Hummer coming back as EV brand?

Discussion in 'General' started by David Green, Oct 21, 2019.

  1. David Green

    David Green Well-Known Member

    I find this news very interesting, and unexpected. I can see the sense for GM though as EV tech is not to a point they could financially do a Chevy Silverado in Electric yet. Hummer would be a great low volume brand sold through GMC stores, with very limited risk to the parent company and established business. I say go for it... Give Rivian some competition and see how strong the market is.
  2. interestedinEV

    interestedinEV Well-Known Member

    Rivian may be, but I think the bigger competition they want to go after is Bollinger. You look at B1 (picture below) and it reminds me of the Hummer in many ways. I will not be surprised if GM sees the positive reaction that Bollinger is getting and decided there is a niche there for a iconic brand.

    Here is an article about that

    New Bollinger EVs Are What Hummer Should Have Become

    The new Detroit-based startup made a big splash in 2017 when it promised the B1 sport utility truck (let’s just call it SUV). The B1 featured an exterior design that can be best described as a mix between a Hummer H1 and a Land Rover Defender – with very rugged, tough and boxy proportions. But that was only one part of the story. The other part is that the Bollinger B1 made 360 horsepower from a fully-electric powertrain.

    Bollinger B1
  3. David Green

    David Green Well-Known Member

    I still consider Bollinger a "wanna be", and do not give them credibility of a company headed for production. I sure wish I could have been on Bob Lutz's tour of the GM design studio a couple weeks ago, and the fact he was talking about this after tells me he saw something on his visit. GM still uses Bob to leak out information they want to get feedback on... Sort of like what Tesla does with Electrek.
  4. interestedinEV

    interestedinEV Well-Known Member

    You may be right, but this is what they have done. They have shown there is a market interest in a product that is similar to the hummer but in an EV version. They have many pre-orders. Yes, many of them may disappear if production commences and as you say production may never commence, but even with that it is clear a market exists. And the existence of this market demand cannot be lost on the GM planners. If someone were to make a Hummer look a like in an EV variant, why not GM bring out the real thing in a EV version? It could also be a per-emptive strike against Bollinger as the market might not support two vehicles in the same segment. Or it could be to prevent Ford or someone else buying up Bollingers design at fire sale prices, if Bollinger cannot get it to the market. A lot of money has gone into making the designs and building the prototype, which would be worth something to another manufacturer. GM may be aware of what is happening with Bollinger and may not want the company to be sold and what better way then by bringing out a competitor in the same sub segment.

    That is not to say that it will not affect Rivian, but to me it will affect Bollinger a lot more than Rivian. Rivian is going to be concentrating more on delivery vehicles for the likes of Amazon that off-road vehicles for now.
  5. gooki

    gooki Active Member

    I don't get the Bollinger vs Hummer being in the same market.

    Hummer in my mind equates to massive oversized vehicles that have little use outside of the military.

    Bollinger in my mind is bringing back the basic 4wd but with an EV drive train. Something for us FJ40 owners, Hilux owners, Land Rover owners, and old-school Jeep owners. Something for hunters and 4wd enthusiasts and wealthy farmers.

    Rivian is focused on the adventure life style owner. Rich city folk that want a vehicle that will take them anywhere they want to go.

    Of the three Rivian will likely see the most success because their target market can afford their cars. Bollinger will meet their own measure of success because they have lower volume aspirations. GM will find they wasted a **** tone of money trying to electrify the Hummer, sales will be few and far between because who the **** is their market?
  6. gooki

    gooki Active Member

    If the Bollinger was the same price and had the same range as the Rivian, and was proven to be reliable I'd happily choose the B1.
  7. interestedinEV

    interestedinEV Well-Known Member

    Agree, and also due to the fact they have huge order from Amzaon and will be well positioned for urban delivery vehicles.

