Toyota preparing for ten fold increase in fuel cell car sales

Discussion in 'General' started by TeslaInvestors, Jun 3, 2018.

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  1. TeslaInvestors

    TeslaInvestors Active Member

    Toyota moves to expand mass-production of fuel cell stacks and hydrogen tanks towards ten-fold increase post-2020

    Toyota City, Japan, May 24, 2018―Toyota sees global sales of fuel cell electric vehicles (FCEV) increasing significantly after 2020, to at least 30,000 per year from today's 3,000. To prepare for this growth, the company unveiled plans for two major new facilities today: a brand-new building near its original automobile factory for expanding fuel cell stack mass production, and a new line in an existing plant to manufacture high-pressure hydrogen tanks. The FC stack is what generates the on-board electricity from hydrogen and oxygen which propel FCEVs with zero emissions, and the tanks store the hydrogen fuel. Manufacturing both components at scale is critical to achieving lower system costs and wider availability for further growth and sales of FCEVs.
    Expanding FCEV sales to more countries and regions
    As a technology, fuel cells are mature and ready to scale up. Toyota took the lead in bringing to market the mass-produced fuel cell sedan, the Mirai, in December 2014. Annual production and sales have increased yearly, going from about 700 units in 2015, to around 2,000 units in 2016, and, most recently, approximately 3,000 units in 2017. However, in order to encourage more widespread use of hydrogen-powered zero-emission vehicles, popularization needs to start by the 2020s. Toyota aims for annual sales of FCEVs to top 30,000 units globally from around that time.

    At present, Mirai is sold in eleven countries: Japan, the United States, and nine countries in Europe. Toyota is working to develop an environment that will allow FCEVs to be sold in more countries and regions in the future. As part of this, demonstration tests of Mirai are currently under way in Australia, Canada, China, and the U.A.E., and Toyota is examining demand for FCEVs while continuing to help with initiatives to promote hydrogen infrastructure development.

    In the Japanese market, Toyota aims to reach sales of at least 1,000 FCEV units per month and over 10,000 units annually, from around 2020. Sales regions within Japan will be expanded further from the current four major metropolitan areas to allow even more customers to enjoy Mirai.

    On the commercial side, Toyota started sales of FC buses to the Tokyo Metropolitan Government in February 2017, and introduced the final version, the Sora, in 2018 with three additional units. Toyota aims to sell at least 100 such buses ahead of the Olympic and Paralympic Games Tokyo 2020.

    Going forward, Toyota will expand its FCEV product range and continue to strengthen product appeal, aiming to bring the cost down. Also, Toyota will keep working with Toyota Group and other companies to develop a hydrogen supply infrastructure and construct a low-carbon hydrogen supply chain. Through these and other initiatives, the company is actively contributing to the realization of a hydrogen-based society.
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  3. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web Well-Known Member Subscriber

    Since Toyota can afford the fuel cell experiment, fine by me. Mass production of the fuel cells addresses one part of the problem and it isn't clear volume solves the cost. Just I am not persuaded the hydrogen problem has been solved.

    It takes 3x the cost of electricity for electrolysis and methane-steam has purity challenges. Furthermore, the high pressure hydrogen distribution is a little too complex for my taste.

    As for fuel cells being a game changer, until September 2015, diesels were a thing.

    Bob Wilson
    101101 likes this.
  4. 101101

    101101 Well-Known Member

    @TeslaInvestors- right you're a Tesla investor. No one is going to be fooled by the long tail pipe petrol scam anymore. The subsidies will be cut. No way something that increases CO2 emissions is going to continue to get green when its dirtier than coal.

    Right now the T. Admin is thinking it can force people to buy coal through the grid. Hilariously it is trying to hide behind nuclear over this and calling it a national security issues. Bailing out throwback plantation owners is a national security issue? No its theft pure and simple. Even if the government wanted coal in silos for back up it could simply confiscate the coal plants and keep them functional at cost. But T admin wants to use a provision that preserves the profit for parasites. But the thing is these genocidal parasites were paid of long ago. What they have is debt not continued entitlement to rent seeking by law. The employees sans management can easily be put on a high indexed guaranteed annual income for the rest of their life- that would be a much better use more tax funded parasitic profit guarantees because that is more of the idiocy of the rich being able to tax the poor when they shouldn't even be able to do it through suppressed wages.

