Interesting comparison between SE and Tesla Model 3 Performance

A coworker has a M3P and he let me drive it. It is a nice car and the power makes it fun car to blast around in. The range is obviously much better than the SE and with the 4 doors, it is a much more practical car than the SE.

But, I was not looking for range and practicality, I was looking for a 2-door fun car that was electric. I had a 2019 Cooper S that was slightly modified and I loved it. When I saw that Mini was coming with an electric version, I following it closely. When I saw the production version, I was not thrilled with the grill (no offense to you 2021 and earlier car owners). After seeing the LCI version in 2022, I was hooked but still loved my 2019 Cooper S. After seeing all of the new info on the Great Wall Motors cars, I quickly ordered a 2023 knowing it was coming from Oxford. Even though the Mini design from Great Wall will most likely trump the Oxford Mini in range and possibly even power, the Oxford F56 has an established aftermarket since most accessories carry over from the ICE cars and things like suspension can be sourced for our heavier SE's (KW and ST).

After owning my 2023 for a month now, I have to agree with Insightman, it is the best car I have ever owned too. It's not the fastest, not the highest in tech, and definitely not the most practical but it is the best 2-door fun car around that is insanely cheap to operate. I put over 1300 miles on it in the month I have had it and do not hesitate to drive it anytime I need to go somewhere (except on road trips).

 

That's like comparing supermarket sliced WONDER bread to English muffin. One is a perfectly smooth with the highest crumb to crust ratio in the world, while the other is just some lumpy hand torn circular pedestal for eggs Benedict.

 

Disclaimer: Far be it from me to tell anyone which car they should choose, or that one car is better than another, the Reddit poster should absolutely get whatever he decides is best...

I'm with you.

When I leased the M3P, it was with the full knowledge that for the first time, as an enthusiast driver, I was getting a car I would treat as an appliance. Yep, the ridiculous acceleration is fun and never got old (for me). The quality was iffy, but in the 2.5 years I had it, it never let me down. Handling was competent, but steering and handling were, let's say clinical, effective enough but unexciting - actually the steering was dead, but did in fact actually steer the car. Yep, it has good range (**) and fast charging, once I saw a supercharger add 33% SOC back into the battery in 9 minutes.

Up to even about 6 months ago, I intended to replace it with another M3P when the lease ended late this year. But then I started to think about it more, and the quality issues - which seem to be ongoing, concerned me, among other things. I'd started to think about what we needed out of the car occupying that spot in our garage. Only once had the M3P been used for a road trip, and only on that trip had any drive exceeded the SE's range. There are 3 in our family + a dog, but we rarely go anywhere all that far all together (certainly since early 2020). During this process we also decided to preorder a Rivian R1T (only 2 weeks before the price rise), but were fully aware of the likely delivery timeframe.

So in thinking about an "interim" car, I straight away thought of the SE, which came out after we got the M3P. Started researching it and discovered the same thing about the 2024 and beyond cars. Also discovered I could terminate the M3P lease early with no penalty. So, I also quickly ordered an SE - spoiler alert, not going to be an interim car any more!

I've been fortunate - especially since we moved from the colonies to the U.S. - to own and drive some very nice, engaging and fun cars - and cars that are just too expensive in the colonies. But I said to my wife the other day, I think the SE is the most fun car I've owned too. She asked me what about the Rex's (WRX's), I had an MY99 and an MY03, both manuals - I said the SE is way more fun. I'm blown away with how much fun it is to drive, yet it's still built well, is quiet and great value. On that point, in terms of purchase price - even without factoring in the tax credits - it's the lowest number since my brand new 1993 Civic Si.

For my needs the SE has enough range (and unlike what some reviewers almost seem to think, it's not like when it's out of charge it self-destructs, it can be recharged!), enough practicality and enough tech (1st experience with CarPlay). Part of the huge fun factor I am enjoying I think is it takes me back to hot hatches I've had before, except now with added instant torque.

** On range: I think Tesla clearly did some extensive market research early on and from this realized the critical component was an extensive, fast, reliable and easy to use charging network. I suspect that this research also showed the magic range number, where people would be comfortable purchasing an EV was around the 300 mile mark. Tesla have understandably pushed this hard ever since, making it the defacto benchmark, and setting consumer expectations that this is the range they need and must have. Now, I fully understand that there are a lot of people that *need* a 300 mile range - but also equally anyone who feels they *want* a 300 mile is fully entitled to have it! However for most people, most of the time, they don't - I'd rather fly (hmmm, perhaps not currently) or rent something on those rare occasions if the situation made regularly stopping to recharge the SE impractical (or annoying) for a particular trip. As @insightman has said, I'm thrilled that the Mini/BMW decided the SE would have a lower than average range (though yes limited by packaging considerations of the F56 chassis), but on the other hand isn't suffering the weight penalty of carrying around a heavier battery pack for range I don't need, and therefore is always much more fun to drive as a result. But I don't see any other manufacturers making that same choice, given the "Tesla effect" of perceived minimum "acceptable" range requirements - with the possible exception of a specific model in the range of the EV replacement for the 718 Boxster/Caymans.

Hmmm, this ended up longer than I expected. As one of my favorite t-shirts says, "Straights are for fast cars...Corners are for fast drivers".

 

I've owned Model 3 and now own Model Y. I have driven Model S for a month before; didn't like Model S for some reason - just too big and doesn't feel as agile as Model 3 IMHO. Although I really like Model Y what it offers; but I just love to drive mini SE. I find SE more fun to drive, smaller, nimble and more agile, cornering is fun, feels far more planted than Model Y for sure.

Model Y offers space and speed _ we take model Y when we are travelling long distances i.e. highway driving/need charging etc,. But I absolutely prefer to drive mini over Model Y around town. I just like the quirky design, smaller footprint and sports drive mode in it. I also like mini's seating and steering feel along with road feel as it absorbs it way better than Model Y.

 

Update on the original reddit poster and his Turo experience.

"I’m currently renting an Mk.8 GTI Autobahn DSG for test drive. It’s one of the most popular and well reviewed hot hatches for ICE enthusiasts.

The exhaust is muted, boomy, and farty, acceleration is OK, driving dynamics are sluggish, imbalanced, and under steering. Auto shifting is sluggish, “manual” up shifts are sluggish, but manual downshift is quick.

Coming from a Mini Cooper SE (electric), I think the move toward EV is going to blow hot hatch enthusiasts away. Even though the SE is non enthusiast trim, it makes the GTI feel mind numbingly boring.

Battery regen strength is increased in Sport mod, which will oversteer the car slightly on turn in. It’s down on power, but feels much faster and enthusiastic everywhere except full throttle highway pull. Really highlights the weakness of ICE."​

 

Here's my comparison from a while back:

https://www.insideevsforum.com/community/index.php?threads/why-not-a-cooper-s.11881/page-3#post-145019