MINI SE Electric price

[T.C.]

I hope the Mini lives up to the release details.
UK Mini electric is available in three trim level specification versions. Ranging from about 25k to 33k.
That places it about £8k cheaper in price than a similar spec i3.
I pulled the pin and placed a deposit an hour ago.
Deliveries are scheduled for pre-order models in March in the UK.
Specs are similar to i3 with which it shares its technology 94kwh battery and just over 7 seconds to 60mph.
The range is claimed as 144 miles.

 

[T.C.]

Oh yes, forgot to add, features a temperature controlled battery unit.

 

[insightman]

BMW/MINI today released the starting price for the MINI Cooper SE in the US will be $30,750 ($29,900 plus an $850 destination and handling charge).

I wonder if this low-end trim-level will be available from the start? I also wonder how US distribution will be allocated. Will I get one early because I placed my deposit long ago or will California get all they can absorb (which I predict will be many) because of the CA ZEV credits this BEV will generate?

The MINI USA web page for this car doesn't yet mention any pricing, or describe the anticipated trim levels. It's interesting that the site refers to the "MINI Electric," the British name for this car most of the time, barely mentioning the official "MINI Cooper SE" moniker.

 

[insightman]

That said, dealers may be willing to take only the MI tax without CA tax and ship it directly. It is not uncommon and there are several instances in the Hyundai Kona forum where NJ dealers did this. You have to find the right dealer, but then dealer may not be willing to negotiate on price, you may have to pay the MSRP. CA dealers are dealing with a supply problem so would demand top dollar and be less willing to go the extra mile but it can be done. If you can wait for some time after the launch, you may have better luck.

Thanks to you and to @bwilson4web for the cross-country research. I'll buy a portable generator to take with me to be safe--just kidding.

Despite the range-ragers declaring the MINI Cooper SE DOA due to its anticipated sub-Tesla range, I expect it will be massively popular in incentive-rich California at the start, so popular that dealers will be demanding "adjustments" to the MSRP. I agree it will be much easier to procure if I can wait, but I'm a chronic early-adopter (1st-gen Insight, 2nd-gen Insight, Clarity PHEV). As a consequence, I never have any leverage on the price of the cars I choose. I'd hate to pay the $850 delivery fee AND cross-country shipping in addition to fitting a base MINI hood to erase the SE's unfortunate marketing-induced fake hood scoop, but the surprisingly low MSRP just announced will help with that.

 

[interestedinEV]

but the surprisingly low MSRP just announced will help with that.

What is the price?

 

[T.C.]

Your USA mrsp of 30,750 for the Mini, equates almost exactly to our UK price for the base model of £24,400.
If only the same applied the opposite direction for your Tesla model 3 over here.
From 35,000 in the USA, the car here starts at £40.500. Roughly 50,000 dollars!

 

[insightman]

Your USA mrsp of 30,750 for the Mini, equates almost exactly to our UK price for the base model of £24,400.
If only the same applied the opposite direction for your Tesla model 3 over here.
From 35,000 in the USA, the car here starts at £40.500. Roughly 50,000 dollars!

I believe the base-trim US MINI Cooper SE is better equipped than the UK's base-trim MINI Electric. For example, the Level 1 UK MINI Electric has "Sport seats with Double Stripe cloth upholstery in Carbon Black," whereas the US's Signature trim comes with "Carbon Black Leatherette Upholstery." Here are the PDF files for the UK brochure and the US press release listing the standard features and base price.

 

[T.C.]

Comparison of the base model, USA version, sounds like our UK level 2 Mini.
Could someone offer an explanation how a car manufactured in the UK, costs £2000 more than then same car, transported across the Atlantic, import tariffs paid and sold in USA?

 

[interestedinEV]

Could someone offer an explanation how a car manufactured in the UK, costs £2000 more than then same car, transported across the Atlantic, import tariffs paid and sold in USA?

I learned something in Business School a long time back. Costs come from facts, pricing comes from strategy. There are emission requirements especially in California and few other states, so the average fuel efficiency is calculated. BMW may need to increase the fleet average i.e. for every gas guzzler they sell, sell a few fuel efficient ones. BMW has had little success with the I3 and need to establish a presence against Tesla. The problem with the I3 is that it is overpriced (same range, smaller hatchback but starting at $37,500). So they need to price it competitively as they have to 1) sell EVs 2) compete against the Hyundai, Model 3 etc. You have to remember that in UK and Europe, shorter range cars sell well, in the US the standard has become 200 miles (320 KM), that cars with lower range have a tougher time competing. If they charged £2000 (about $2700) more, they would be in the $33,000 range and might not sell too many cars.

It is a market thing, not a cost thing and I am sure BMW is making a profit albeit a small one with this price.

