The Future of Electric Charging Stations Projected in 4 Simple Maps

Discussion in 'General' started by JeremyK, Nov 30, 2017.

  1. JeremyK

    JeremyK New Member

    Nice overview of a report issued in Oct. 2017, showing projected charging coverage under various scenarios.

    This plug-in electric vehicle (PEV) infrastructure analysis addresses the fundamental question of how much charging infrastructure would be needed in the United States to support various market penetration scenarios for both plug-in hybrid electric vehicles (PHEVs) and battery electric vehicles (BEVs). The result is a quantitative estimate for developing a U.S. network of non-residential (public and workplace) charging that enables broader PEV adoption and maximizes PEV use.
    https://energy.gov/eere/vehicles/downloads/national-plug-electric-vehicle-infrastructure-analysis
    https://energy.gov/eere/articles/future-electric-charging-stations-projected-4-simple-maps
     
  2. Feed The Trees

    Feed The Trees Active Member

    Location isn't really the big issue to be solved. You can plant 1,000,000,000 stations around the country at every spot possible and if it requires someone to spend a lot of their time to recharge on a moderate sized trip it won't matter a lick. Charging speed is the hurdle, not stations.
     
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  3. JeremyK

    JeremyK New Member

    In terms of a "road trip", I absolutely agree. However, I think destination charging is just as important and for that, Level 2 charging is sufficient and substantially less costly. Both will be needed for the average person to be comfortable with an EV purchase.
     
    jim likes this.
  4. jim

    jim Active Member

    In the Western states there is a new group formed that will place Fast Chargers every 50 miles with at least 5 ports at each location. Each location will be 150 kW with the ability to upgrade to over 300 kW rates. No mention yet of the cost to charge.
    That would be ALMOST as good as the Tesla Super Charging and Destination spots all over the USA and World.

    https://www.greencarreports.com/new...deal-to-expand-electric-car-charging-networks
     
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  5. sainiaaa

    sainiaaa New Member

    EV Charging is too slow.. which is the most deterrent factor for people to use.. There should be some technology where you can have spare batteries which can be changed easily
     
  6. Domenick

    Domenick Administrator Staff Member

    Unfortunately, every manufacturer uses a different battery chemistry and packaging to make that feasible. Maybe once batteries are thoroughly commoditized and use universal packaging it will work. However, by then I think charging speeds will be 5 minutes or less, and battery exchange won't be needed.
     
  7. Martin Williams

    Martin Williams Active Member

    A 200kWh battery charged in 5 minutes means you are charging at 2.4 MegaWatts. That's 2,400 volts at 1,000 Amps. You can increase the volts to reduce the Amps proportionately, but let's stick with this example for the time being.

    For 1,000 Amps, you need thick copper. Very thick. Let's imagine the copper in the cable has a cross-sectional area of 1000 sq millimetres. If its cross-section is a circle this is nearly an inch and a half in diameter and about as flexible as a length of steel scaffolding pole! Its resistance, per metre, is 0.0181 Ohms. Pretty low, but the heat generated in it is given by multiplying its resistance by the current squared, so each metre of the cable will be dissipating over 18kW! This will melt the insulation and probably the cable itself.

    So let's increase the voltage by a factor of ten to 24,000 volts. The current now drops to 100 Amps, so the same cable will now dissipate a more manageable 181 Watts per metre although it will be no more flexible, and of course it will also need much thicker insulation to keep the 24,000 volts from jumping to the nearest conductor or human. People will not be allowed near this. I imagine the vehicle would have to be put into a protective cage after all occupants had vacated it.

    I think if you do the sums your optimistic pipe dreams imply, you begin to realise how impractical they are. I suppose you could imagine some kind of robotic connection of busbars to the car, possibly from beneath, but this requires a wholesale redesign of the vehicle to accommodate it.
     
  8. Domenick

    Domenick Administrator Staff Member

  9. Martin Williams

    Martin Williams Active Member

    I hope they succeed. I would love to charge my phone in 5 minutes.

    But my point and the figures I have exhibited are correct and I stand by them. If you are going to get 200 kWh into a battery in five minutes you are talking 2.4MW, and all that implies in terms of voltages and currents that are unmanageable.

    If I'm putting 3,500 mAh at 4 volts (14 Wh) into a mobile phone in five minutes, the power level is 168Watts. The phone might accept this as 100V at 1.68A which is perfectly safe and the cable needed is quite flexible. Getting energy into a car at 2.4MW is dangerous and unmanageable for a human. You are going to have to get everyone out of the car, which will have to be in a safety enclosure and the connections will have to be made by some kind of robot connector. Try selling that to the consumer!

    This, by the way, is not amenable to technical 'advancements'. It's as basic as the laws of gravity.

    Battery swapping might be a better approach. Good luck with the logistics of that too!
     
  10. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web Well-Known Member Subscriber

    Don't forget VW is spending $2B to "Electrify America":
    https://www.electrifyamerica.com/our-plan
    [​IMG]
    In its first ZEV investment cycle, Electrify America will establish a network that includes non-proprietary electric vehicle chargers (CCS, CHAdeMO and J1772 standards) at over 650 community-based sites and nearly 300 highway sites across the country.

    Bob Wilson
     
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