EV mode question

Discussion in 'Clarity' started by JKroll, Jul 10, 2018.

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  1. JKroll

    JKroll Member

    So I just charged battery. Battery is 100 % full and I start the car... weather is hot outside and climate is set at 69. The car went into mode where the EV symbol was missing.
    Tried toggling between sport and ev and hv and ev .. nothing worked.
    finally I turned the climate to 71. the car went into EV mode automatically.
    Later on I changed to 69 but the car stayed in EV mode.

    So my question is there a way to force car to go into EV mode ... I know my battery is full and I am only driving 4 miles ... what gives?
     
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  3. insightman

    insightman Well-Known Member

    No, the EV Drive mode that the Clarity's computer can select is not available to the user. Selecting ECON Mode without HV Mode is the best way to tell the computer you would prefer to travel in EV Drive mode, if the computer so pleases.
     
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  4. JKroll

    JKroll Member

    then what logic can explain the computer make this choice?
    climate of 69 ... it needs ICE

    but climate of 71 followed by climate of 69 .. it can work in EV drive mode

    ??
     
  5. insightman

    insightman Well-Known Member

    It will be interesting to see if you can repeat this experiment. A few degrees of climate change doesn't normally affect the Clarity's decision about when to run its engine. Honda's saying nothing.

    Many on this forum suspect that the Clarity PHEV starts its engine shortly after setting out with a full battery when regen is activated through braking or using the paddles. Perhaps it's a mysterious way to prevent overcharging the battery.
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2018
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  6. KentuckyKen

    KentuckyKen Well-Known Member

    Also, p13 of the manual gives 4 additional scenarios where the ICE will run besides for motive power. Even though it’s a PHEV and not a pure BEV, it is possible to drive it so that you are 99%+ in EV. I went over 3,000 miles and 4 months with only a few minutes and a few miles of the ICE running which appeared to be System Checks or the limited regen/battery protection assumed scenario.
    Page 13:
    “Auto Engine Stop/Start
    The car will select the appropriate source of power depending on the drive mode you select.As a result, the engine will automatically start or stop as needed to either charge the battery or provide supplemental power.Under certain circumstances, the engine may turn on or, if it is already on, it may not turn off.
    ●You are going uphill or accelerating aggressively.●
    The climate control system is in heavy use.
    ●The Ambient temperature is too hot or too cold.●
    The High Voltage Battery state of charge is very low.
    ●The vehicle is running a system check.
    System Check
    When the engine initially starts (between the time the POWER button is turned on and turned off), the vehicle conducts a system check.
    ●While the check is being conducted, the engine may periodically turn on and off. This, however, is normal.
    ●The curved blue line in the POWER/CHARGE Gauge will not appear during the system check (EV indicator may still turn on).
    ●Once the engine starts, it will continue to run until the system reaches operating temperature.The curved blue line in the POWER/CHARGE Gauge will reappear once the system check is completed.”
     
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  8. GV Ottawa

    GV Ottawa Member

    I have never observed this behaviour. I charge fully every night and thus every morning head out in Econ mode and use the paddle to get to 4 chevrons at every stop sign / stop light. There are several within the first km of my drive and I've yet to see the ICE start up. The Power Meter dips fully into the green charge region on my stops. I typically drive 70-80 km throughout the day in this mode and ICE never turns on - I'm always in pure electric. Note this is all city type driving with only one short, relatively steep uphill on my drive home. The rest is fairly flat with a few rolling hills.
     
  9. JKroll

    JKroll Member

    That would explain it... assuming you are living in much colder place.

    The outside temperature was 90 plus when I noticed it. And I did not stay on ICE long enough to know that it would switch automatically (was thinking I can force EV mode. Not knowing difference between ECON and EV mode)
     
  10. GV Ottawa

    GV Ottawa Member

    No it is definitely not a much colder place these days in Ottawa! Regular temperatures in the low to mid 90s F the past few weeks with tons of humidity. I have the climate control set on Auto at about 71 F.
     
  11. KentuckyKen

    KentuckyKen Well-Known Member

    When you leave with a full charge, do you notice that the regen is limited in that it does not dip down into the green as far as it does normally and that pedal braking does not add as much (or any) regen?
    Several of us have noticed this happening for a short time immediately after a full charge. I even noticed twice that when selecting max regen, the chevrons blinked and reverted to 2 chevrons. Only seems to happen wirh a full charge and only for the first few miles.
    Please check right after charging and post back so we can get another data point.
     
