Value of public charging with/without fee?

Discussion in 'Clarity' started by michael shama, Nov 19, 2018.

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  1. michael shama

    michael shama New Member

    Hi all,
    Am I missing something on public charging (road trips or general commuting) – seems like its not worth the $. Around here most places charge $1-2 connection + 13c/kwh. For a full charge, Im paying over $3. That will theoretically get me 47 electric miles. On my observations, that is actually about 37 electric highway miles. If im getting 40-45 miles per gallon, and a gallon costs me $3 per gallon, then its actually more efficient to drive on gas than it is to use these public chargers. [even without the fee, its works out to be pretty close]. Thoughts?
    Chris Messer and TheTruth like this.
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  3. Robert_Alabama

    Robert_Alabama Well-Known Member

    I think you are all over it. If it costs more than a gallon of gasoline, you are probably economically better off buying gasoline (at least in dollars out of the immediate budget). Weighing the societal value of electric vs gas for propelling the automobile is an argument I won't start.
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2018
  4. Richard_arch74

    Richard_arch74 Active Member

    @Michael, you got it. In the winter months, in the northland, it may be cheaper to run on gas as long as gas is below $2.50. Only way it's cheaper (on EV, where I'm only getting 36m/E fill-up) is to have electrical rates less than $.14/kwh or have a solar array. That's the great thing about the PHEV. You get to choose.

    Sent from my SM-G955U using Inside EVs mobile app
  5. DucRider

    DucRider Well-Known Member

    Public charging is like buying coffee. Much cheaper to do it at home.

    I've driven over 50K EV miles and I can count on one hand the number of times I've paid for public charging.
    rockstone, amy2421 and KentuckyKen like this.
  6. jdonalds

    jdonalds Well-Known Member

    I only charge at home. Over 19k miles. Never once at a public or free station. Not worth the time or money. That's the beauty of a PHEV
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  8. Claritydfw

    Claritydfw Member

    The only place I ever pay for charging is at local outside shopping center / movie theater. Its a flat $2 a day and very close to the theater and stores I go to. I will plug it in when I am running low and I want the hvac to run while I am shopping or watching a movie.

    I think most of the people that are paying high rates are those that are desperate for a charge or those that do it for environmental reason and refuse to use gas.

    I am also very lucky to have a few places around me that I frequent that offer free charging.
  9. jdonalds

    jdonalds Well-Known Member

    This makes sense. We just don't seem to encounter any of those situations. When we've taken a couple of 1,000 mile trips I'd hoped to find a few hotels with free EV charging but didn't.
  10. Richard_arch74

    Richard_arch74 Active Member

    Just curious if you used the HL app or plugshare app to see if you could find a free charge. When I was on vacation in Crossville Tn recently I used the HL to find a free 240V charge that just happened to be across the street from my favorite BQ eatery (Lefty's). Worked out great. Used the proximity to eat and charge there twice in a week. Charged up my stomach and car.

    Sent from my SM-G955U using Inside EVs mobile app
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  11. Claritydfw

    Claritydfw Member

    Are you using the PlugShare app? It’s a great resource to find charging stations.
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  13. Rajiv Vaidyanathan

    Rajiv Vaidyanathan Active Member

    Now that winter has hit in Minnesota, I can barely eke out 25 EV miles on a full charge. If I charge at home at $0.14/kwh, and it takes about 13.5 kwh for a full charge, I'm paying about $1.90 for 25 miles. That is not much cheaper than gas, but I bet my gas mileage will also be much lower at these temps (teens and low 20s so far).
  14. jdonalds

    jdonalds Well-Known Member

    I did not use the app. Frankly it isn't all that important to me.

    If on a long trip, in HV on a highway most of the time, and the battery is a bit low, I just use HV charge to top of the battery. It only has to run for about 30 minutes or less to bring the battery to 58%. During charging the mpg drops from about 42 to 32. It's easy, quick, and cheap. No need to go out to move the car after it's charged.

    I hate that the car has a gas engine at all. I don't want the weight of the engine, the oil changes, tune ups, or gas station stops. On the other hand the benefits are so good. No long charge times on trips, full EV around town. No gas station visits for weeks at a time. No range anxiety.

