Tapping or Creaking Noise when coasting at low speed

[bubzki]

Given this problem is somewhat rare, I speculate the problem is due to an assembly problem (either in the motor or in how it mates to the car) rather than a problem with the motor design (though arguably a good design would not need finicky installation positioning!).

Man, I hope you're right but fear you're not. If it were an assembly problem why did they supersede the 711? I think there's an inherent design flaw in the whole assembly and Kia's trying to beef certain aspects incrementally in hopes of finding a fix on the fly, all the while burning their customers by shunning the TSB.

 

[David T in Silicon Valley]

If it were an assembly problem why did they supersede the 711?

Did they? As far as I know all new Niros coming off the lot today have 710s. This is part of why I think it is not a motor problem but a mechanical interface problem. This problem has been addressed with motor replacements, almost always a 711, for at least 18 months. If switching to a 711 on the assembly line would avoid this problem, they would save themselves a lot of money and also help reputation by making this change. The fact that they are NOT using another motor in recently built vehicles means there is a reason.

Also, how come with far more of these vehicles being sold now than in 2019 we are not seeing a flood of new folks with this problem coming into this forum. It seems the likelihood of the problem is much reduced now.

So why use the 711 when a replacement is needed? It could have mechanical features that make it more eaisly (o precisely) installed into an already built vehicle. Doing this sort of work on a lift in a shop could be intrinsically different than on an assembly line without body panels and goodness knows what else installed already.

 

[jayc1358]

So why use the 711 when a replacement is needed?

My replacement motor is a 712. So they must have decided that there was a need for another revision of the 711.

 

[bubzki]

Also, how come with far more of these vehicles being sold now than in 2019 we are not seeing a flood of new folks with this problem coming into this forum. It seems the likelihood of the problem is much reduced now.

My speculation is that many Niro EV buyers are either 1. driving these very gently (and thus aren't stressing the components) and/or 2. aren't as familiar with BEVs and motor sounds as they might be a first EV foray and may not think it's an "issue" to hear the relatively subtle clicking sounds.

We can only continue to speculate because Hyundai/Kia still playing this very close to the vest.

 

[Hedge]

Do let's say there isn problem with some percentage of the 710, and 711 motors. Now they can do1 or a combination of a few things after they figure out what the particular issue. 1. Scrap all motors and components to make those motors. 2. Scrap all built motor and correct production for future motors. 3. Test all currently built motors and scrape those that fail do second part of number 2. . Use all currently produced motors correct new production of motor, replace motors as customers complain.

Which one of these is the cheapest is likely number 4 for a significant range of faulty motors. Probably close to 50% failure rate. I don't think it is anywhere near that rate.

 

[Shawn X]

My speculation is that many Niro EV buyers are either 1. driving these very gently (and thus aren't stressing the components) and/or 2. aren't as familiar with BEVs and motor sounds as they might be a first EV foray and may not think it's an "issue" to hear the relatively subtle clicking sounds.

We can only continue to speculate because Hyundai/Kia still playing this very close to the vest.

My dad doesn't hear the sound probably because he usually drives an old, noisy ICE car. I thought my Niro EV was loud due to this issue, but it's nothing compared to an older ICE car.

 

[David T in Silicon Valley]

My speculation is that many Niro EV buyers are either 1. driving these very gently (and thus aren't stressing the components) and/or

I have wondered about this myself. I am pretty careful with mine, only rarely hitting the accelerator hard* and wondered if maybe that is what increases the odds of the dreaded clicking. I still think it seems rare enough (although still too common) that some cars simply will never have this problem.

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*Usually at a traffic light when I can tell some ICE muscle car wants to show off. I figure leaving them in the dust will get them thinking about the advantages of vehicles that don't burn dinosaurs. Then there are a few death merges on US-101 where the ramp is just Way Too Short.

 

[daveinca]

I have wondered about this myself. I am pretty careful with mine, only rarely hitting the accelerator hard* and wondered if maybe that is what increases the odds of the dreaded clicking. I still think it seems rare enough (although still too common) that some cars simply will never have this problem.

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I probably would have agreed with you, but I noticed the clicking the second I drove the car off the lot. And it definitely was not present in the one that I test drove before purchasing. And, I'm also pretty easy on mine.

 

[Esprit1st]

I probably would have agreed with you, but I noticed the clicking the second I drove the car off the lot. And it definitely was not present in the one that I test drove before purchasing. And, I'm also pretty easy on mine.

How many miles did it have on it when you bought it? I'm sure some test drives push the accelerator hard.

 

[onthewater]

I'm looking at buying a new 2020 Kia Niro EX EV. These have obviously been sitting on the lot awhile. Has this problem been solved in those models, or how can I tell if it has the right motor?

 

[Greg Elmassian]

post #39 or post #291

 

[David T in Silicon Valley]

I'm looking at buying a new 2020 Kia Niro EX EV. These have obviously been sitting on the lot awhile. Has this problem been solved in those models, or how can I tell if it has the right motor?

