Looking for a repeat of the 2012 Tsunami of Hurt

Discussion in 'General' started by TalkTesla, May 8, 2018.

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  1. TalkTesla

    TalkTesla New Member


    I'm new here. I've been a fan of Tesla since 2010, investor since 2012 and Model 3 reservation holder since April 1, 2016. I found myself spending a lot of time following the company in the evenings after work, so I finally decided to start a new YouTube channel and share my thoughts. I launched 1 week ago and have so far pushed out 3 videos. I have to juggle work and my 3 year old, but I'm hoping to continue making content. I'd really appreciate it if you would take a look and share your thoughts. Thanks so much, Jonathan

    My $1,000,000 Tesla Mistake! (TSLA)

    7 Key Takeaways from Tesla Q1 2018 Earnings Call

    Tesla Short Sellers Beware! (TSLA)
    WadeTyhon and Domenick like this.
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  3. Finally found the time to watch. Definitely some good stuff. You have a great speaking voice and the picture quality is where it needs to be. Now comes the hard part: consistently putting out content and building an audience.
  4. TalkTesla

    TalkTesla New Member

    Thanks Domenick, working on that! It's a little tough as I have a full-time job and a 3 year old at home, but hey that's why I'm posting this at 4:03am! Here's my next video, check it out:
  5. TalkTesla

    TalkTesla New Member

    Domenick likes this.
  6. Martin Williams

    Martin Williams Active Member

    Are we expected to believe that despite being an investor in the company you are unbiased in your views?
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  8. I like to think that if a person declares any financial interest, then readers/viewers can factor in a possibility of bias.

    It used to be that media would be forbidden from having financial interests in companies they report on, and many still hold that standard. (InsideEVs does, for instance. I am expressly forbidden from owning stock in any companies I might report on.) Still, there are any number of financial reporters that do have positions in different companies and as long as they disclose that information in their articles it's considered kosher.
    Last edited: May 31, 2018
  9. TalkTesla

    TalkTesla New Member

    I disclose clearly in the first seconds of my first video and in the description of all my videos that I'm an investor in the company, and yes I am absolutely an advocate for Tesla and their vision for a sustainable future. It would be 100% fair to assume I want the company to succeed and will do my best to present the company's strengths... after all, the intro video for my channel is a 20 minute argument for the bull case for the company. Assuming my channel is something else would be foolish.

    However this has no bearing on my motivation to present the truth, refute BS, and do my best to make an accurate statements. I will and have already made mistakes, but I have nothing to gain from bias and inaccuracies.
    Domenick and bwilson4web like this.
  10. Martin Williams

    Martin Williams Active Member

    I will follow Domenick's observations and factor in your financial interest as I see fit.

    Personally, I feel it must be pretty well impossible to separate your financial interests from a dispassionate analysis, particularly if you have bet the farm on the outcome. Honesty is obviously important to you, as you have revealed the fact that you are an investor, and I respect this. The crude facts, however, are that you DO have something to gain by presenting a biased case and a bull position is - by definition - biased.
  11. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web Well-Known Member Subscriber

    Thank you!

    So many of the Tesla 'short sellers' are not as ethical. Keep up the good work!

    Bob Wilson
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  13. TalkTesla

    TalkTesla New Member

    That's partially fair, I do want Tesla to succeed, but I think 'biased' may be the wrong word here. If I was presenting my channel as a news outlet for the automotive industry or even more specifically a channel about the general transition to EVs I think biased would be fair term; however, in this case, my channel is specifically themed around the bull case for Tesla, so it feels odd to call an advocate for something biased.

    That would be like in a political campaign suggesting that one candidate is biased because their campaign didn't highlight all the great qualities of the opponent... Again I will do my best to provide accurate statements, but of course I'll still highlight the best reasons why I believe in Tesla. At the same time this doesn't mean I won't recognize Tesla's shortcomings or even acknowledge positives from the competition -- just understand it will likely be in the context of "hey, this competitor over here is doing ________, in my opinion Tesla should react like this _______"
    bwilson4web and Domenick like this.
  14. I think if you want a dispassionate analysis, videos by fans of the company/product might not be the best place to look. I would suggest InsideEVs (of course :D) or an automotive news site like Automotive News.

