"10 Reasons Why The Mini Cooper SE Is The Perfect Electric City Car"

With no throttle FWD and RWD should handle identical with the equivalent weight distribution but the second you start adding power to the FWD car, the weight is transferred rearward reducing the grip of the front tires (which are doing all the work). With RWD, as you add power you are increasing the traction demand on the rear tires but at the same time you are increasing their grip with the weight transfer.

The effects of weight transfer are hard to see with a "sporty" car because there is essentially no body roll with the stiff suspension but a good example to help visualize is the ridiculous Stadium Super Trucks race series. Soft suspension trophy trucks on an asphalt circuit clearly show exactly what tires the weight is on as they pitch about through braking, accelerating, and cornering.

This is an example of accelerating out of a corner, the passenger rear clearly has all the grip:

 

I've driven FWD, RWD, and AWD. I still prefer FWD myself in poor weather which we get here way too much. I wouldn't say no to RWD if that's all we had, but I do not share the same love you do.

Minis are the most fun I have ever had in any car I've driven or owned. And I've driven a lot (including Miatas). May be just a young female here, but I love cars as a whole.

 

Great to know the Mini has been fun, once the lockdown here is over, will have to test drive the Mini. Also love cars in general and there has been plenty of times of just going out for a drive with no planned destination .

Dan

 

A little back story for you. I have had a more sporty streak of cars in my past until I had a kid. Then I felt I needed a small SUV. After 8 years (and keeping my Si in the house for me to still enjoy) I decided I had had enough. So I went test driving replacements. The Italian Job had me in love with Minis by look. So it was on my list among so many brands. I went out to test drive to get it out of my system and bought it the day I was done trying all cars.

Miatas are fun but feel less planted I think. I drove a few over the years and while my mom loved them, I never really "needed" to buy it. I totally justified the SE being a glorified 2 seater (my previous Mini was a F55 so 4 dr) in a way I never did before having kids.

Hopefully you'll find them as much fun as I have. When moving to an EV every car out there was 100% compared to my Mini. None lived up to it. Not even Tesla (faster off the line, but missing fun handling)

 

Great to here! I'm so excited to finally get to drive mine in a week or two! When my Miata was stock it was fun but definitely tended to understeer (lawyers set the alignment not engineers) and had quite a bit of body roll so that could explain your impression. With just a custom alignment it was a whole different car but then adding suspension and sway bars made it amazing!

I really wanted a Model 3 but couldn't bring myself to do it because they took most of the fun out of it unless you pay 50k+ for the performance version.

 

That would definitely explain my reaction to the Miatas! I'm sure customization would make me feel differently.

The model 3s really weren't special to me... maybe a bit faster off the line, but not enough to care. The handling was eh. Even the higher end Tesla models just lack the fun. Minis are like driving a go-kart. You can throw them through curves and it just feels solid. Seriously tons of fun!

 

I've been driving a stock Z51 Vette since 1985, so my go-cart handling bar is set pretty hight. It pulls well over 1 G. The mini is small, fun, easy to maneuver, and nimble, the EV makes it easy to drive quick.. love driving it. But it is noticeably slower in transitions, has much more body roll, feels less planted, with slower steering than my bar.... and probably any performance tuned handling bar. Not saying it is bad, just different. Better than the average smaller and fun to drive car. It has a nice ride compromise, and is easy to park, just about right for every day fun.

 

I drove a Subaru BRZ, before Jessie. It would be a perfect platform to make a RWD, based-on-a-current-ICE sports car. Leave the huge hatch, replace the useless +2 seats with the motor, and put the battery where the boxer engine is. It would be incredible; the BRZ is already known for its incredible handling and need for more torque.

 

A couple of years ago before there were any fun affordable EVs I was seriously considering either converting my Miata or buying a used/salvage BRZ and making it electric. I was just waiting for battery costs to come down with enough smashed tesla's but they're still not quite low enough. The Mini with the federal/state rebate costs almost exactly what I would pay for just the parts to make a ~100mi EV so I just bought the Mini.

 

There is so little body roll in the SE it's crazy. It's one of the reasons some of us do full laps through roundabouts . My previous ICE MINI Hardtop had noticeable body roll, but not the SE because of the lower center of gravity.

