How much Gas-only range should I expect from a 2018 PHEV full tank?

Discussion in 'Clarity' started by Jacobsk, Jul 4, 2019.

  1. Bought a 2018 Touring PHEV a couple weeks ago and am loving it so far! Don't get to charge too often, but I do get free charging at Uni during semester.

    Now, I just did a full tank and noticed the HV range was marked at 219 miles.

    On Honda's website describing the range, it says:
    Combined Gas-Electric Driving Range Rating: 340 miles
    Maximum EV Mode Driving Range Rating: 47 miles

    Does this imply that Gas-only would be 340-47=293mi?

    If that is the case, why does my range only show 219 miles after a complete fillup? Am I reading the numbers wrong?

  2. stacey burke

    stacey burke Active Member

    those are guesses, estimations, approximate... of the mileage you might get. It depends like any other car on the speed, jackrabbits starts, etc... To give you a guess I just drove to Las Vegas with speed at 80 mph and air conditioning on. My mileage was about 40 MPG and with a 7.5 gal tank you can do the math, 300 miles or 280 leaving only 1/2 gal to spare. Your mileage will differ at speed and mountains and all of the other.
    Steve H Truong likes this.
  3. M.M.

    M.M. Active Member

    As noted, and as with all things related to mile-efficiency. the exact numbers will vary considerably depending on driving conditions and habits, but Honda's website is more or less accurate, you are reading the numbers correctly, and the estimated gas range is showing low for some reason. With a full tank it will generally be somewhere in the general vicinity of 300 miles, and that's generally the vicinity of what you'll get unless you really lead-foot it.

    The most likely reason is that it just hasn't calibrated yet, or the most recent driving was horribly inefficient (for example, you just drove up a long hill at 80mph or something). It will probably start to make sense eventually, or at least be closer. In general, though, the range estimates aren't all that good in my experience--they bounce around a lot and tend to be high at least with my driving pattern.

    If after you've driven for a while and filled up a couple of times you're still getting garbage numbers, take it to the dealer and see if they can figure out something. Alternately, pay attention to miles-between-fills, and calculate to make sure that you aren't genuinely getting terrible mileage for some reason, which would indicate a mechanical problem.

    Just to note, there was a significant bug in the other direction in the original-release software that would cause the gasoline range to be calculated based on the total average miles driven, which if you drove primarily EV would result in the range shooting up to 1000 miles the first time you filled the tank. That was fixed in a software update eventually, though, and since your car is new it should already have that applied (plus it usually resulted in high range, not low).
    Steve H Truong likes this.
  4. 4sallypat

    4sallypat Active Member

    Driving conditions (variables) have a huge impact on range while on ICE.
    I recently had a trip out of my town and did not get to recharge much.
    While driving 40-60MPH in mixed highway and city I got 380 miles range but that includes: paddle deceleration, 4 bars EV charge left, no climate controls, no seat heaters, no headlights, and braking lightly & consistently - all contributing to extending 48 miles per gallon of fuel....
    Steve H Truong likes this.
  5. fotomoto

    fotomoto Active Member

    At nearly 5600 miles, I'm going to assume you bought this 2018 used. If so, was it from a dealer? If so, no plugging in to charge + "idling" on the sales lot while showing customers its features + frequent but very short test drives will kill the mpg avg so the fuel computer could still be basing some of its calculations on that. And also your pure gas driving might be suspect=slow down. ;)

    I suggest going into system settings and set Trip A to auto reset every drive and Trip B to auto reset with every fill up. Watch the last 3 trip A's page to get a better grasp of your routes and driving styles.

    Finally, get a partial charge in the battery by either plugging in anywhere* or using HV+ charging (hold HV button down for several seconds) to build up a few miles of EV range AND KEEP THEM while using HV mode. The car seems to respond better with a larger battery buffer. NOTE: HV+ charging uses the gasoline engine to charge the battery so that will drive down mpg's too.

    *The car should have come with the OEM charge cable (check the trunk sub floor) that can be plugged into any standard 120v receptacle so you don't need to use a public charger to get a charge; just have permission of course. It will add approx. 4 miles/hr. Level II (240v) is much faster adding approx. 20-22 miles/hr at the car's max rate.
    Steve H Truong likes this.
  6. M.M.

