Very positive Clarity review by cars.com:
https://www.cars.com/articles/2019-...view-a-rare-winner-of-its-kind-1420758010673/
https://www.cars.com/articles/2019-...view-a-rare-winner-of-its-kind-1420758010673/
Review by Cars.com
- Thread starter RickSE
- Start date
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Rajiv Vaidyanathan
Active Member
I'm always amazed at some quote during almost every review that seems to be incorrect. But, maybe I just have a weird Clarity. Early in the review, it says, "In addition to a Sport mode, which runs the engine much of the time, ..."
I used to run almost exclusively on Sport mode and never had the engine run unless I was out of EV power. Is there something wrong with my Clarity?
Mowcowbell
Well-Known Member
Very well written, and the writer did seem to hit on all the good points and not so good points of the Clarity PHEV.
Rajiv, your Clarity operates just like mine in Sport mode. I can get the ICE to run if I push the accelerator pedal very far.
Rajiv, your Clarity operates just like mine in Sport mode. I can get the ICE to run if I push the accelerator pedal very far.
The ICE starts earlier in the travel of the accelerator pedal in SPORT Mode. So if you aren't activating your ICE in SPORT Mode, then you are just not pressing the accelerator pedal very far.
KentuckyKen
Well-Known Member
So I will now review the review by Mr. Wiesenfelder. He did a much better job of neutrally pointing out the Clarity’s good and bad points than most reviews we’ve seen but still includes several incorrect pieces of information. I don’t mean to be harsh, but if you’re an Executive Editor, I can live with any of your opinions and musings, but I expect you to get the facts straight! I can even live with reviews that hate the Clarity as long as they don’t misrepresent the facts.
So here are three areas where I take Mr. Wiesenfelder to task:
1. “In addition to a Sport mode, which runs the engine much of the time,...”
As @Rajiv Vaidyanathan humorously pointed out in his post, SPORT Mode does not mean the engine runs most of the time. Even for the unwashed masses who just get in the Clarity without reading the manual, SPORT Mode will not run the engine “most of the time” as @insightman points out.
2. “One plus to driving electric-only is that acceleration feels linear and consistent, which is not the case in most gas-electric hybrids when the two types of motors are working together (including the Clarity once the battery charge is depleted or if you select Sport or HV mode). To be fair, with the exception of the Volt, I've never experienced a gas-electric hybrid with notably high mileage that didn't feel at least a little wonky when accelerating.”...
“Apparently, if you want two-motor efficiency, some amount of acceleration awkwardness will come along for the ride.”
I’ve never felt any “awkwardness” in acceleration in the few times I tried SPORT Mode nor in HV Mode on several long highway trips. I push the go pedal and I smoothly accelerate to whatever speed I want just like in my previous gas mobiles. In fact even with a depleted battery, I got smooth and normal acceleration but that was on rolling hills, speeds under 65, and no passengers. Since there are some conditions (high speed, high incline, high loads, and/or high altitude) where that may not always be the case, I’ll grant him one out of three as being accurate. But that’s still two wrong.
3. “Unfortunately, there's some braking awkwardness in the Clarity, too, but numb, vaguely disconnected brake-pedal feel is common among hybrids and electric vehicles, both of which employ regenerative braking.”
(Although he does admit the Clarity is above average for pedal feel in regenerative braking)
Really! Really? IMHO, it’s more accurate to say the Clarity’s braking and blend of regen is best in class despite the fact that Honda engineered the regen to be more efficient than any other PHEV. I offer as proof the fact that in the forum we argue over whether paddle deceleration gives more regen than the pedal for the very reason that the blend is so seamless we can’t even tell when the friction brakes cut in! Also, Honda did a superb job engineering brake pedal feed back that feels just like regular hydraulic brakes. I can’t tell any difference from any of my old vacuum assisted hydraulic gas mobile brakes. Can anyone, or is my Clarity just blessed with perfect brakes? I dare anybody to offer up a PHEV that has brakes as smooth as the Clarity.
In summary, it could be a very good review if you correct what I consider his 3 inaccurate statements.
Just once, just once, I’d like to read a review of the Clarity that got the facts straight. But this one at least gets us closer. Sigh...
So here are three areas where I take Mr. Wiesenfelder to task:
1. “In addition to a Sport mode, which runs the engine much of the time,...”
As @Rajiv Vaidyanathan humorously pointed out in his post, SPORT Mode does not mean the engine runs most of the time. Even for the unwashed masses who just get in the Clarity without reading the manual, SPORT Mode will not run the engine “most of the time” as @insightman points out.
2. “One plus to driving electric-only is that acceleration feels linear and consistent, which is not the case in most gas-electric hybrids when the two types of motors are working together (including the Clarity once the battery charge is depleted or if you select Sport or HV mode). To be fair, with the exception of the Volt, I've never experienced a gas-electric hybrid with notably high mileage that didn't feel at least a little wonky when accelerating.”...
“Apparently, if you want two-motor efficiency, some amount of acceleration awkwardness will come along for the ride.”
I’ve never felt any “awkwardness” in acceleration in the few times I tried SPORT Mode nor in HV Mode on several long highway trips. I push the go pedal and I smoothly accelerate to whatever speed I want just like in my previous gas mobiles. In fact even with a depleted battery, I got smooth and normal acceleration but that was on rolling hills, speeds under 65, and no passengers. Since there are some conditions (high speed, high incline, high loads, and/or high altitude) where that may not always be the case, I’ll grant him one out of three as being accurate. But that’s still two wrong.
3. “Unfortunately, there's some braking awkwardness in the Clarity, too, but numb, vaguely disconnected brake-pedal feel is common among hybrids and electric vehicles, both of which employ regenerative braking.”
