John Cadogan and Scott Kilmer would make a great YouTube

[bwilson4web]

It would be hilarious if these two nuts could interview each other:

• John Cadogan - an Australian car guy who hates all things Tesla
• Scott Kilmer - a USA car guy who hates all things Tesla

The only problem is how to keep these two, streams of verbal abuse to share the audio. Perhaps some sort of electronic "chess clock" might work or just a hard time limit, say 10-15 seconds switching between each.

Why? Because they won't sing together in harmony so let them spew their bile in one pot.

Bob Wilson

 

[David Green]

It would be hilarious if these two nuts could interview each other:

• John Cadogan - an Australian car guy who hates all things Tesla
• Scott Kilmer - a USA car guy who hates all things Tesla

The only problem is how to keep these two, streams of verbal abuse to share the audio. Perhaps some sort of electronic "chess clock" might work or just a hard time limit, say 10-15 seconds switching between each.

Why? Because they won't sing together in harmony so let them spew their bile in one pot.

Bob Wilson

I think they are both pretty funny, entertainment value... Scott Kilmer hates GM much more than Tesla, haha! He has obviously some valid points, but it is more for entertainment. Bob, you need to relax a bit, you think anyone bashing Tesla whether valid or not are the devil... I think Elon Musk is the devil because he does exactly what the bible warns us about when it comes to false prophets. He says one thing, but does something completely different. Environmentalists do not commute in a Gulfstream G650, or own 5 homes in the same general area.

 

[bwilson4web]

I think they are both pretty funny, entertainment value... Scott Kilmer hates GM much more than Tesla, haha! He has obviously some valid points, but it is more for entertainment. Bob, you need to relax a bit, you think anyone bashing Tesla whether valid or not are the devil...

False critics do not help when investigating and resolving problems which is what I do. Shouting stream of consciousness b*llsh*t ". . . is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing." That is why their angst carries no weight.

I think Elon Musk is the devil because he does exactly what the bible warns us about when it comes to false prophets. He says one thing, but does something completely different. Environmentalists do not commute in a Gulfstream G650, or own 5 homes in the same general area.

Exodus 20:17 (KJV) "Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ***, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's."​

One tell is John Cadogan and Scott Kilmer shout their false claims . . . as if volume makes them true. Elon Musk haters, like Cadogan and Kilmer, are easily tuned out. But repetition, like propaganda, doesn't work either as a decade of Tesla 'financial analysis' has proved:

“The reports of my death are greatly exaggerated.” - Mark Twain​

Bob Wilson

 

[David Green]

False critics do not help when investigating and resolving problems which is what I do. Shouting stream of consciousness b*llsh*t ". . . is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing." That is why false angst carries no weight.

Exodus 20:17 (KJV) "Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ***, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's."​

One tell is John Cadogan and Scott Kilmer shout their false claims . . . as if volume makes them true. Elon Musk haters, like Cadogan and Kilmer, are easily tuned out. Repetition doesn't work either as a decade of Tesla 'financial analysis' has proved:

“The reports of my death are greatly exaggerated.” - Mark Twain​

Bob Wilson

Haha! Simmer Down Bob, calling people idiots because they do not like something you like it not mature. I am guessing Scotty Kilmer has forgotten more about cars technically than you will ever know, having been a mechanic for his career, and some of the the things he says are completely true, others just for shock and awe to lead to followers and views. He hates all three cars I own, does not bother me, I laugh when he rants, because he is just trying to make a living from you tube after a career as a mechanic. More troubling is people like you that babble on and on about how good Tesla is when you really have very little experience in most things you talk about, or in depth knowledge about the competing models. You should watch the E-Tron video you posted earlier today when Sean Mitchell clearly says over anxious Tesla fans are doing themselves a disservice to talk about the E-Tron without driving it and appreciating how good it really is.

Anyway, Tesla's financials are terrible, and about to get worse, what is your sales prediction for August? Q3?

 

[bwilson4web]

. . . I am guessing Scotty Kilmer has forgotten more about cars . . . You should watch the E-Tron video you posted . . .

We can agree he has forgotten a lot. Actually, never learned what he should have studied in school. BTW, rage makes for a poor post as I thought you'd like the review.

Anyway, Tesla's financials are terrible, and about to get worse, what is your sales prediction for August? Q3?

I predict in five weeks we'll know the production and sales numbers. We'll have the financials by the first week in November.