    The value to videos like these is that people passionate about a brand or product are likely to to be well-informed about it and, having spent some time pondering, may have insight that a regular news site doesn't have the time/inclination to dig up. So while the presentation might not be dispassionate, there can be something to be learned. We just have to trust our own bias filters and if we have a question about any particular piece of information, we can find other sources to prove or disprove a point.
  15. Martin Williams

    Martin Williams Active Member

    There are disadvantages too though. Believers in this brand or product are likely to give a false impression of how good it really is. Not by telling deliberate lies or deliberately attempting to maliciously mislead anyone, but merely by virtue of the fact that their enthusiasm blinds them to possible faults whilst leading them into giving an over-enthusiastic account of the items good points.

    When you get people producing videos advertising this company and inviting people to attack negative comments about it as 'bullshit' I think it's gone much too far. Some may indeed BE bullshit, but equally some may not. It seems to me that this distinction is not made. ALL negative comments are seen as bullshit!
  16. TalkTesla

    TalkTesla New Member

    Again important to clarify, I totally welcome 'negative' comments if they add value, point out something flawed, or correct misinformation. No one here is asking the loyal Tesla fans to rally against facts... in fact just the opposite, I'm asking fans of the company to call BS when they see articles that are factually incorrect or written with malicious intent. Perfect example is Consumer Reports recent criticism of the Model 3. Of course I wasn't happy to see this news initially but I had no problem with it given that I perceived it as accurate. My 'BS Detector' in the video about it even calls the story the 'Real Deal'
    bwilson4web likes this.
  17. David Green

    David Green Well-Known Member

    What does your BS detector say about the Car and Driver article? and the Edmunds article on the Model 3? Lets remember that you are a a complete Tesla Bull, and certainly not what I would call "Objectively" analyzing the company or vehicles. I appreciate the great production of your videos, but the content is a bit sketchy unless someone is just looking for a Tesla cheerleading site that is less annoying then Tesla Time News... You are certainly far better then those guys, but the message is remarkable the same, Tesla can do not wrong dribble.
  18. TalkTesla

    TalkTesla New Member

    Perhaps I haven't produced enough content yet to prove you wrong.
  19. David Green

    David Green Well-Known Member

    Its not about proving me wrong. I am just 1 person, but if you want to have mass appeal, you should be more objective, as the Tesla flower is starting to wilt, and people who feel passionate about Tesla, are starting to wake up, and settling into reality. Look at Teslanomics, Tesla Time News, both subscriber bases has basically been flat since just after the Semi reveal boosted them, and Bjorn Nyland has continued to grow... There is a lesson here. You are good at producing these videos, and somewhat funny, but the content for me is just cheerleading, and I think many other EV people will feel the same way, which really gives you a ceiling... Look at what makes people like Marques Brownlee, or Doug DeMuro grow way past the Tesla fan boys you-tube pages. You have potential, but I do not think Tesla cheerleading is going to get you to the promised land. Just this one persons opinion.
  20. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web Well-Known Member Subscriber

    Edmunds is doing a long term study with monthly updates. The Edmunds reports look fair enough considering they are reviewing a low serial number Tesla.

    As for Car and Driver, I find them somewhat shallow snapshots and not as through as Edmunds.

    I used to subscribe to Autoweek and then they changed editors and became snark scribblers.

    Bob Wilson
    David Green likes this.
  21. David Green

    David Green Well-Known Member

    Absolutely true, but people are having troubles with current Vin Model 3 as well. On Model 3 Owners Club there was a guy last Sunday had his rear suspension break while driving and almost crashed, on a recently built car, less then 5K miles.
  22. Martin Williams

    Martin Williams Active Member

    The problem is that your definition of bullshit is not shared by everyone else. Much of the hagiography I read about Tesla here has a strong whiff of bullshit to me. I have no interest in whatsoever in Tesla's success of failure. The idea of a battery powered car is fundamentally flawed however, and they will all probably be swept aside by hydrogen in a few years.

    It seems to me that the biggest asset is Musk's ability to sell himself and his products and I wish him well of it. Would I buy any of his products? Probably not although I do happily use Paypal. Rest assured though, should I ever feel the need for snake-oil, I will reconsider.
  23. David Green

    David Green Well-Known Member

    I am not sure who you were replying to, but I strongly disagree with you on BEV's being flawed. I quite like the BEV simply for the fact that I can generate my own energy and create personal transportation for my family that is very close to having zero recurring emissions. Bev's are also very fun to drive, Hydrogen has its place, and will also develop, but not to the level of BEV's for personal transportation in my opinion. Fuel cells are still way too temperamental, this is going to take a while to work out.

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