2019 Kona EV Motor Noise Issue

Simply by looking at the condition of the oil. Oil laden with metal particles and/or a black appearance is abnormal for any gearbox at low kms. We have been seeing virtually 100% like that.

 

Oh, I see what you're saying: it's more of an early diagnostic test than a preventative measure.

 

Well, over the last six months, every Kona of about 20 examples has shown dirty oil on the first oil change and all of the four oil analyses have indicated very high levels of iron and aluminium. The diagnosis is done as far as I'm concerned, the conclusion being that there's a problem in that particles are not being properly sequestered by the small magnet installed in the gearbox casing. My latest check on my own car seems to suggest that the problem can be brought under control after the break-in period.

I'm actually taking a leap in suggesting that changing the oil early could be a preventative measure to reduce the risk of acquiring the tapping noise, coincidentally the very item you've tolerated for some time and are now having repaired. The high aluminum content found backs that theory up.

You now have a new opportunity to address this early, if you choose to.

 

I don't know much about this stuff. Are the offending particles suspended in the oil and thus are removed during the oil change? I remember a video where the gearbox was opened up and there was a ton of metallic sludge in it. Would you need to have the gearbox opened up to have it removed or was that example a far gone case? I'm curious about your thinking.

 

I love debates where layman's common sense challenges engineering theory. No offence to anyone on this forum, but it does make me wonder how these cars are designed and tested. Is it really that difficult given the vast knowledge and experience base over the past century?

 

If this theory is all true (build up of metallic particles in oil), why doesn't HYUNDAI issue a RECALL to have the oil swapped out? To just wait until a major issue develops and then replace expensive parts under Warranty seems counter productive... I do have to wonder what has changed in the replacement Reduction Gear component that stops this from occurring in the first place. or should I expect the issue just to occur again in 2 years, post Warranty??

 

It does make you wonder a bit. And, FYI, not sure where you are but in Canada, beyond the general warranty, there's an 8 year battery and drivetrain warranty too. So your coverage might well cover TWO replacements. God forbid!

 

In USA here. Yea, I really don't want to go thru this again. :-(

 

Particles that have not been sequestered by the internal magnet will mostly drain out with the oil because it takes a while for them to settle out.

100% of 20+ Kona owners have pulled out factory oil with particles present and in many cases discoloured black, both concerning issues because it means that particles are not being sequestered before being crushed to dust. Hardened steel particles will get momentarily hot in a microscopic sense when pounded by gears and bearings, hence the blackness and loss of magnetic attraction. We have four analyses indicating the oil contains high levels of iron and aluminium, further evidence that wear particles are not being sequestered properly (because particles over a certain size would not be included in the measured values).

Particles that have stuck to the internal magnet are out of the picture and won't cause a problem so there's no reason to open the gearbox. That failed Russian gearbox had catastrophic levels of particles generated as it was failing. It's not a good example as to what happens normally.

If anyone drained their engine oil and found it looking as we are finding our gear oil they would be concerned. Note that engines have the benefit of an oil filter.

Lol, that's the story of my life! As they say, "is this a hill you're willing to die on?" Sometimes it's best just to let nature takes its course but I'm willing to spend a bit of time trying to help fellow owners of the same car.
Had I even suspected Hyundai may have not done their best I would have changed my oil years ago. And I don't know that Hyundai would consider this a mistake because a very high percentage carry on without the owner needing to visit the dealer. The service life of a car is very short compared with industrial gearbox applications that run 24/7. Gearboxes are inherently tough and can chew metal for a while and survive, at the expense of noisy bearings. Most Konas will survive but its seems a few don't. I want to own one of the cars that survives and preferably drives quietly. I suspect others may as well.

I did the maths in the other thread some time ago and it's seemed to be far cheaper for Hyundai to replace gearboxes than do a recall. These are not expensive parts compared to the motor and battery. I did email the importer long ago but they didn't respond further.

There's no evidence one way or the other that anything has changed. When someone does an early first oil change and finds the oil relatively clean then we'll have something to work with. We need to have evidence to draw conclusions.

You would think that doing an oil change might be a good idea if that's the case. People did this cars in long ago, an early oil change to get the machining debris out. Car engines now have oil filters and this gearbox doesn't.

 

I bought a new pressure washer (Canadian Tire sale) this spring. There was a tag on it that said, change your oil after first 20 hours, among other things. So when we finished at home and the lake (about 10 hours) I changed it. I was shocked how black and dirty it was with grey streaks in it as it ran out. What, don't they take any care in assembling these things anymore?? My old pressure washer, as well as my lawn mower still have original oil in them, after 10 years (I'm lazy), and they are a bit dark, but nothing like this.

 

There's bound to be an element of planned obsolescence in the newer products. The company that made your old lawn mower is wondering if his product was too good and that's why you haven't bought another. There is huge pressure (no pun intended) for manufacturers to cut costs to the bone.

 

If it was due to planned obsolesence, they would simply put no tag regarding first oil change.

 

Do you hear that? Me neither!!!

It's fixed. Picked it up today and drove it 120km on the highway back home. Zero noise driving. Zero noise regenerating. I've been bathing in noises for so long that I literally have no memory of the car ever having been this quiet. In fact, I actually had some difficulty moderating my speed both up and down because (apparently) I had grown so accustomed to the noises that I was conditioned to the audio cues regarding speed. But I will happily adjust.

Mechanic said he had never heard a car that was so noisy. Always something you want to hear! Installation was faster than they'd anticipated. The invoice shows that all the required bits were swapped and that they did a before and after test drive. I'm very happy with my all new (almost literally) car.

I will strongly consider an oil change in the Fall during my seasonal tire swap after I've got a couple thousand more kilometres on the clock. I really want this feeling to last this time.

 

So, there's hope yet, good to hear!
But I'd be remiss if I didn't mention that the ideal time to throw in a magnetic drain plug (at the fill position, avoiding having to drain the oil) is now not later.

 

I'm not a DIY guy but do you have any specs on such a plug? And are you saying it goes in the "fill" hole rather than the drain hole? Again, if it's not a real travail I might have someone do it for me.

 

The plug many of us are using is the Votex DP007 M18-1.5 x 15. Torque to just under 30 ft-lbs. It can go in the filler initially so there's no need to drain the oil. You raise the car on the left side only (or use a lift), remove the plastic cover and just replace the existing plug. No mess, no fuss.

At 2,000 km or later when you change the oil, you would place it in the drain opening instead where it would be slightly more effective.

 

Thanks but...

And the price?! For a little plug? Yeesh.

 

When I go to Kiwi's plug link I do not get the warning. Not only that, I have installed two of them in my 2021 Kona EV, one in the fill port and one in the drain. I am sure there is no difference in the plug threads between 2019 and 2021 models because the plugs worked for Kiwi on his earlier model. They spun up on mine with fingers so the threads are right and were tightened with a torque wrench to specs. IE, they DO fit. I don't know what your Amazon page's warning is on about. Probably some frigging' lawyer has got involved and made Amazon do a disclaimer. A pox on all their houses, creating fake misery so they can feed off it like the carrion eaters they are.