Bob Wilson

 

[David Green]

We can agree he has forgotten a lot. Actually, never learned what he should have studied in school. BTW, rage makes for a poor post as I thought you'd like the review.

I predict in five weeks we'll know the production and sales numbers. We'll have the financials by the first week in November.

Bob Wilson

How much more do you figure your stock will drop between now and then? I think Q3 will have lower deliveries than Q2, and far lower revenue than then the same Qtr in 2018, no wonder Tesl is trying to sell insurance and FSD, trying to shore up the revenue numbers.

I did like Sean's E-Tron review, although he did come at it from a Tesla centric viewpoint. His comment on regen I do not agree with, as I prefer the Audi system where you can "glide" but did find it strange at first (coming from other EV's), and had to get used to it. 1 pedal driving is just less efficient for the average driver, Audi tested this and developed a much more high tech, smoother solution. Tesla would do this too if they had the tech, but brake by wire is not something Tesla can figure out so far...

I liked that he showed E-Tron charging at 150kW even at 65% SOC, how many Tesla's do that?

 

[bwilson4web]

How much more do you figure your stock will drop between now and then? I think Q3 will have lower deliveries than Q2, and far lower revenue than then the same Qtr in 2018, no wonder Tesl is trying to sell insurance and FSD, trying to shore up the revenue numbers.

With a full line of vehicle models in production and advanced dry-electrolyte batteries, Tesla stock will be over $400/share by 2025. Continued production and design improvements, over $500/share by 2030.

I did like Sean's E-Tron review, although he did come at it from a Tesla centric viewpoint. His comment on regen I do not agree with, as I prefer the Audi system where you can "glide" but did find it strange at first (coming from other EV's), and had to get used to it.

In 2005-09, the Prius had similar issues with the hyper-driving advocates. So I did some benchmarks to measure their claims:

Sure enough, on an isolate road with no other traffic, Pulse and Glide did improve mileage. But I had to develop a reproducible Pulse and Glide:

It was totally impractical in traffic. However, I did use the old manual transmission technique of shifting to "N" when practical. The Prius synthetic 'creep' was a total waste of energy.

1 pedal driving is just less efficient for the average driver, Audi tested this and developed a much more high tech, smoother solution. Tesla would do this too if they had the tech, but brake by wire is not something Tesla can figure out so far...

I found driving on cruise control in the Prius, BMW i3-REx, and Tesla to be the most efficient way to drive. It is consistent and predictable. A better strategy from my Prius days being to find camouflage in traffic 'stuck behind a truck.' The slower speed pays consistent dividends. This is not drafting as we don't drive through the 'burble'. Regardless, I only use it for maximum range segments in the Tesla.

I liked that he showed E-Tron charging at 150kW even at 65% SOC, how many Tesla's do that?

Since you asked, the Tesla and e-tron have different charging curves:

In contrast, our Std. Rng. Plus Model 3, after a software update:

My Tesla has a higher charge rate than the e-tron until ~12.5 minutes. When we combine the curves we find:

My Tesla gets range faster than the e-tron which not achieve parity until 35 minutes. Since I'm into the fastest block-to-block time, my Tesla front loaded charge using 20 minute charge sessions works best.

I didn't share these curves here because there are better, more technically astute forums.

Bob Wilson

 

[David Green]

With a full line of vehicle models in production and advanced dry-electrolyte batteries, Tesla stock will be over $400/share by 2025. Continued production and design improvements, over $500/share by 2030.

In 2005-09, the Prius had similar issues with the hyper-driving advocates. So I did some benchmarks to measure their claims:

Sure enough, on an isolate road with no other traffic, Pulse and Glide did improve mileage. But I had to develop a reproducible Pulse and Glide:

It was totally impractical in traffic. However, I did use the old manual transmission technique of shifting to "N" when practical. The Prius synthetic 'creep' was a total waste of energy.


I found driving on cruise control in the Prius, BMW i3-REx, and Tesla to be the most efficient way to drive. It is consistent and predictable. A better strategy from my Prius days being to find camouflage in traffic 'stuck behind a truck.' The slower speed pays consistent dividends. This is not drafting as we don't drive through the 'burble'. Regardless, I only use it for maximum range segments in the Tesla.

Since you asked, the Tesla and e-tron have different charging curves:

In contrast, our Std. Rng. Plus Model 3, after a software update:

My Tesla has a higher charge rate than the e-tron until ~12.5 minutes. When we combine the curves we find:

My Tesla gets range faster than the e-tron which not achieve parity until 35 minutes. Since I'm into the fastest block-to-block time, my Tesla front loaded charge using 20 minute charge sessions works best.