    The 47 mile range is perfect for us. The size, weight, and cost of the battery is just right. A larger battery would be overkill. I think Honda did it right.
  15. Timothy

    Timothy Active Member

    I haven't done the math but I am pretty sure our free public charging is coming out ahead of gas.
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  16. su_A_ve

    su_A_ve Active Member

    Been looking at this too. I pay 15c per kWh (this includes delivery) so been thinking about charging at home or not over the weekend (free charging at work). Gas prices have trickled down to $2.44. Since I now only get about 35 miles EV range... but already have a headache trying to figure out how to calculate this...
  17. leehinde

    leehinde Active Member

    I've only used free public charging. Makes the math a lot easier.
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  18. Richard_arch74

    Richard_arch74 Active Member

    @su_A_ve, let me save you from a headache: In its simplest form:

    cost for electric motion:
    $.15 x ~17kw = $2.55 to go 35 miles or $.07 per mile. (2.55÷35)

    Cost for gas motion:
    $2.44 to go ~40 miles or $.06 per mile. (2.44÷40)
    In this case about the same cost per mile with gas costing a little less.

    Sent from my SM-G955U using Inside EVs mobile app
  19. amy2421

    amy2421 Active Member

    I have not used a public charger yet. We have time-of-use rates here. If I charge at the lowest rate it is 8.7 cents/kWh including delivery, or approx. $1.25 ($0.95 USD) for a full charge. In the summer I was getting 80-95 km (50-60 miles) on a full charge. With the colder weather, I'm getting 50-60 km (30-38 miles) on a full charge.

    Oh how I miss those summer days... :(
  20. Brian Harrison

    Brian Harrison New Member

    Have been thinking about this in MA where power is ~20 cents KWH and it’s getting colder gas would be cheaper. Makes me think strategically running hybrid mode on highway and EV off highway may be more efficient. Certainly the tie goes to EV for wear/tear, carbon emissions and convenience.
  21. craze1cars

    craze1cars Well-Known Member

    Wow I have to admit I'm surprised some of you even purchased this car, given your high electric rates. I bought this car to save money on fuel, period. My electricity from my local REMC in Indiana costs .10275 per kwh, 24 hours a day. If I did the math right it costs me about $1.60 in electricity to fill up my battery each time to go 37 to 52 miles or whatever the weather will allow. I figure gas needs to drop closer to $1.50/gallon in the heart of winter before I lose the benefit. And heck with today's economy maybe it'll get there LOL. But I doubt it'll last...

    As for the pay charging stations, yeah they're definitely a for-profit thing for the charging companies. I don't and won't use them, as they make no financial sense for the user, and and are not meant to make financial sense for the user. You pay for the convenience, and they make a profit. And IMO they belong to electric cars, not PHEVs. And people in electric cars HATE seeing a PHEV blocking their charging station, when they don't have a backup plan and desperately need a charge. I don't desire to have my Clarity keyed by a disgruntled Tesla owner...

    I vote to leave them open for the poor folks in Teslas or Nissan Leafs who forgot to plug in at home or drove farther than intended, and are going to find themselves stranded if they don't use it, as they don't benefit a Clarity owner one bit unless they are truly free (rare in my world, but a few do exist at some shopping malls by me to encourage you to spend money in the store while they give you "free" electricity.)
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2018
  22. Steven B

    Steven B Active Member

    Correction for electric motion:

    $.15 x ~15kw = $2.25 to go 35 miles or $.064 per mile. (2.25÷35)

    Even though the battery pack is 17kW, only about 13.5 is usable in EV mode driving; then assuming efficiency losses of the charger, you figure you pull 15kW from the wall (worst case).
    Electra and insightman like this.
  23. Brian Harrison

    Brian Harrison New Member

    I can think of 7500 reasons to buy the car despite current parity w gas. And in my state 2500 more. Can only imagine if last tax bill eliminated the credit these would be languishing on lots. But also a great car!
    Pegsie and amy2421 like this.

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