Clunking Vibration type sound

You can see another shot of the motor and label from this Niro photo.

If any new owners have recently taken delivery, please check your cars so we can determine if/when Hyundai decides to start mass producing the newer motors.

 

If you want to convert the serial number on the motor label to a manufacturing date, here is the decoder from the Niro service manual. I assume it's the same pattern for the Kona. My new revision motor used for repair was made first week of November. Older revision motors were still being produced in December. That's the most recent motor manufacturing date I have on record.

 

Very sad and disappointed to read all this information, i just purchased the Kona EV in January and it only has 3,900 Km on it. Yesterday i noticed the new clicking sound at low speed that had not been there before. This was a very expensive vehicle for my family here in Canada, i thought i had researched it fully before convincing the family to purchase one. There was nothing in the many reviews I read about this issue, everyone raved about what a great vehicle it was. Now i have to go to the family and tell them, yeah we spent over $50 K on a vehicle with a major engine defect and we get to spend the next year trying to get the motor replaced, through the dealership - oh won’t that be fun.
They must have sold thousands of these things, i am surprised there isn’t a recall on them.



Sent from my iPad using Inside EVs

 

Typical media coverage. Just look at this one posted today: "Here's everything you need to know about the Hyundai Kona Electric.". Yeah right...

 

My local KIA dealer just got his first shipment of 2020 Niro EV. It was still wrapped in white shipping protection film when I stopped over to take a look. I immediately looked into the motor compartment to check to motor revision. To my surprise, it was still using the original E710 first generation motor. The manufacture date code on the motor barcode was 3rd week of March 2020. I really don't understand what KIA/Hyundai are doing. Here are the facts:

1) When the motor fails on a Kona or Niro, the manufacturer insists that it is replaced by a second generation motor (E701 on Kona, E711 on Niro). I even read of a case where the dealer received the first generation motor by mistake and was told to send it back and only install the second revision.

2) When motor failed on my Niro, I got the second generation E711 revision with a date code of 1st week November 2019. This means they have been building the second generation motors at least since that date, possibly longer.

3) 2020 models of Kona continue to develop motor failures as reported here and elsewhere so clearly recently built first generation motors can still fail. Not seen reports of motor failure on 2020 Niros but they only just started shipping with very few owners reporting.

4) Not a single owner of Kona or Niro that I've been able to find online has received a car with the second generation motor already installed at the factory.

Any thoughts on what's going on here? If they found some design fault on the original motor, why continue to build and install them at the factory? You would risk them failing in the field and having to spend $10K on parts/labor to replace them. Wouldn't it make more sense to switch all production to the new motor if they think that it would prevent these failures from occurring? It's not like they have a huge stockpile of old motors that they are trying to dispose of since the manufacture date codes on the first gen motors are recent.

 

They probably have a big stock of E710s and want to get rid of them in a
way that's still profitable, so installing them in new cars plays the odds
that *most* of them will be ok for the warranty periods. Kind of like 80%
of covid victims survive, or similarly callous thinking.

_H*

 

Or maybe the the E710 and the E711 are the same motor and the 1 is a tracking # designating the first replacement motor. That way than can track all of the replacement motors separately and see if any of them fail. I know If I was replacing motors I would want some way to track them.

 

Given that they've skipped 10 digits of a part number I'd guess that may apply to motors intended for spares inventory. They would be packaged for shipment individually by MOBIS (rather than in bulk) and may come with fasteners separately provided for those intended for the production line and perhaps with a packet of grease for the spline.
It just doesn't make logistic sense to alter the p/n due based on the non-conformance of some examples. Those would be rejected by tagging and returned for rework, all under the same p/n.
Here in NZ I've only heard of one eNiro with this issue out of perhaps a few dozen, while I've heard no reports among the approx 1,000 Konas.

 

There is no stockpile. The first revision motors were still being manufactured in late March 2020 and probably still are today. Check my previous comments regarding motor serial number decoding of date code.

How did you arrive at those stats. You personally know that many Kona and eNiro owners in NZ?

If you check any parts supplier online, they only allow ordering the E711 (E701 on Kona) and say that this new part number replaces E710 (E700 on Kona). Only new cars leaving the factory continue to use the older motor design. The motors are definitely not the same. Owners who spoke with their service techs after motor repairs said the flanges and bolts holding the gearbox to the motor are different - apparently reinforced to help with proper alignment. Unknown if there are any internal changes. Also a dealer was able to obtain E710 replacement motor but told to send it back and wait for E711 instead.

I tried to take photos of my motor before/after repair but it's almost impossible to see anything useful because it's covered by other components. I'll look at my old E711 photos again and compare to some of the salvage E710 photos I linked here earlier.

It just feels like we're all part of some science experiment or field trial to determine if these revised motors help or hurt the defect rates. Until results are in, they are continuing business as usual with the original design. That would also explain why there was no official TSB or recall for this issue until they have a final solution.

 

Also, regarding part numbering. Gearbox replacement has also been often used as first attempt to repair this defect. Yet the gearbox part number has remained unchanged. It's probably half the price of the motor but still very expensive, especially considering labor. In many of the non-english-speaking European forums they are now replacing both parts simultaneously, probably to save on future labor costs.

 

Yeah, I'm in the same boat. Mine started making the sound again, but quit now that our weather has warmed up. Maybe that's why BlueKona and others living in warmer climes haven't heard the sound yet, despite higher mileage.

 

Statistics is advanced enough now that personally knowing everyone in the sample group is no longer required.

 

Actually, we hit 31C here today, new record for this day. Supposed to get cooler through the week, so will see if the sound comes back. If it does, I better hustle it back to the dealer. Otherwise, might have to wait until next fall.

 

My 2020 Kona EV started to develop this noise at approximately 4000K. It is subtle and only really noticeable at 40 to 65 K per hour. However it is getting louder and more noticeable.
I took it to my Hyundai dealer and they had it for 4 hours, couple of test drives, up on the hoist, etc. They called Hyundai’s main office and spoke to an engineer, who advised them there have been some issues with engine replacement.
They tried to get a recording of the noise but it was to subtle to record. So, they returned the vehicle to me and said yes they could hear a faint noise with the stethoscope, but it was not loud enough to record and send to Hyundai. They want me to drive the car and put some more miles on until the noise gets louder and then bring it back so they can get a recording.
Overall they took my concern seriously and spent hours going over the vehicle, called Hyundai twice for advise. I was impressed with their attitude and service.
The sound is subtle and really only audible between 40 - 70 K, so i will put more miles on until it gets NOISY!!


Sent from my iPad using Inside EVs

 

That sounds different. My sound is only at low speeds, about 20 kph and less. No noise at all at higher speeds. Still intermittent though, since my gearbox replacement. and with the warmer weather, even more intermittent.

 

At higher speeds the low-speed tapping noise usually turns into a purring type sound. It doesn't really go away, just changes frequency. If you've been driving with the defect for a long time, you may not even realize what a properly working motor should sound like at high speed. I was shocked at the difference after my motor replacement. All I hear on the highway now is wind and road noise.

 

This is correct. The sound doesn’t go away, just changes frequency. I liken it to the sound of a muffler starting to go bad, just not as loud.