    M.M. Active Member

    One more datapoint to compare, I kept careful track of mileage and fuel use on a ~2000 mile trip from northern California to Death Valley and back (winter, little air conditioning), which consisted of a probably 2:1 mix of driving at around 70 on flat highways (Central Valley and around the park) and going up and down mountains (into and out of the park repeatedly and getting over the coastal range). 42.2 MPG was what I ended up getting, starting the calculation from when the battery was fully depleted.
    Steve H Truong likes this.
  7. Bender

    Bender Member

    Just as another data point, I drove my new 2018 (12 month old mfr date) from the dealer to my house 290 mi at >90F with AC at 67F, 75% at 78MPH using mostly ACC and LKAS just for test purposes. Started with 0 electric and used HV charge at the start of the trip, then HV, then switched to EV near my destination. Averaged over 45mpg from hybrid mode (Battery charge nearly equal at start and finish).

    30 seems really low if that's what you're actually seeing, unless you're constantly starting and stopping quickly. Or unless you're one of those many people who completely misunderstand regenerative breaking and are wasting energy with "max regen" from the paddles on all the time.
    (I've actually found no use for the regen paddles at all yet... but I was used to normal brake pedal control of regen breaking from my prior hybrid. I could see maybe on a long down-slope to prevent speeding up, but seems dangerous not to have brake lights vs just "riding the " regenerative brakes through brake pedal)
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2019
    Steve H Truong likes this.
  8. AlAl

    AlAl Active Member

    Driving habits:
  9. MajorAward

    MajorAward Active Member

    My guess for HV range would be 290-320, depending on road conditions, traffic, terrain, and the weight of your foot:)
  10. In real life, on long road trips using HV all the way, fuel level was low enough at about 225 miles to start thinking about next gas station. That worked out to about 42 mpg for us. By that point we’ve been sitting for over 3 hours, so a rest stop is welcome regardless.
    Steve H Truong likes this.
  11. Mowcowbell

    Mowcowbell Active Member

    Best response yet... the range of the vehicle shouldn't be a big concern. It's all about how long the occupants want to be sitting at a time. At 2 hours of driving, I'm more than ready for a leg stretch/bathroom break.

    Bit of Trivia: The longest stretch of interstate highway without gas stations is only 107 miles... between Green River and Salina, UT on I-70.
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2019
  12. Danks

    Danks Active Member

    Only put gas in it twice, both times on the way back home after buying the car in Lockport, NY. Got 48.5 and 46.5 on those fillups. Second leg was more highway and included heavy rain with defog running. In retrospect I wonder if just using the windshield defrost would have worked better.
  13. M.M.

    M.M. Active Member

    I believe the power draw for the electric rear-window defrost heater is fairly low, and don't expect it will have a noticeable impact on battery life or mileage. Sounds like you know this, but also keep in mind that the car does use waste heat from the ICE when available, so the cabin heater goes from having an extreme impact on range (while on battery) to none at all (while using gas).
    Steve H Truong likes this.
  14. neal adkins

    neal adkins Active Member

    I have found that i usually get 40mpg in hv. So i just say 40 x 7 is 280 miles range. From all of the reports of inaccurate hv range estimates i think it is silly to take the dispayed hv range serious. It is not only silly but a joke of an engineering effort. Totally useless because most people will not do the same exact routine everyday. They meant well but missed the mark on this. On something as serious as range estimates i will trust my common sense and basic math.
  15. 2002

    2002 Well-Known Member

    There was a software bug on early models that made the HV range estimate useless, that has been fixed. Cars have been displaying gas range estimates for years now, I suppose we could say those were the first "guess-o-meters". Useful for having a general idea at a glance how many miles you have left, but hopefully no one plans a trip based on what the HV estimate says. If it's that critical they should be doing calculations like you are doing.
  16. neal adkins

    neal adkins Active Member

    I think the logic used in the engineering errs because it assumes your charging/driving routines are consistent. Its like trying to predict your future spending based on your previous bank statements.very unpredictable.
  17. 2002

    2002 Well-Known Member

    Of course our EV guess-o-meter does the same thing, it tries to predict based on driving habits. Any previous fuel guess-o-meters that I have used were on rentals so I can't really say much about their accuracy. Are you finding the Clarity fuel GOM to be less accurate than other cars that you have driven?
  18. MPower

    MPower Well-Known Member

    In my days of hi-tech innocence, I believed the GOM on my 2012 Prius Plugin until I nearly got stranded in a snow storm in the back of nowhere late on a Sunday night. Lesson learned.
  19. neal adkins

    neal adkins Active Member

    Yes. Actual range always varies but when you charge just one extra time/or 1 less time in a given estimate thats about a 18 percent change in actual range either direction.
  20. MrFixit

    MrFixit Well-Known Member

    For those who complain about the GOM... I am not sure what you want.

    Range estimation is just that - an estimate. There is no way for any vehicle to predict things that you may do differently from drive to drive to impact range.

    I for one, find it to be useful and reasonably good. I don't think Honda Engineering flopped on this at all (with the exception of the HV Range 'fix' that was deployed as a service update).
    MPower and insightman like this.

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