I'm not trying to say RWD doesn't have advantages, I'm just bringing up the possibility that FWD in an EV like the SE is getting close to being equivalent to RWD in handling most of the time.

 

My order really only has a few entries:
1) performance (acceleration + handling)
2) One pedal driving (I surprised myself with the order of this one)
3) Comfortable yet compact interior
4) Price - purchase and running costs

the rest are just nice to haves

Wading into the FWD/RWD chat - I have been lucky to own many FWD and RWD cars, including mid engined RWD. I have also raced minis (the old kind) and karts. My choice of cars, at least for road use, is FWD. The reason is that they give the best compromise between safety and performance for a reasonably powerful car.

FWD cars use the same tyres to propel and steer the car. You have a "force circle" - of about 1G. You can't ask the tyres to turn and accelerate more than that. There is a different technique to racing FWD cars, but it isn't slower (for the same power/weight). When you push too hard, FWD cars lose traction and don't steer as much (understeer). To counter, you can turn more which scrubs speed and turns more. This is by far the safest loss of traction. The SE doesn't really have enough power to get torque steer to write home about, and there is negligible weight transfer. We accelerate pretty much at the limit of power/weight.

RWD cars can indeed accelerate faster, as weight transfer means more power can be transferred. The big problem is that this lightens the steering meaning you lose steering control (think of the wheel standing trucks above). Another thing is that when turning hard there is less weight over the back wheels and they can slip (oversteer). This looks cool on top gear, but in reality it is slower and more dangerous. Even F1 drivers who boot it before the the car weight moves rearward can lose traction and spin. Yes it is fun, but not on a road.

Mid engine - most think this the perfect combination, and to some degrees it is. The problem mid engine cars have is two fold. They have less weight over the front, so tend to lose the front steering, especially in the wet (I have experience with this ). Secondly, yes they hang on like banshees round a corner......until they dont. You are then in an expensive pendulum. I have also experienced this.

A good driver, with the correct technique for their type of car, will be just as effective as the others. The reason I choose FWD is that when you cross the line, it is easier to get back. Mid engine (think X1/9 to 911 to lambo) cars work wonders, then traction breaks and they spin. RWD lets you be a hero and fang the back out, until you get it wrong, and you guessed it, you spin. FWD cars gently understeer (unless you let off the accelerator, then you......spin/flip or both). If you go too fast you can miss a corner, but in most cases, you steer into the corner, which slows you down and you make it around.

 

I agree with most of what you said, high power/torque cars with FWD are easier to control than high power RWD (mustangs didn't get their curb hunting reputation for no reason) but don't agree with a couple of things:

There is negligible body roll but absolutely not negligible weight transfer. You can have zero body roll and still have 100% weight transfer to the outside tires. Weight transfer is a function of center of mass height, track width, and lateral acceleration so unless the car's center of mass is literally on the ground there will always be significant weight transfer.

Even a lowered corvette can lift the inside wheels, just not as obvious as the trophy trucks:

Car behavior at the limit in a turn without throttle is almost entirely dependent alignment and suspension setup, not on FWD/RWD/AWD. My RWD Miata would understeer like crazy with the factory alignment and adding throttle would just make the understeer worse. With just a toe/camber adjustment it changed to a very neutral balance with slight understeer or oversteer depending on my inputs. With the right alignment you can also make a FWD car oversteer like crazy through turns, at least until the throttle is applied.

The FWD/RWD debate will never be solved on the internet and everyone is entitled to their own opinion/preferences. Up to this point I've been strongly RWD biased probably because every FWD car I've driven has been a boring economy car which are poor representations of FWD. I'm definitely excited about my Mini's handling (or I wouldn't have ordered one) and there will almost certainly be some suspension/alignment mods in its future to make it even better!

 

I was talking mainly about acceleration weight transfer, which is negligible. Cornering is a different case, as the width is much less than the length, and acceleration is approaching 1G (instead of 0.5G). So we are in agreement

Again, totally true - the part here is "no throttle". Without drive, the driven wheels are not a consideration. It then boils down to weight distribution, suspension geom, tyres etc.

