Does cheap EV-2 charger less efficient than more expensive name brands?

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Space Cadet

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What kind of charger do you use, and do you get consistently high 40s to low 50 miles on a full charge?
I have two Clarities in my garage, one with Siemens EV-2 level charger that cost like $600, and another with a cheap $199 no name brand. For some reason, the cheap charger provides consistently low 40 miles range when fully charged, compared to the Siemens charger that provides high 40s to low 50 miles on a full charge. both says 100% charged. when I swap the charger, the same results, which seems to suggest the cheaper charger is just not as efficient.
Same garage, so external temperature is the same.

what is your experience? anybody get high miles per charge with el cheapo EV-2 charger? should it make any difference?
 
I'd have bet it would make no difference. If the car says it is 100% charged, then I would have said it didn't matter which charger was used, you would have gotten to the same EV miles on the display after the charge. Could there be anything else at play here? Remember that the miles on the display after a charge are very much a function of how the car was driven on the last charge cycle. Could it just be variability in the driving that is making this seem like this difference is happening and due to what charger is used?
 
It's possible the charger has a controller which is incapable of adjusting the amperage output to what the car requests, so when the car says "I'm 90% charged, you need to reduce output so you don't start a fire", the cheap charger just shuts off because it can't provide the correct amperage. But I thought the car controlled amperage draw and the EVSE just sets a high limit, so...
 
I use the Cheapo chargers at work and at home, and I get terrible mileage: I have always attributed it to using the heater too much. I have been reducing my heat use, and mileage is increasing to high 30's.

I use the name brand chargers at public stations, and see similar mileage estimates.

I thought the high-voltage side of the charger was 'just' a contactor, and would not modify the power, but just turn on and off.

If it was not properly, or fully charged, it seems surprising the car would report 100% charge.
 
This is interesting...........I have a Duosida level 2 charger and I NEVER get more than low 40's. Usually it's high 30's. I always just thought it's because I have a lead foot and my commute is hilly.............
 
I also use the El Cheapo Zencar level 2 from Amazon at home and I get consistently upper 50's (in LA weather). No difference when I charge at Volta charge stations. The only difference I notice is on charge time, El Cheapo charges around 20%/hour, Volta stations arond 25%/hour.
 
Space Cadet said:
What kind of charger do you use, and do you get consistently high 40s to low 50 miles on a full charge?
I have two Clarities in my garage, one with Siemens EV-2 level charger that cost like $600, and another with a cheap $199 no name brand. For some reason, the cheap charger provides consistently low 40 miles range when fully charged, compared to the Siemens charger that provides high 40s to low 50 miles on a full charge. both says 100% charged. when I swap the charger, the same results, which seems to suggest the cheaper charger is just not as efficient.
Same garage, so external temperature is the same.

what is your experience? anybody get high miles per charge with el cheapo EV-2 charger? should it make any difference?
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I would bet it is more the driving habits and less the charger. The "mileage range' is a guess-o-meter based on the previous driving. If, for instance (assuming equal topography and climate), one of your cars run on the freeway on EV mode your next "range estimate" after charging would be consistently less than the other who glides quietly through streets.
 
Since the cord is just there for electrical supply, the car determines when it is full and stops drawing power. Is the Chinese evse getting hot while being used? Wondering if it will cut power if too hot?
 
The less expensive Level 2 charges are typically the 12A-16A models. That would explain the ~5 hour charge time.

The 32A models cost a bit more and should provide a full charge in ~2.5 hours.
 
Could one EVSE be causing more heat in itself or the car’s battery? I really cannot think of too many reasons why the EVSE would make a difference.
 
ClarityBill said:
Are you saying there cannot be a difference between no-name and brand name 'cords', in terms of efficiency, or completion of charge?
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I would think that the efficiency might be different and certainly the safety (not all are ul approved) but the charger in the car would shut off when full UNLESS you have it on a timer. So completing the charge would be the car not the cord.
 
My range is relatively bad and always has been. Living on a steep hill, and using cabin heat seem to be main things for me.
I also have a totally cheap Jakayla charger. Works fine, same as expensive Bosch units, Charge Point, and Clipper Creek I've used.

The specific EVSE uses has had zero impact on range. I will say my cheapo unit was hard to physically attach at first.
 
Dan Albrich said:
I also have a totally cheap Jakayla charger.
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I hope you have better luck with your Jekayla than I had with mine. At just under two years, the car stopped recognizing when it was plugged in. I had the TSB for charger issues applied to the car after the problem started but it made no difference. No other Level 2 EVSE gives any problems. Had to replace it (NOT with another Jekayla) since they only provide a one-year warranty.
 