Hah! Post 39 is a shot of my motor, which is the original OEM and still working fine about 8K miles in (slow driving year cuz pandemic.) Given the drop off in frequency of complaints in this thread and simultaneously increased unit sales (current US inventories imply about 750-800 are selling per month in the US) it seems to have become less frequent, and I believe it was already rare. You financial risk is very small with the 10 year/100k miles powertrain warranty, though the convenience risk (and there is some cost associated with that) while you get a problem resolved is larger.

I have not seen ANY hard data statistics on how often these repairs have been needed, but given how many Niro owners there are in the Niro forums and how many complained on this thread, even at its worst this was in the ballpark of 5-10% of vehicles. Whether that increases as vehicles age is anyone's guess...

 

[EVDog]

I think the big question is, is there a fix that FIXES THE PROBLEM?? Does the 712 version motor solve the problem? My worry is Kia will keep replacing motors (for free, under warranty) until warranty expires at 100k miles. Then we are screwed.


Sent from my iPhone using Inside EVs

 

[onthewater]

Has anyone here had their reduction drive and motor replaced in the Seattle area?

@Bahrieinn did you get your motor replaced and what dealer did it for you? I also live in the Seattle area and I'm looking at a 2020 Niro EV but spooked about this motor issue. Kia of Everett service dept says they've heard of it but never had to replace one. Salesman said they have E712s but when I inspected the showroom model I found it was an E710. It was manufactured 12/2020.

 

[David T in Silicon Valley]

There are many people here who had their motor replaced quite a long while ago, and I have not heard of anyone claiming a repeat thousands of miles later.

I think all that is in question is is this a part problem or a motor to car assembly and integration problem.

 

[Hedge]

There are many people here who had their motor replaced quite a long while ago, and I have not heard of anyone claiming a repeat thousands of miles later.

I think all that is in question is is this a part problem or a motor to car assembly and integration problem.

I have a repeat of these soun, already passed lemon criteria. Waiting for confirmation that my 711 will be replaced with a 712. Not doing it until that time

 

[ITown]

I'm 1.5 years into my car ownership experience w/ about 6000 miles on the odometer now. So far, no issues here. Car still drives like it was when brand new. Only difference between when I bought it and now is a wheel has curb rash and the front of the car has some cosmetic damage thanks to some guy doing a terrible job of parallel parking.

 

[Paul Harnden]

On the water: glad to see someone close by is asking around. I live in the San Juans with a Niro EV and the clicking has started recently with only 6k on my 2019 model. The pandemic all but stopped driving this thing around this past year, but the clicking was a concern as is the growing community forums consistently pointing this out online.
I recently took my Niro in for the 7k service and 6k tire rotation and to point out the clicking issue at the Burlington Dealership where I bought it. Unfortunately on the drive over the clicking became intermittent and after dropping the vehicle off the techs rotated the tires and did a slight brake adjustment before having me drive around with a tech in the car to point out the noise. Can't explain it, but it completely went away at this time-just my luck, haha.
They seemed genuinely concerned but played it very close to the vest and gave me the impression that they haven't dealt with this issue yet, which I'm willing to give them considering they took the time out of their busy day to have me attempt to show them the issue.
Back on the island and the clicking is starting to creep back. Seems to be getting slightly louder and louder at low speeds each time I take it out, but it is also intermittent and I don't want to risk another ferry trip over and have the issue hide again.
At this point with the warranty I'm going to attempt to drive this motor to literally wear itself out to the point I either have to tow it in or the clicking becomes so loud and consistent that it can't be missed. It's an annoyance, especially at such low mileage, but I can enjoy listening the radio at a reasonable volume in the meantime.

 

[bubzki]

I'm turning in my lemoned 2019 Niro EV today in Minnesota, so if anyone's in the market for a gray 2019 car with 711 (no recurrence yet) this should be a solid buy.

It's all a shame because this really is a good car if not for this design flaw (and apocalyptically bad customer service from corporate).

If anyone is looking for Niro EV Tuxmats (front and rear), Weathertech cargo liner, or roof rack bars please send me a DM. I may ship if I don't find a local buyer.

 

[blue_door]

I'm turning in my lemoned 2019 Niro EV today in Minnesota, so if anyone's in the market for a gray 2019 car with 711 (no recurrence yet) this should be a solid buy.

It's all a shame because this really is a good car if not for this design flaw (and apocalyptically bad customer service from corporate).

If anyone is looking for Niro EV Tuxmats (front and rear), Weathertech cargo liner, or roof rack bars please send me a DM. I may ship if I don't find a local buyer.

Lemon cars are sold at auction and eventually filter their way back to car lots. Hopefully the title will be branded as lemon so the purchaser knows it, but not all states make this distinction.