(Although he does admit the Clarity is above average for pedal feel in regenerative braking)
Really! Really? IMHO, it’s more accurate to say the Clarity’s braking and blend of regen is best in class despite the fact that Honda engineered the regen to be more efficient than any other PHEV. I offer as proof the fact that in the forum we argue over whether paddle deceleration gives more regen than the pedal for the very reason that the blend is so seamless we can’t even tell when the friction brakes cut in! Also, Honda did a superb job engineering brake pedal feed back that feels just like regular hydraulic brakes. I can’t tell any difference from any of my old vacuum assisted hydraulic gas mobile brakes. Can anyone, or is my Clarity just blessed with perfect brakes? I dare anybody to offer up a PHEV that has brakes as smooth as the Clarity.
In summary, it could be a very good review if you correct what I consider his 3 inaccurate statements.
Just once, just once, I’d like to read a review of the Clarity that got the facts straight. But this one at least gets us closer. Sigh...
coutinpe
Active Member
Maybe it's a learning curve... BTW, thank you for illustrating this absolute automotive ignoramus here, I didn't even have idea my Clarity's brakes were in any way different from my previous cars!
This car is so different from the norm it’s not surprising that there are going to be errors. I don’t agree at all about their points in the engine awkwardness or brakes. However, if I start in sport mode 9 out of 10 times if I go over 40 mph the ICE will go on. It takes me too much focus to accelerate and still stay in the blue area.
Fast Eddie B
Well-Known Member
That’s is so weird. Not my experience at all. We do lots of local drives, including some Interstate up to 70 mph, and as long as there’s battery left the engine virtually never stirs from slumber. Unless I floor it, which I don’t think I’ve done more than a handful of times in 10,000 miles.
Can it be a difference in cars, maybe due to which SB’s have been accomplished? I drive with a light foot, but nothing extreme.
Your POWER/CHARGE Gauge shows you how close you are to activating the ICE. It appears that the Clarity's accelerator pedal mapping in SPORT Mode suits your driving style and you get up to the speed you want to be driving without pressing very far. It doesn't take much "flooring" to activate the ICE in SPORT Mode, but that gauge can answer the question, "Am I a super light-foot?"
which means if you drive around town in Sport mode, which makes for a much more enjoyable, you will not turn on ICE, which is my experience. So go for it. I have had it go on in Sport mode when I enter a highway which is exactly what it is made for.
Robert_Alabama
Well-Known Member
I'm just glad the reviewer got it mostly right. The biggest revies point to me is that a PHEV with a decent electric range can be a great car, not perfect, but close enough. These cars can mimic EVs as daily drivers with no headache of worrying about charging on trips. In my case, no problem with about 80% of my miles as electric. That cuts my gasoline burn by 4/5 with really just upside (free charging at work, reduced rates at night at home, quiet smooth ride to and from work). My next car will almost definitely be a midsize SUV Phev to replace a 2002 Tahoe unless there just isn't one available that we want. I am really hopeful for the Pilot release. I wish the future of the PHEV segment (at least 3 or 4 years out) was getting more love.
I think I just have a lead foot!
MNSteve
Well-Known Member
Generally, I don't. The only times I have triggered the ICE by stomping on the gas was when I pulled out in front of another vehicle and brain said, "Hey! That guy is going faster than I thought! Stomp on it!". Then decades of habit kick in and I floor it, when this reaction is really overkill.
BTW, on the topic of the cars.com review, others have pointed out factual errors, but the one that jumped out at me was when he said that HV-Charge brings the charge level back to 100%.
Its not hard with sport mode
, its more like 40% pushed down vs 70% on normal or 90% (click point) on Econ.I prefer sport mode now and end up using the ICE since I drive mostly highway anyway and elec and gas prices are similar, so its fun to have the extra acceleration
. Would be nice to have it remember though, or swap back to econ mode instead of normal when turning it off in sport mode.But yeah, stay in the blue = EV only, hit that white = ICE time!
Also it will show as white for a longer time than it pulls from gas, I use the info car view and while the main gauge will show as full white the car will still use mostly EV while in sport mode unless you are flooring it.
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Cars.com one-upper themselves by naming the Clarity their Eco-friendly car of the year. I wonder if Honda will spend $200 to advertise that?
https://www.cars.com/articles/2019-...57703150/?aff=acqem111&emc=acqem111&smtrctid=
https://www.cars.com/articles/2019-...57703150/?aff=acqem111&emc=acqem111&smtrctid=
Quoting KKen, quoting Joe Wiesenfelder
This seems to imply two motors are inherently more efficient than one. I disagree. There is much more variation in how the single or double motors are manufactured than any variation attributable to a dual motor mechanical setup. In addition, the typical dual motor approach has two planetary gear systems to drive. Honda chose simplicity over sophisticated variable summing gear ratios. As a result, there are (almost certainly) fewer mechanical friction losses in the drive train. Also note that EPA rated the Volt and the Clarity both at 31 kWh / 100 miles electric drive, despite the Clarity's being 230 lbs (6%) heavier. Seems like simple single motor driving the wheels is more efficient?
This seems to imply two motors are inherently more efficient than one. I disagree. There is much more variation in how the single or double motors are manufactured than any variation attributable to a dual motor mechanical setup. In addition, the typical dual motor approach has two planetary gear systems to drive. Honda chose simplicity over sophisticated variable summing gear ratios. As a result, there are (almost certainly) fewer mechanical friction losses in the drive train. Also note that EPA rated the Volt and the Clarity both at 31 kWh / 100 miles electric drive, despite the Clarity's being 230 lbs (6%) heavier. Seems like simple single motor driving the wheels is more efficient?