Greetings,

The "cable" as stated earlier, is NOT the HV battery charger. The "charger" is in the car, part of it, internal... It is the device that takes the connected AC and converts it into DC (from 120/240 volts AC to ~350 volts DC) and controls power input into the HV battery. The car's charger also, through the BMS, manages the battery cell/pack voltage balance and state of charge. The part you are buying is a method of connecting the car to the power source (120/120 Level 1, 208/220-240 for Level 2) and also "communicating" to the car's charger the available power (voltage/current) based on the settings in the cable or base.

Many of these charge stations now have "adjustable" current rates so that you can charge fast when needed, and charge slower when you have time. Within certain very "technical" limitations the slower you charge the better for your battery system. The BMS is better able to manage voltage balance and temperatures at slower charge rates. Now, there is no such thing as a "trickle" charge cord, all max/min parameters are managed by the car's systems.

However, due to consumer demands, the chargers will always try to charge "as fast as possible" up to their maximum wattage. So if you apply a source that can charge the Clarity in 2.5 hours (the maximum) then the car (within thermal limits) will try to do just that. Now if your battery is hot from environmental or you just came off the expressway driving at 90+ for the entire pack, then your charge time - regardless of power available will be more than 2.5 hours as the system has to cool the battery a bit first. Same goes for a really cold battery - has to go slow, or heat it first, regardless of how big and beefy your Level 2 Base "charger" is (fancy name for a digitally controlled relay).

Open source always has lots of good background info:
https://www.openevse.com/

Cheers,

Cash
 
rodeknyt said:
I hope you have better luck with your Jekayla than I had with mine.
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Point well taken. I often don't go the cheap route, and don't generally advise it. I was worried the whole deal would get super expensive. I bought the EVSE before I had the NEMA 14-50 plug, and got some outrageous initial estimates for the electrician to install the plug. I'm like, yep I want level 2 for pre-conditioning but not at any price. As it happened, whole deal was close to $600. About $230 for the electrician (found a reasonable quote), and $370 for the EVSE when I bought it. It since dropped about $100.

In my personal experience I will say that which EVSE I use to charge does not seem to effect range. I do not wish to speak for anyone else, or disparage their experience when different from mine. My work had some high end Bosch chargers and using those vs. home didn't have an effect one way or another. Work then decided to join the ChargePoint network and replaced our chargers (with Chargepoint) and again, no range difference vs. charging at home. And finally, my friend has a high-end clipper creek install, and I've charged at his house. Same range as I get on my home 'cheapo charger.'

I definitely agree that buying a quality EVSE is a good idea. As with many things, you pick the cost/value choice that works for you.
 
Technically, the charger is in the car and what people commonly and erroneously call a charger or charging station is actually an EVSE (Electric Vehicle Supply Equipment). The clarity uses the J1772 standard and is limited to 7 kW.

You may see more reported by your EVSE monitoring App or Killawatt type meter but that’s power from the wall which will be more than what’s going into the battery pack since no charger can be 100% efficient. My ChargePoint EVSE App routinely reports charging at 7.2 kW. Perusing the old Internut and the more learned posters on this forum, estimates for the onboard charger’s efficiency can be argued to be from 92 to 98%.

Here is a good article explaining chargers and EVSEs:
https://www.greencarreports.com/new...nd-why-does-your-electric-car-charger-need-it
 
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KentuckyKen said:
Technically, the charger is in the car and what people commonly and erroneously call a charger or charging station is actually an EVSE (Electric Vehicle Supply Equipment). The clarity uses the J1772 standard and is limited to 7 kW.

You may see more reported by your EVSE monitoring App or Killawatt type meter but that’s power from the wall which will be more than what’s going into the battery pack since no charger can be 100% efficient. My ChargePoint EVSE App routinely reports charging at 7.2 kW. Perusing the old Internut and the more learned posters on this forum, estimates for the onboard charger’s efficiency can be argued to be from 92 to 98%.

Here is a good article explaining chargers and EVSEs:
https://www.greencarreports.com/new...nd-why-does-your-electric-car-charger-need-it
Click to expand...
This is also my experience. I have a cheap Chinese 32A EVSE (Morec) and my SOC ranges from 66 to 30 and I don't think I would do any better with a more expensive name brand EVSE.
 
Speaking of cheap.....I have a one year old Aerovironment Level 1/Level 2 EVSE available. I switched to a EVSE with a variable amperage setting to take better advantage of my solar charging station. This one is now "extra" in my garage. The one I have is even better than the one in the listing below because mine comes with both a 120V 12A 5-15 plug and a 240V 16A 6-20 plug for either level 1 or level 2 charging. BTW, Webasto bought out Aerovironment and is now selling the Turbocord under their name. If interested in making me an offer, send me a private message and I'll respond. This EVSE works great for the Clarity, even as an extra to keep in the trunk for travel.

https://www.amazon.com/TurboCord-24...qid=1584108971&sprefix=Webasto,aps,171&sr=8-6
 
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