    What this is about is if coal can be sunk then oil and NG are next (really NG first.) So they keep trying to delay the inevitable as if the fraud were some kine of mote. Right now there are articles one by Mark Perry for IEA saying that even if the electric cars wipe out transport oil should be level or grown. This depends on the idea that can continue to be forced on people, that it would be force on for instance the US populace. But no, diesel is being banned in EU in a few years, coal in being banned right now in Germany. People will go to all roof top solar battery backed homes with electric appliances where even the water heater just quick heats. Cars will come off the grid from this. Homes will be better built with passive cooling and heating through insulation. Tesla is demonstrating the industrial case. But you see the cost of all those unnecessary wars for petrol enslavement is coming back to haunt these entities and the dawning realization on the part of the public of all money and time that was taken from them due to fake economies and artificial scarcity induced in large part through petrol fuel oil is going to demand a disgorgement of past ill-gotten gains. A new scam is not going to be foisted on people, not in the name of national security or any other reason. Even a big global war if humanity survived it would not stop this now. The plantation is over and the falsity of the T Admin shows it, people laugh at it more than anything else. There was always a limit and the limit was crossed way back with Katrina, what was happening in 1970 against the people was starting to percolate into their consciousness by that time. The plans the to try to stop the eviction of this global rent seeking parasite and necessary claw back are 13 years behind the starting gun.

    Absorb this simple little fact into your consciousness, a communist country is now the new power in the world because people in the TES and other plantation minds couldn't understand something as simple as the golden rule, they didn't understand that spreading fear would eventually catch up with them. They still don't get it because for instance instead of trying to help Tesla they continue to try to undermine.

    Its sad. They will still have chemicals, plastics and fertilizer but even there they need to clean up their operations so they are less toxic.
    If any of the things Nick Bostrom was talking about pan out there are so many other things to focus attention on and its going to happen so fast, even autonomy doesn't even scratch the surface. Science itself doesn't seem to survive where digital physics goes.
  5. Pushmi-Pullyu

    Pushmi-Pullyu Well-Known Member

    Toyota is, of course, free to keep throwing its money down the rathole of the failed science experiment of fuel cell cars, for as long as it wants to keep wasting money.

    If any reader doesn't understand just why fuel cell cars will never be practical, or why promoting the "hydrogen economy" is a hoax, it's all spelled out quite clearly, with plenty of authoritative references, in the first two posts in this discussion thread: "How to Promote the Hydrogen Economy Hoax"

    I just hope that the Japanese governments (national and Prefecture) will stop wasting Japanese taxpayer money on supporting the "hydrogen economy" hoax, just as I hope that California and other States in the USA will also stop funding the build-out of hydrogen fueling stations.

    I find it very disturbing indeed to read that, at least in the recent past if not now, the various levels of Japanese governments offered a total up to nearly $20,000 in incentives* to people buying fool cell cars. I realize that Japan has a critical shortage of electricity, at least partly self-imposed because they shut down nearly all their commercial nuclear power plants, but the laws of physics work in Japan just like they do everywhere else. Japan needs to find a cheaper way to produce electricity, not waste its resources trying to promote use of a fuel that costs twice as much as gasoline or diesel, and is so profligately wasteful of energy that, by comparison, a battery-electric car is about 330% as energy-efficient!

    *See: "Japanese Government To Offer $20,000 Subsidy On Fuel Cell Vehicle Purchases"

    Physics, thermodynamics, the long supply chain for H2 from well to wheel, and basic economics all mandate that H2 can never possibly compete with any practical fuel, or with batteries charged with electricity, in powering a car.

    As has been said, a fuel cell car is an interesting if expensive science fair experiment. But as an attempt at a practical form of everyday transportation, it's a miserable failure, and always will be. No amount of inventiveness, no future invention or improvements on existing tech, is going to change that. The Laws of Thermodynamics are not something that inventors can sidestep with a clever idea. If that was possible, we'd be using perpetual motion to power everything!

    Last edited: Jun 3, 2018
    bwilson4web likes this.
  6. TeslaInvestors

    TeslaInvestors Active Member

    This big news finally caught Reuters' attention.

    More points:
    * Fuel cell stack costs $11000 (est); will b $8000 later
    * Targets 30,000 Mirais annually after 2020
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