5
    DJP

    DJP Active Member

    Nissan? The Leaf came out in 2011.
     
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  6. Feb 27, 2022 #6
    bwilson4web

    bwilson4web Well-Known Member Subscriber

    Huntsville, AL
    I appreciate the comment but like BMW, Nissan didn't follow up. Both BMW and Nissan have 'restarted' their EV work but late and their products leave a lot to be desired. For example, Nissan used to make their automotive batteries just outside of Nashville ... they shut it down. BMW used to make their own carbon fiber for car bodies but then they sold it and came out with the laughing stock 'i8.'

    When I was making my first post in the thread, I was remembering Nissan air cooled batteries that died in hot climates. That was a massive EV drivetrain fail.

    Bob Wilson
     

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