I did a quick back of the napkin calculation, and the SE basically accelerates at, or very near the maximum possible for p/w. I was going to provide the maths, but didn't want people to fall asleep

 

This week I signed up for a Mini Cooper SE 2022 which will be delivered next week. My other car is a Subaru BRZ 2014 which I bought new and have used as my daily driver. I do like the road handling of that RWD car, so I was frankly really surprised when test driving the Mini and liking that even more!? Out of all the electric cars that I have test driven the Mini was by far the most fun to drive. Perhaps the Kia EV6 GT will be fun too, when it arrives next year - but at a much higher price. The lower range actually will not be a problem for me as I plan to use it for city driving with a daily distance of less than 150 km (about 95 miles). Why drive around with a larger and heavier battery than needed? I plan to install a 11 kW charger at home and expect fully charged batteries within about 3 hours.

 

When the specs for the MINI Cooper SE were first released in 2019, I read it could charge at 11 kW. So I dumped my 40-Amp EVSE and bought a 48-Amp EVSE. Then, MINI clarified that the car can charge at 11 kW only using 3-phase AC power. I don't have 3-phase AC power and the connector on the SEs that can accept 3-phase AC is different than mine. I regret that the cable on my 48-Amp EVSE is thicker and more unwieldy than the one on my puny 40-Amp EVSE was.

A 32-Amp, 240-Volt, single-phase AC EVSE can supply the maximum 7.6 kW a US SE can take. At that rate, you'd be looking at 4 hours for a full charge--from zero charge. Not many MINI Cooper SE owners are confident enough to coast into their driveways with zero charge. Because you'll rarely be charging a completely depleted battery, you'll rarely require more than 3 hours to achieve a full charge.

From what you wrote, you clearly value cornering. The Kia EV6 GT may offer more practicality, accelerate quicker and achieve a higher top speed than the MINI Cooper SE, but that heavy boat will never corner like a MINI Cooper SE. No manufacturer has shown any interest in building a car that can compete with the SE. Mazda has hinted at an electrified Miata, but it will probably be a hybrid rather than a BEV. A Miata BEV could give the MINI Cooper SE some competition in the fun category. I've never heard rumors that the BRZ could be electrified.

 

I am lucky to live in Sweden and have 240V AC with three phases in my house, which the Mini can get 11 kW from using a quite thin cable.

 

And the Mennekes connector too, right? instead of the North American J1772 which doesn't even accept three-phase. The reality with the SE, though, is the battery capacity is small enough that even 7.6 kW fully charges in just a few hours.

 

That's great! I didn't know 3-phase AC was common in homes in other countries. So, as you implied, you'll be able to coast into your driveway with a completely depleted battery and have your SE fully charged a mere 3 hours later.

 

Hum, no word about harsh suspension and highway noise, probable ridiculous resale value, up to the nose option packs..

 

This is the least expensive BEV you can get in the US, yet it's not a cheaply made car. However, the real reason to get a MINI Cooper SE is for driving fun. The available 16" rims wear tires with a taller cross-section than the 17" rims and IMO that makes for a comfier ride (I have both sizes). The smaller rims with their narrower tires result in a reduced contact patch, but I never approach the SE's cornering limits, so it doesn't reduce my driving pleasure.

I don't expect that years from now, when I pry my fingers off the steering wheel, this BEV with 110-114 miles of range will be worth a lot on the resale market--UNLESS by that time there is still no compact, sporty BEV contesting the SE for supremacy in it's unique niche.

Highway noise? I'm coming from 20 years of driving two gen-1 Honda Insights. Those cars had little, if any, sound deadening materials due the designers' focus on minimizing the Insight's weight (1,850 lbs). My MINI Cooper SE seems very quiet in comparison. Because the SE generates no engine noise, all other noises are, indeed, easier to hear.

I don't know how quiet a VW Golf GTI is, but I doubt it's much, if any, quieter than a MINI Cooper SE.

Remember, you're posting on a MINI Cooper SE forum. It won't be easy to get any of us to say we wished we'd bought a gas-powered GTI instead. A friend of mine has an e-Golf, but it's nowhere near as much fun as my SE.