I didn't share these curves here because there are better, more technically astute forums.

Bob Wilson

 

[David Green]

With a full line of vehicle models in production and advanced dry-electrolyte batteries, Tesla stock will be over $400/share by 2025. Continued production and design improvements, over $500/share by 2030.

In 2005-09, the Prius had similar issues with the hyper-driving advocates. So I did some benchmarks to measure their claims:

Sure enough, on an isolate road with no other traffic, Pulse and Glide did improve mileage. But I had to develop a reproducible Pulse and Glide:

It was totally impractical in traffic. However, I did use the old manual transmission technique of shifting to "N" when practical. The Prius synthetic 'creep' was a total waste of energy.


I found driving on cruise control in the Prius, BMW i3-REx, and Tesla to be the most efficient way to drive. It is consistent and predictable. A better strategy from my Prius days being to find camouflage in traffic 'stuck behind a truck.' The slower speed pays consistent dividends. This is not drafting as we don't drive through the 'burble'. Regardless, I only use it for maximum range segments in the Tesla.

Since you asked, the Tesla and e-tron have different charging curves:

In contrast, our Std. Rng. Plus Model 3, after a software update:

My Tesla has a higher charge rate than the e-tron until ~12.5 minutes. When we combine the curves we find:

My Tesla gets range faster than the e-tron which not achieve parity until 35 minutes. Since I'm into the fastest block-to-block time, my Tesla front loaded charge using 20 minute charge sessions works best.

I didn't share these curves here because there are better, more technically astute forums.

Bob Wilson

Your charts have lots of BS data points... because I was curious we took a quick trip to Portland Yesterday (for ice cream), 198 miles, at the speed limit plus 5mph, 65-75 mph, a/c on ECO both front seats ventilation on 1. 292 Wh/Mi which is my first drive that starts with a 2, although last weekend over the mountains I got close averaging 304 Wh/Mi. When we left the car was showing 237 miles of range at 99% SOC, when we arrived Portland we showed 29% SOC remaining and 65 miles remaining, My original plan was to charge in Portland before heading back, but at nearly 30% remaining I decided to push onward, and try for Kelso Electrify America station. We made it with 18 miles remaining range, and 7% SOC (247 miles travelled), we were getting low battery warnings for the last 10 miles which made my wife nervous. Plugging into Electrify America we immediately got 135 kW which ramped quickly over 140 kW then to 154 kWh peak at 64% SOC and we spent 32 minutes charging, adding 70 kWh, and departed at 90% SOC with 232 miles range showing. Our total off highway time was 46:28 (yes I timed it from the time I started to slow, until we were back at the speed limit) On the way home our consumption was slightly higher at 301 wh/Mi, total trip average all highway driving 295 wh/mi, our new family record. At 295 wh/mi I am starting to believe some of the online folks who say their E-Tron went 260-280 miles on a charge. I now think 250 miles is relatively easy in near perfect conditions all freeway 65 to 75 mph. When you visit Seattle lets get together and see whose car goes further, and charges faster, it will be fun to see in the real world.... I would hope your economy car with rather limited capabilities would blow my much larger, taller, AWD, and luxurious car out of the water for range, but I am starting to think it is less and less likely. Would be fun to conduct some testing to see. I also now want to take off my 265/21" tires and wheels and put on some pizza cutter tires and aero wheels (like your car has) on the E-Tron to see if it makes much difference? my guess is that alone makes a pretty large difference.

 

[bwilson4web]

Your charts have lots of BS data points... because I was curious we took a quick trip to Portland Yesterday (for ice cream),

• 198 miles, at the speed limit plus 5mph, 65-75 mph, a/c on ECO both front seats ventilation on 1. 292 Wh/Mi which is my first drive that starts with a 2,
  • although last weekend over the mountains I got close averaging 304 Wh/Mi.
• When we left the car was showing 237 miles of range at 99% SOC, when we arrived Portland we showed 29% SOC remaining and 65 miles remaining, My original plan was to charge in Portland before heading back, but at nearly 30% remaining I decided to push onward, and try for
• Kelso Electrify America station. We made it with 18 miles remaining range, and 7% SOC (247 miles travelled), we were getting low battery warnings for the last 10 miles which made my wife nervous.
• Plugging into Electrify America we immediately got 135 kW which ramped quickly over 140 kW then to 154 kWh peak at 64% SOC and we spent 32 minutes charging, adding 70 kWh, and departed at 90% SOC with 232 miles range showing.
• Our total off highway time was 46:28 (yes I timed it from the time I started to slow, until we were back at the speed limit)
• On the way home our consumption was slightly higher at 301 wh/Mi, total trip average all highway driving 295 wh/mi, our new family record.
• At 295 wh/mi I am starting to believe some of the online folks who say their E-Tron went 260-280 miles on a charge.
• I now think 250 miles is relatively easy in near perfect conditions all freeway 65 to 75 mph.