    Both are built for the off-road driving and we are talking about the civilian version which was very popular in the US some time back. There was an advantageous tax break and even today I see a vehicle or two. Again, you are very right that the market is limited and GM stopped selling these vehicles about 10 years back. There are still people who miss the off roading capabilities of Hummer H1/H2. Apparently a lot of design features in B1 resemble the H1/H2. Many articles find similarities between the H1/H2 and the B1/B2. Bollinger is also sometimes compared to the Landrover

    Like the Hummer H1, the B1 and B2 offer just four bucket seats, but here they're separated by a load floor that's even with the rear cargo floor. In the case of the B2 pickup, there is a Chevy Avalanche-esque "midgate" that folds flat into the rear load floor, and the back glass can either flip up or be removed

    Bollinger Motors is planning to reveal new production-bound prototype versions of its B1 SUV and B2 pickup on September 26 in Detroit.

    The Bollinger fully electric trucks stand apart from everything else in the EV sector—even the electric trucks that are on the way from Rivian. Flat-panel styling, exposed rivets, and intentionally sharp edges give it styling that straddles a middle ground between Tonka truck and Hummer, with the cachet of Range Rover.

    According to the company the trucks will be expensive and rather exclusive, with 614-horsepower dual-motor drive systems and about a 200-mile range expected from a 120-kwh battery pack. Off-road capability will be a priority, and Bollinger has teased a 50/50 weight distribution and 15-inch ground clearance.

    Hummer H1
  8. interestedinEV

    interestedinEV Well-Known Member

    May be I need to back off my statement a little bit or may be I don't. The latest announcement from Bollinger is the price will be $125,000 but they expect to manufacture only 1000 units in the first year. So I do not know how to interpret the reaction to this? If they expect to sell on 1000 units in the first year, does it show how big the market is for an off-road EV? The only reason H2 sold was the tax break people could get. Will Hummer sell better in a EV. Or is this to niche a market?
  9. Hummer will always sell better just because of brand recognition, and its past heritage (military, etc). Plus I think it helps that they should be able to use a lot of the past design and engineering that went into previous models.
  10. interestedinEV

    interestedinEV Well-Known Member

    True, if Hummer comes out with a model soon, Bollinger will bite the dust, they are not going to be able to compete at that price.
  11. gooki

    gooki Active Member

    I get the impression Hummers are 50% wider than the B1.
  12. interestedinEV

    interestedinEV Well-Known Member

    Not the civilian versions at least. The Bollinger B1 is 76.5" wide, the Hummer H1 is 86.5" and the Hummer H2 is 81.2". They are all street legal, so they cannot too wide. Military versions could be much wider.

    • Passengers 4
    • Seat Material and Color Black Leather
    • Drive AWD
    • 0-60 (sec) 4.5
    • Top Speed (mph) 127
    • Horsepower 360
    • Torque (lb-ft) 472
    • Total Vehicle Weight (lbs) 3,900
    • Chassis Weight (lbs) 295
    • Power / Weight Ratio 10.8
    • Energy Storage (kWh) 60 or 100
    • Range (mi) 120 or 200
    • Motor Dual Front/ Rear
    • MPGe (est) 67.4
    • Wheelbase (in) 105
    • Length (in) 150
    • Width (in) 76.5
    • Height (in) 73.5
    H2 Dimension
    Starting MSRP
    Front track
    69.4 in.
    Curb weight 6400 lbs.
    Gross weight 8600 lbs.
    Angle of approach 40.4 degrees
    Maximum payload 2200 lbs.
    Angle of departure 39.6 degrees
    Length 189.8 in.
    Maximum towing capacity 7000 lbs.
    Ground clearance 10.0 in.
    Height 77.8 in.
    Wheel base 122.8 in.
    Width 81.2 in.
    Rear track 69.4 in.
  13. David Green

    David Green Well-Known Member

    Sometimes you have to read between the lines, the fact that Bob Lutz was talking about Hummer EV, a couple weeks after touring GM's design studio tells me something is in progress. Bob Lutz has never been able to hide what he is thinking, and I am sure GM does not mind him spilling some beans to generate some hype.
  14. gooki

    gooki Active Member

    Jeepers, the old hummers are twice the weight of the Bollinger product.

    Either way I think there’s a decent market for totalitarian EVs, but not at the price Bollinger are charging.

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