 

[insightman]

BMW may need to increase the fleet average i.e. for every gas guzzler they sell, sell a few fuel efficient ones.

I hope the need to offset gas-guzzler BMWs doesn't mean all the MINI Cooper SE cars will be shipped to California. I doubt BMW will poll dealers to find out who has the earliest deposits and ship cars to those dealers first (but that would be good for me).

Actually, I doubt there are very many dealers with deposits for the SE at this point, so the number of cash-qualified, non-California customers would not be great. I wonder why BMW didn't have a national reservation plan in the US like they did in the UK and Germany? Probably because it's a PITA they don't want to deal with over here.

More questions: What does BMW/MINI require of dealers before they can sell and service the MINI Cooper SE? Is the training to support the MINI Countryman SE PHEV deemed sufficient? Is there special equipment, such as battery lifts and new computers, required to qualify a dealership to sell this car?

 

[T.C.]

I wonder why BMW didn't have a national reservation plan in the US like they did in the UK and Germany? Probably because it's a PITA they don't want to deal with over here.

Don't apply too much common sense to BMW (Mini) UK. Yes they were happy to accept the £500 deposit. It was emphasised though, the order and timing of the deposit had no guarantee of the order of vehicle distribution to customers. Just because I was the first to slap a deposit down at my dealership on the first day that preorders were open. This serves no function as to the timing of the actual deliveries.
Two weeks from todays date will be my first chance to view a Mini E in the flesh. I have a list of questions to accost the dealer with....

 

[insightman]

The Car Guide has revealed Canadian prices for their 3 trim levels of the MINI Cooper SE, and the first 100 will be special.

> The 2020 MINI Cooper SE starts at $39,990 in Classic trim.
> Premier and Premier Plus trim levels retail for $44,990 and $47,990, respectively.
> These prices do not include the federal rebate of $5,000 and the provincial
> rebate of up to $8,000 in Quebec and $3,000 in B.C.
>
> The first 100 copies will be special-edition models featuring a
> unique badge on the front fenders and door sills. Customers
> will be able to choose whichever trim level they want.
>
> Deliveries are scheduled to begin on March 7, 2020. In the
> meantime, you can catch the new MINI Cooper SE at the
> Montreal and Toronto auto shows this winter.

The Canadian price for the Classic trim is $10,000 more than the $29,990 US base price. If you take $10K off the other two trim levels, they would cost $34,990 and $37,990 in the US. Proportionally, the other two trim levels would cost $33,740 and $35,990 in the US. These calculated US prices have no basis in fact, they're just my wild speculations.

The Car Guide article doesn't describe the Canadian trim levels, and MINI USA has listed the features included with the base, "Signature" model, but not the two more expensive US trim levels, which are to be called "Signature Plus," and "Iconic."

The Car Guide article says "Charging takes more than 20 hours using a regular power outlet, but drops to eight hours when the car is plugged into a 240V outlet." However, the MINI USA press release about US pricing says, "The MINI Cooper SE comes standard with AC Charging at up to 7.4 kW, which allows for a 100% charge at home in as little as 4 hours"

 

[interestedinEV]

Then there are the 78,000 "expressions of interest" in the UK and Europe to satisfy. I wonder how many electric MINIs can they manufacture a year?

That is good to hear and may be there is a pent up demand in Europe that BMW would like to satisfy before other markets. Question is how many of these will translate into actual sales? There is clearly an interest in the vehicle, can MINI keep the momentum going after the release.

The goal of the low price seems to me to be one of (gasp!) affordability. It will be interesting to see what dealers do with the price, should the car prove very popular.

May be I am wrong but I do not see it that way. The M3 which is a larger car, longer range can be obtained for about $35,000. So pricing it above $30,000 creates a natural comparison with M3. Also the Nissan Leaf which is a little bigger, a little better range is at about $31,000. Here is the issue, they can price it higher and sell 2000 cars today. However, if they find they have over capacity and need to sell 10000 or 12000 cars annually in the US, they have to reduce the price, which never bodes well with current customers. Looking at it another way, the BEV yearly average to date for M3 is about 12500 units a month, Bolt about 1500 units a month, the Leaf about 1000 units a month and then it drops even more. It is unlikely that if they price it higher, that they will sell more cars than the LEAF with this short range, month after month.


Also dealers are now losing money and Mini needs to get more dealers. One way is allow them to sell above MSRP for the short term. All dealers are not like your Michigan dealer. The Phoenix dealerships (2) are both owned by Penske Automotive, and if they can sell above MSRP, they will. Another factor is the price of a current Mini, which is about $22K and very fuel efficient. The electric version is about 40% already and could be 50% more if they priced it higher. Such a differential will be noticed.