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  13. GV Ottawa

    GV Ottawa Member

    Ken,

    I have not noticed any such behaviour. I have seen postings to this effect and thus have been watching closely over the past week, but to my knowledge my car's regen behaviour is identical right after a full charge as anytime throughout my ride. I am always in Econ mode with the climate control active and always click the paddle several times to get to 4 chevrons. The regen seems to dip down into the green a similar amount whether I have a full charge or a partial charge. My first stop sign is about 150 m from my driveway, another about 600 m farther down the road, and then I have the regular barrage of traffic lights.

    Cheers,
    Gary
     
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  14. KentuckyKen

    KentuckyKen Well-Known Member

    Gary, thanks for checking on this. It seems our cars are acting a little different on a full charge with respect to regen being limited or not, immediately after a full charge. It makes reverse engineering our wonderful Claritys quite a challenge. Could you tell me what your EV range estimate was after the full charge?
    Thanks again
     
  15. GV Ottawa

    GV Ottawa Member

    This morning the EV range estimate was 82 km. Over the past 2 weeks I've seen it range from 77-88 km. Not sure why it would vary though ... certainly I understand that driving conditions / temperature, etc willl impact the actual EV range obtained, but I don't understand why the EV range estimate right after a full charge should ever vary. The battery capacity has not changed (same number of cells, same composition, etc.) so the starting point estimate should be identical every day in my opinion and the only thing that would vary is what your actual EV range driven ends up being based upon a plethora of factors.

    But, as others have posted in other threads, the range estimation algorithm is clearly proprietary intellectual property to Honda and there is no reason to think they would ever release their algorithm to the public.

    Cheers,
    Gary
     
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  16. bobcubsfan

    bobcubsfan Active Member

    May off subject, but last night battery went to zero and ICE apparently came on. I was on the freeway going 65 at the time and did not really noticing that it fired up. So what is the difference if you just let that happen or you engage the HV mode?
     
  17. KentuckyKen

    KentuckyKen Well-Known Member

    Thanks for the additional info.
    The only difference between us that I can tell is that you’re starting with EV estimates of high 40s to low 50s versus my low to mid 60s (converted to miles for us metrically challenged guys). Don’t know if that is meaningful or if maybe that makes the algorithm in my car reach the point at which it decides to protect the battery from overcharging. As you said, without Honda opening up we’re just all speculating and assuming.

    As to your different EV estimates at full charge, the battery temperature will affect the amount of charge and the algorithm using how far you were able to drive per kWh used in the past will make even larger changes on the EV range estimate. But I have found that when the seasonal temperature changes reach a steady state and my driving is all the same, my EV range estimates stay very consistent.

    Enjoy those EV ranges while you can before your Canadian winter hits. I’m in Kentucky and it’s way cold enough here in the winter for me.
     
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  18. insightman

    insightman Well-Known Member

    If you press the HV button, you get to decide how much battery charge you want in reserve. Otherwise, some programmer in Japan makes the decision for you.

    On the HV range issue, just think, Honda's programmers reached a point where the Clarity was computing its potential HV range the way they wanted and said, "That's it! It can't get any better! Lock the software and burn the chips!"
     
  19. bobcubsfan

    bobcubsfan Active Member

    I noticed that the car switched from EV to HV as the battery build up a little charge. On a longer drive, from our house to Santa Barbara which is about 75 miles, the battery will run out no matter if I go into HV mode or not. I will give that a try to see what happens.
     
  20. insightman

    insightman Well-Known Member

    Really? You lose charge in HV Mode? That's not supposed to happen, although others on this forum have reported that significant climbs will reduce the battery's SOC while in HV Mode.

    This graph from the Owners Manual shows that HV Mode is supposed to maintain the battery's SOC. Perhaps this departure from the way the Clarity is supposed to work constitutes a repeatable way to demonstrate your Clarity is somehow different from most?

    [​IMG]
     
  21. bobcubsfan

    bobcubsfan Active Member

    I misspoke. The battery went to zero when on the freeway NOT in HV mode. I then pressed the HV button and the car switched from EV to HV as the battery picked up a little charge. The "flow" diagram was all over the place. From battery to wheels. From ICE to wheels. From ICE to battery. Fun to watch.
     
  22. JKroll

    JKroll Member

    so this is what happened today - not same same as yesterday.

    Outside temp 94. AC set at 69. Battery fully charged. Went into EV mode right away and stayed there.
     
  23. JackH

    JackH Member

    Remember - if you are in ECON and EV and press the pedal past the indent the ICE will always come on.
     

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