Germany should let BMW go bankrupt then give it to the workers!

Discussion in 'General' started by 101101, Jan 19, 2020.

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  1. 101101

    101101 Well-Known Member

    BMW should get some credit for being on the CA side of the CARB fight but that was just common sense.

    But it really does look like BMW is failing right now globally. Last year they announced their X3 saved them but admitted that they had the worst financial results in a decade and fired their CEO. They have a new guy he's doubling down on the same stupid strategy. It only took a 9% decline to bankrupt GM. Granted BMW was a much stronger firm in the down turn and weathered it, but you just don't see new BMWs in SoCal anymore and it can't fail SoCal and not fail everywhere else. It very clearly seems to be failing, its major competitor sold more cars primarily to is customers in the US with one model than it sold cars in the US. And again I don't see its X3 in SoCal which is the most competitive market within the most competitive market globally. MB has some of the same issue, lowest sales in a quarter century but at least MB isn't stupid or delusional about the transition to electrics being the source of the decline.

    If BMWs in progress bankruptcy isn't obvious to everyone at this point it can only be because of something like a quiet bailout by the German government. Presumably the German government wants to help the employees. But there is a better way. Let the firm go bankrupt but restrict the sale of its assets at fire sale values to its employees only. Let them take it private then have them convert it to a membership vice ownership basis. But strip away all the elements of slavery, no more investors or owners, no more board, no more executives, no more managers, no more supervisors, no more union, no more investing the firm's money in outside entities, strictly pay as you go all internally funded pensions, health care, insurance. Sure its a collective not a coop but the people who added all of BMWs value in the first place can run it with out all that extractive parasitic slavery bs added in- no bosses just get sht done in a fair manner, run it on friendship (not nepotism) and trust not: fear, coercion, lies and theft. Make sure the charter runs specifies it must run in the black and no outside borrowing. Also give this kind of entity a much more favorable tax status. Tax shouldn't encourage slavery. This arrangement will allow BMW to be as aggressive with automation as it needs to be and it will ensure the benefits accrue to the people who contribute to the organization and the public.

    The non contributing parasites in associated with he organization are responsible for its bankruptcy. They were paid off many times over long ago for their non contribution.
     
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  3. DaleL likes this.
  4. 101101

    101101 Well-Known Member

    See you didn't ready you just responded with shill type propaganda. I live in an area where I can see he difference. And we know BMW itself announced worst results in a decade (fired its CEO last year supposedly for that) and now its the same tripe all over again this year with X3 saved us and yet MB is said to be overtaking BMW and yet MB has recognized the worst results in 25 years. Like I said I never see new BMWs anymore car or suv in Southern California but I do see endless Model 3s and have noted that Telsa sold more Model 3 in the US last year than BMW sold cars and it sold them largely to people who were BMW customers or would have considered BMW, at the same time BMW cars dropped off sharply and are down 50% since 2014- or really more now it seems.
     
  5. Well, BMW is a luxury brand, so can't really compare it to M3 sales. Econ boxes always sell more. And depends where you live, too. BMWs sell better in affluent areas.

    Bottom line though, BMW is certainly not showing any signs of going bankrupt...LOL.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2020
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  6. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web Well-Known Member Subscriber

    Every company has the right to choose their path. I have my BMW i3-REx and keeping it until the wheels fall off. As for current BMW products, no interest.

    Bob Wilson
     
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  8. DaleL

    DaleL Active Member

    Yes, BMW did announce that the company's profit for 2019 was significantly less than in 2018. In the first 3 quarters of 2018, BMW made 5.7 billion Euros ($6.3 billion) versus 3.6 billion Euros ($4 billion) in 2019 after tax profit. In contrast, in the first 3 quarters of 2019, Tesla LOST almost 1 billion dollars. Tesla's high market cap (stock price) is due to potential growth, not the current financials. The bottom line is that BMW is not going bankrupt anytime soon.
     
  9. gooki

    gooki Well-Known Member

    3 more years at that rate.
     
  10. Pushmi-Pullyu

    Pushmi-Pullyu Well-Known Member

    Someone who apparently makes a hobby out of endlessly inventing conspiracy theories, or wildly inflating existing ones, isn't in any position to tell others what he can or can't see. Try to work on not seeing things which aren't there. You've got a long way to go in that regard.

    "And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye? ...first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye." -- Matthew 7:3-5 (King James version)

     
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  11. interestedinEV

    interestedinEV Well-Known Member

    We had a previous people on this board who predicted the imminent demise of Tesla. That is not going happen. Similarly, we have @101101 who is convinced that every ICE manufacture is dying if not already dead. That is not going to happen right away.

    However, over a period of time, as autonomous driving takes roots, the investment in the software may be prohibitive and we may end up with only a few manufacturers and there may be consolidation. However, that is still a long time in the future. Many of the current manufacturers may eventually die out. This sort of real life natural selection. The manufacturers who do not adapt, will die. This statement wrongly attributed to Darwin sums it up " It is not the strongest of the species that survives, but rather, that which is most adaptable to change."
     
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  13. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web Well-Known Member Subscriber

    "It is not necessary to change. Survival is not mandatory." W. Edward Deming​

    Bob Wilson
     
  14. Isn't that the truth with everything in life? The most unhappy people that I know are those that don't want to change/adapt to the realities of their world.
     
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  15. Pushmi-Pullyu

    Pushmi-Pullyu Well-Known Member

    I think that's the case for most if not all disruptive tech revolutions. The shakeup in the market due to the change allows new companies to enter the market during the disruptive period. But as things settle down again at the end of the revolution, there is consolidation and some of the competitors (perhaps both old and new) fail, leaving the field with just a few market leaders again. Some of the market leaders after things settle are familiar, and others are new companies, or (like Apple in the cellphone revolution) existing companies moving into a different market.

    An interesting question here is: How long will it take before things settle out again? Given the high capital expense necessary for building new auto assembly plants, or converting old ones, it may be 15 or possibly even 20 years before things settle out again. Some are even predicting as much as 50 years, but I don't think it can possibly take that long. Economic pressure can be quite fierce, once it really takes hold, and I think we're already seeing some early signs of that, with Ford and GM closing some of their factories.

     

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