Your trip log would make more sense if we also had the altitude changes. If you could enter the route in Google Earth, we could also see the altitude changes that have a significant effect on EV efficiency but Google Earth is a bear to use. Worse, I have to do each segment independently.

I appreciate the offer and will let you know when we get on the road:

When you visit Seattle lets get together and see whose car goes further, and charges faster, it will be fun to see in the real world.... I would hope your economy car with rather limited capabilities would blow my much larger, taller, AWD, and luxurious car out of the water for range, but I am starting to think it is less and less likely. Would be fun to conduct some testing to see. ​

Sounds like a good experiment. Hopefully you've got a standard route to run before and after the change:

I also now want to take off my 265/21" tires and wheels and put on some pizza cutter tires and aero wheels (like your car has) on the E-Tron to see if it makes much difference? my guess is that alone makes a pretty large difference.​

As my Marine drill instructor once said, "A grain of observation outweighs 10 lbs of 'bolvine fecal matter' any day."

Bob Wilson

 

[David Green]

• 198 miles, at the speed limit plus 5mph, 65-75 mph, a/c on ECO both front seats ventilation on 1. 292 Wh/Mi which is my first drive that starts with a 2,
  • although last weekend over the mountains I got close averaging 304 Wh/Mi.
• When we left the car was showing 237 miles of range at 99% SOC, when we arrived Portland we showed 29% SOC remaining and 65 miles remaining, My original plan was to charge in Portland before heading back, but at nearly 30% remaining I decided to push onward, and try for
• Kelso Electrify America station. We made it with 18 miles remaining range, and 7% SOC (247 miles travelled), we were getting low battery warnings for the last 10 miles which made my wife nervous.
• Plugging into Electrify America we immediately got 135 kW which ramped quickly over 140 kW then to 154 kWh peak at 64% SOC and we spent 32 minutes charging, adding 70 kWh, and departed at 90% SOC with 232 miles range showing.
• Our total off highway time was 46:28 (yes I timed it from the time I started to slow, until we were back at the speed limit)
• On the way home our consumption was slightly higher at 301 wh/Mi, total trip average all highway driving 295 wh/mi, our new family record.
• At 295 wh/mi I am starting to believe some of the online folks who say their E-Tron went 260-280 miles on a charge.
• I now think 250 miles is relatively easy in near perfect conditions all freeway 65 to 75 mph.

Your trip log would make more sense if we also had the altitude changes. If you could enter the route in Google Earth, we could also see the altitude changes that have a significant effect on EV efficiency but Google Earth is a bear to use. Worse, I have to do each segment independently.

I appreciate the offer and will let you know when we get on the road:

When you visit Seattle lets get together and see whose car goes further, and charges faster, it will be fun to see in the real world.... I would hope your economy car with rather limited capabilities would blow my much larger, taller, AWD, and luxurious car out of the water for range, but I am starting to think it is less and less likely. Would be fun to conduct some testing to see. ​

Sounds like a good experiment. Hopefully you've got a standard route to run before and after the change:

I also now want to take off my 265/21" tires and wheels and put on some pizza cutter tires and aero wheels (like your car has) on the E-Tron to see if it makes much difference? my guess is that alone makes a pretty large difference.​

As my Marine drill instructor once said, "A grain of observation outweighs 10 lbs of 'bolvine fecal matter' any day."

Bob Wilson

There is less than 100 feel elevation difference between where I live and Portland, there are a few small hills on the way, but I do not think anywhere on the route is more then 250 feet above Sea Level, I-5 S from Seattle is a good ECO route...

 

[bwilson4web]

I can recommend an iPhone app, Speedometer, that has the ability to record a GPS log that can be loaded into Google Earth. This records location, altitude, and velocity without human intervention. It won't record a charging session but the iPhone has an excellent 'time lapse' recording function. Just use a tripod to record the charging session and share the machine recorded data.

Bob Wilson