Going gas

Discussion in 'Clarity' started by Ken7, Oct 29, 2019.

  1. Ken7

    Ken7 Active Member

    With our Clarity getting about 35 EV miles on a full charge in the cooler weather and electric rates here at about .20/kWh, I think it makes more sense to run the Clarity on gas. In our area we can get gas at $2.35/gallon, so it’s cheaper, with these numbers, to dispense with the charging for now. I think as more people encounter these low gas prices concurrent with high electric costs, more PHEV owners will be doing the same thing. Of course it will be a very geographical thing.

    What you come to realize on longer trips when running on gas, is how small the Clarity’s gas tank is.
     
  2. fotomoto

    fotomoto Active Member

    The beauty of dual fuels. :)

    Our gas is even cheaper (currently $2.09) but our charging is "free". What to do? Oh the conundrum we have!!! ;):D:D

    We taken several long trips (1,000 mile minimums) and I'm a "let's get there ASAP" planner/driver. The range even in very remote west Texas/eastern NM has never been an issue. What I can't imagine is stopping every 160ish miles for a "quick" supercharger top off which is recommended as the fastest method for BEV traveling. Tesla's trip planner typically calculates our drives through these areas for 4-9 hours longer. :confused:

    Another benefit of a 7 gallon tank: super fast 300 mile "recharges". I began actively timing Clarity refueling after reading BEV proponents say a gas stop takes 10-15 minutes. So how long does it typically take? I usually fill up with 2 bars or less and this equates to :45 to :90 secs. Shoot, I've only got 1/2 of the windshield clean by then.:rolleyes:

    Finally, there are many owners for whom the tank is too large for their needs so this is an issue that will never please everyone.
     
  3. neal adkins

    neal adkins Active Member

    I would charge the battery to 100 percent a few times per month because cell balancing is nessacary for battery health and longevity.
     
  4. coutinpe

    coutinpe Member

    That's the good thing about PHEV. You can switch back and forth according to the conditions. Sad that GM wouldn't or couldn't understand that.
     
    Robert_Alabama likes this.
  5. M. Shah

    M. Shah Member

    2013 onwards Volt has a hold option that makes it run the generator on demand.
     
  6. megreyhair

    megreyhair Active Member

    My electric rate is about 16 cents and gas is around $2.4. Using the given range, MPG from Honda, it is actually cheaper for me to run gas as well. Free charger is always welcome! :D
     
    Teslawannabe likes this.
  7. stacey burke

    stacey burke Member

    I have a question, If you have a fully charged battery and run only on HV, how long does the battery stay charged (before it is at 2 bars)?
     
  8. css28

    css28 Active Member

    Please explain this observation

    GM Hold Mode = Honda HV Mode (and for GM the battery charge level was held more rigidly)
    GM Mountain Mode = Honda HV Charge

    GM took care of that entirely, starting in 2013. And there was no chance of inadvertent ICE running outside of those modes.

    GM also gave options for deferring engine maintenance and fuel maintenance ICE sessions and provided kWh and gallons consumed reports.

    In short, GM handled it much better than Honda has, so far.
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2019
  9. LAF

    LAF Active Member

    I am happy to pay a tiny bit more for the pleasure of driving EV until gas prices go up, not to mention reducing carbon emission is worth a few dollars a month.
     
  10. KentuckyKen

    KentuckyKen Well-Known Member

    I took a 500 mile round trip leaving my garage fully charged and with a full tank. I only lost 3 bars SOC and at least twice restarted with forgetting to hit the HV button, so I drove a few miles in EV before going “Duh!” And hitting HV. I also got 50 mpg (49 after accounting for charging back to full).
    Some poster suggested that starting with a not quite full battery might be better and might hold the SOC closer but I haven’t tried that.