Today, they can price it low but restrict supply so they do can meet compliance needs without losing much. Tomorrow they can increase supply when they have economies of scale. The pricing has to be strategic, for the long term. My hypothesis is that MINI tried to price it as high as possible without pricing themselves out of the market.

So I do not think that MINI/BMW are being altruistic when they priced it at about $30,000. By doing this, it could be a compliance car for the short term, with the ability to sell more in the long term if they see a demand and desire.

My 1 -c-

 

[insightman]

That is good to hear and may be there is a pent up demand in Europe that BMW would like to satisfy before other markets. Question is how many of these will translate into actual sales? There is clearly an interest in the vehicle, can MINI keep the momentum going after the release.

May be I am wrong but I do not see it that way. The M3 which is a larger car, longer range can be obtained for about $35,000. So pricing it above $30,000 creates a natural comparison with M3. Also the Nissan Leaf which is a little bigger, a little better range is at about $31,000. Here is the issue, they can price it higher and sell 2000 cars today. However, if they find they have over capacity and need to sell 10000 or 12000 cars annually in the US, they have to reduce the price, which never bodes well with current customers. Looking at it another way, the BEV yearly average to date for M3 is about 12500 units a month, Bolt about 1500 units a month, the Leaf about 1000 units a month and then it drops even more. It is unlikely that if they price it higher, that they will sell more cars than the LEAF with this short range, month after month.

Also dealers are now losing money and Mini needs to get more dealers. One way is allow them to sell above MSRP for the short term. All dealers are not like your Michigan dealer. The Phoenix dealerships (2) are both owned by Penske Automotive, and if they can sell above MSRP, they will. Another factor is the price of a current Mini, which is about $22K and very fuel efficient. The electric version is about 40% already and could be 50% more if they priced it higher. Such a differential will be noticed.

Today, they can price it low but restrict supply so they do can meet compliance needs without losing much. Tomorrow they can increase supply when they have economies of scale. The pricing has to be strategic, for the long term. My hypothesis is that MINI tried to price it as high as possible without pricing themselves out of the market.

So I do not think that MINI/BMW are being altruistic when they priced it at about $30,000. By doing this, it could be a compliance car for the short term, with the ability to sell more in the long term if they see a demand and desire.

My 1 -c-

Thank you for your 1 -c-. I'm enjoying this discussion. I know my pro-SE bias is showing. It will be very interesting to see how the sales of this car proceed, based on the actions of the company (supply, distribution, marketing), the reviews by the journalists, and the wallet-disposition of the public.

You probably meant the i3, not the M3, which costs more than $66K and has 0 EV range. The MSRP for the BMW i3 is greater than $44K, but I did find a new one for $39K on cars.com. Many are listed above $50K.

You wrote "dealers are now losing money and Mini needs to get more dealers." Would prospective new dealers look at current MINI sales and decide they could do a better job of selling this anti-SUV line-up than the 121 dealers already trying? I doubt the current 121 dealers believe additional dealerships would help them increase sales. The only thing that might stem the overwhelming popularity of SUVs in the US and create a bigger market for BEVs is a significant, non-temporary jump in gasoline prices. I hope MINI can survive, but it looks like the company will need Chinese-built SUVs to keep it going. I hope the MINI Cooper SE isn't a one (year)-and-done car.

I agree that there's going to be a ceiling MSRP for an electric car with likely less than 125 miles of EPA range. The MINI Cooper SE, being a stylish, luxurious and sporty car should be able to push hard against that ceiling, whatever it may be, because there will be no direct competitor. It doesn't help that this MINI generation is 5 years old. However, the next generation MINI will likely be larger as BMW starts sharing platforms with their Chinese partner (Great Wall, I believe).

The issue of compliance seems moot to me because a mere 2,000 electric MINIs won't provide much of an offset for BMW's gas-guzzling SUVs.

There are two categories of buyers that I foresee: MINI fans who never want to experience an engine issue and electric car buyers who don't want a Spartan Leaf or Bolt. The key is finding small-car customers who are willing to trade EV range for style, luxury, and sportiness (insightman raises his hand).

If only MINI could have packed a 250-mile battery into their gorgeous 2016 Superleggera Vision concept car, used the i3's carbon-fiber technology to keep the weight below 3,000 lbs, and set the price at $40K.....................(oops, ran out of ellipses)

 

[interestedinEV]

If only MINI could have packed a 250-mile battery into their gorgeous 2016 Superleggera Vision concept car, used the i3's carbon-fiber technology to keep the weight below 3,000 lbs, and set the price at $40K.....................(oops, ran out of ellipses)

If such wishes could come true, maybe I will get my wish of the ultimate zero energy/zero pollution vehicle (Belated Happy Halloween)