    Conditions:
    Lexington KY to Elizabethton TN and back. Driver only, speeds 55 to 75 (kept to speed limits), AC on auto and never went past low fan, dry roads. Had plenty of power, ever on steep hills, and never heard the angry bees. Car cycled through all possible energy flows. After selecting HV, I just let it do its thing. I score this car a 10 out of 10 electrons!
     
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  11. insightman

    insightman Well-Known Member

    For people who resent Honda for not providing a selectable EV-only mode, GM's use-up-battery-then-start-engine scheme is better, but I like the Clarity's blended scheme that can use both engine and battery power simultaneously. The mysterious AI decisions that take place in HV are fascinating and seem to do a good job of maximizing overall efficiency.

    Some on this forum complain that the Clarity's HV AI is making the wrong decisions and some believe that the Clarity works exactly like it's non-plug-in siblings, except that it can go further on battery power, but for Honda's second-take on a plug-in hybrid, I think it's a marvel. It will be interesting to see how Honda's PHEVs evolve (what happened to the Pilot PHEV seen testing in June 2018?). Sadly, the evolution of the Volt has ended as GM has abandoned their excellent pioneering PHEV technology in favor of BEVs.
     
  12. MrFixit

    MrFixit Active Member

    Not to mention the convenience of having the charging station right in the garage !
     
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  13. Electra

    Electra Active Member

    No, it's actually cheaper to charge at 16 cents because a full charge is around 13 kWh, not the whole 16 kWh of the battery. So it costs you about $2.08 to fully charge your battery.
     
  14. MrFixit

    MrFixit Active Member

    Don't "go gas" quite yet! My take on this...
    16 cents is roughly equivalent to $2.23 gas so I agree with @Electra .

    upload_2019-10-30_13-0-15.png
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2019
    Raymondca and Mark W like this.
  15. DucRider

    DucRider Active Member

    A common misconception even among Volt owners. In CS2 mode the main drive motor will provide additional power (driven purely from the batteries) under high demand periods.

    Long term, the cost ($ and space/weight) of carrying two complete drive systems limits the market for PHEV's. The higher cost and lower electric range (both these gaps are increasing steadily) spell the eventual demise of the PHEV.
    That being said, much of the Volt's discontinuation has to do with shuttering the plant where it (and other sedans) were produced. Both GM and Ford changed their product mix to emphasis trucks and SUV's.
     
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  16. insightman

    insightman Well-Known Member

    Thanks for that info. I didn't know the 2nd-gen Volt could do that. When the Volt's ICE and traction motor join up, it's more like the Clarity's Engine Drive mode (where the ICE is connected through fixed-ratio gears to the wheels and assisted by the battery powering the traction motor) than the Clarity's Hybrid Drive mode (a serial hybrid configuration where the ICE drives a generator that joins with the battery to power the traction motor). I wonder if the Volt could have been saved if its platform-mate, the Chevy Cruze, had been continued? GM should have stuck that brilliant Volt drivetrain into one of their myriad crossover platforms.

    I found this very informative diagram (along with diagrams of the gen-2 Volt's other drive modes) on gmvolt.com:

    upload_2019-10-30_18-1-12.png
     
  17. Fast Eddie B

    Fast Eddie B Well-Known Member

    I did a 1,600 mile round trip to Florida from N GA without charging enroute. HV all the way. Started with 44 EV miles estimated range, ended with 20.

    [​IMG]
     
  18. css28

    css28 Active Member

    Actually Hamtramck is saved in the new contract agreement, but too late to save the Volt. Truth be told, there just wasn't a sustainable profit to be made on the Volt once the tax credit expired.
     
    Mark W likes this.
  19. Ken7

    Ken7 Active Member

    We don’t operate the car that way, so I’m not sure. We always exhaust the battery first.
     
  20. Mark W

    Mark W Active Member

    Thanks. Helpful chart as electricity prices are really high here in CT. Two questions - 1) Does it take into account the difference between what we are charged out of the wall and what gets into the battery. 2) Are people really getting 45 mpg in HV mode in the real world? Thanks!
     

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